Upgrade to Fibre, or Wait for FTTP?

wolfie138

wolfie138

wolfie138

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Just spent about an hour on the phone w/ TalkTalk. before the torches and pitchforks come out, i'll just say i've been w/ them/Tiscali/whatever for decades and i personally have had very little issues, none major.
i'm still on a crappy 3Mbs [if that!] broadband, and today i started getting a wad of dropouts - all my router lights were green apart from the Internet one. Did a router reboot initially, called TT and they did a line check etc etc, short version is they agreed theissue was at their end, but during the call they tried to offer me Fibre65 for faster [obviously] more stable connection. I'm dithering, because it's actually only a quid or two more than i pay now - i THINK; the Indian people aren't the best describing things and i got a bit lost as they seemed to contadict some of the points about line rentals and UK calls.

so firstly, are the connections more stable that a normal crappy BB? OR is that a marketing lure since i was complaining about dropouts?
secondly, since it's fibre to the cabinet, and a 24month contract, would there be any mileage waiting for FTTP instead? I've been told CityFibre are doing our area, but no idea when; the newsletter suggested it was fairly soon but they aren't admitting that on any website!

TIA
 
I was on a 1Mb ADSL connection that wasn't the most stable as the exchange was about 3km away straight line, FTTP is never going to happen in my life time probabbly as we are pretty much out in the sticks. 18 months ago we had an FTTC cabinet put about a mile up the road, and currently sync at 50Mbps download and 10 Mbps upload. you could look https://www.broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com/#/ADSL which would give you and idea of what you could expect speed wise on your line.
 
There's no point waiting. If Cityfibre come along then TalkTalk will offer a service on that network and you can just upgrade in contract, but if they haven't even started digging yet then it's going to be at least two years before you're ready to connect anyway.
 
thanks for the replies so far. @chrisd ~ yeah, lol, i meant should i just bite the bullet and go fibre or would it be worth holding off for FTTP.
i shouldn't be lured in by the tactic - hey, your issue is a problem at our end but would you like to pay more money instead..? - but like i say the money increase seemed to provide a much better service.

@Shoeyuk ~ yeah, the CityFibre sounds good but they're moving like snails and covid isn't helping.

i suppose the simple answer is to try FTTC and by the time the contract expires the area will be FTTP'd and i can rethink then if i need to. so now i need to consider which one - like i say, TT have been okay over the years for me despite all the review websites slating them. i hear Plusnet seem to be the best to go for, if fo no other reason than they have UK-based helplines. NOt to appear prejudiced but every India-based "help" centre i've had to deal w/ has been a chore at best, and a hair-pulling nightmare at worst.
 
Plusnet don't have any type of FTTP product in their line up, so you'd be waiting for the contract to expire or buying it out in the event that an FTTP provider did arrive on your street.

TalkTalk are a very good option in this regard, since they offer Openreach FTTP as well as CityFibre. Zen do the same but they aren't the best option if you're price sensitive.

You can use the TalkTalk community forums if you need help with technical issues beyond reporting that a service is down, people report much better support from the team that look after that.
 
Id go for FTTC for now and hope CityFibre get there FTTP up and going by the time your next out of contact. I havn't shopped around for ISP's for a while didnt realise there tying you into two year contracts, all of mine have been for 12 months, seen a few at 18 months.
 
MissChief said:
FTTP>G.fast>FTTC>ADSL. Always be as far to the left of that list as possible.

Did they give you a speed estimate on your phone call OP?
Click to expand...
yeah, sameish estimate as @Shoeyuk's link - i'm currenly on max of 3Mbs ADSL, line can go up to about 65, which is what a couple of the places have quoted. i don't game or do mega downloads, so the 3mps has basically been fine for me. even Netflix is happy enough, though oddly there are a couple of Amazon Prime films that just flatly will not do anything but give me an "insufficient bandwidth" message on the TV even though it will play fine on the computer, using the same wifi :-/
for that reason i've never really looked into upgrading, but having a think after yester, a 10% price increase for a 2000% speed increase would seem like a no-brainer; would certainly take the pain out of these 3gig Win10 updates :-D
it was mostly the stability thing that i was wondering about. like i said my line has been pretty solid, but my brain's a **** for chewing on something and causing a fret once something trips up.

been having a browse, as per usual every ISP you google it seems comes up w/ alternating responses going "don't touch these scum!!!" and "awesome, best ever." About the only one that seems to be getting really positive is AAISP, who i'd not heard of. At the mo, i think it would come down to TalkTalk and BT. BT are a bit more expensive by a quid or two, unless i can find a new customer offer, but the review websites seem to say they're getting better at customer service, which is a bit TT are failing on. of course, if the line is solid and reliable, i wouldn't need to call them anyway.
 
I know a few people who have used AAISP and say there expensive but when they have issues they are very good and are not fobbed off by open reach, i have been using Zen for the last 3 years and am very happy. They are also a little more expensive then the rest but i get a static ip address which is very useful for me.
 
wolfie138 said:
Just spent about an hour on the phone w/ TalkTalk. before the torches and pitchforks come out, i'll just say i've been w/ them/Tiscali/whatever for decades and i personally have had very little issues, none major.
i'm still on a crappy 3Mbs [if that!] broadband, and today i started getting a wad of dropouts - all my router lights were green apart from the Internet one. Did a router reboot initially, called TT and they did a line check etc etc, short version is they agreed theissue was at their end, but during the call they tried to offer me Fibre65 for faster [obviously] more stable connection. I'm dithering, because it's actually only a quid or two more than i pay now - i THINK; the Indian people aren't the best describing things and i got a bit lost as they seemed to contadict some of the points about line rentals and UK calls.

so firstly, are the connections more stable that a normal crappy BB? OR is that a marketing lure since i was complaining about dropouts?
secondly, since it's fibre to the cabinet, and a 24month contract, would there be any mileage waiting for FTTP instead? I've been told CityFibre are doing our area, but no idea when; the newsletter suggested it was fairly soon but they aren't admitting that on any website!

TIA
Click to expand...

Talktalk CS are absolutely useless.
I would be reluctant to sign any 24 month contract given the situation you are in. Although you can undoubtedly get better Customer Services, it may or may not result in you getting better broadband! I would look for something with a lesser contract time. 1 year is not so badbut 2 is sucky.
 
AAISP are expensive because they hire proper Network technicians or Engineers to man their lines and they're paid accordingly. I also believe they have a higher care level with Openreach for faster response times to faults and will often talk to the engineer if no fault is found on their initial testing rather than just having the raised fault closed.

The care levels are here: Openreach UK Raises Price of Highest Maintenance Level 4 - ISPreview UK

Level 1
Clear by 23.59 day after next, Monday to Friday, excluding Public and Bank Holidays. For example, report Tuesday, clear Thursday.

Level 2
Clear by 23.59 next day, Monday to Saturday, excluding Public and Bank Holidays. For example, report Tuesday, clear Wednesday.

Level 3
Report 13.00, clear by 23.59 same day. Report after 13.00 clear by 12.59 next day, seven days a week, including Public and Bank Holiday.

Level 4
Clear within 6 hours, any time of day, any day of the year.

Most ISP's have cheaped out on ADSL and are in care level 1. Level 3 used to be just over £1 extra per year for level 3 over level 2, but when you have 5-6 million customers that's £5m per year for very little in perceived difference to repair and response times for most customers.

Apparently level 2 is included by default on FTTC connections which I didn't know, I thought an ISP was free to choose.

There's more info here: Pricing manager (openreach.co.uk)
 
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I think the best plan would be to get FTTC from an ISP you intend to get FTTP from. Because most of them allow you to break your FTTC contract without penalty if you're upgrading to one of their FTTP packages.
 
I would assume that TalkTalk, Vodafone and Zen would be quite happy to have you upgrade to CityFibre FTTP from Openreach FTTC and re-sign a contract

Openreach FTTC and telephone lines are only on a one month term with Openreach now, so there's no loss to them that comes with letting you upgrade.
 
wolfie138 said:
Just spent about an hour on the phone w/ TalkTalk. before the torches and pitchforks come out, i'll just say i've been w/ them/Tiscali/whatever for decades and i personally have had very little issues, none major.
i'm still on a crappy 3Mbs [if that!] broadband, and today i started getting a wad of dropouts - all my router lights were green apart from the Internet one. Did a router reboot initially, called TT and they did a line check etc etc, short version is they agreed theissue was at their end, but during the call they tried to offer me Fibre65 for faster [obviously] more stable connection. I'm dithering, because it's actually only a quid or two more than i pay now - i THINK; the Indian people aren't the best describing things and i got a bit lost as they seemed to contadict some of the points about line rentals and UK calls.

so firstly, are the connections more stable that a normal crappy BB? OR is that a marketing lure since i was complaining about dropouts?
secondly, since it's fibre to the cabinet, and a 24month contract, would there be any mileage waiting for FTTP instead? I've been told CityFibre are doing our area, but no idea when; the newsletter suggested it was fairly soon but they aren't admitting that on any website!

TIA
Click to expand...

Have worked for BT for 8 years, and deal with Faults on a daily basis. Then the simple answer is yes FTTC will be better than copper in general terms.

The noticeable difference will depend if currently on the very old 20C(Max 8Mbps DSL circuits) or the 21C(Max 24Mbps ADSL Circuits). The majority of faults can be between the DSLAM(Green Cabinets) and the home and not the core network, so upgrading is NOT guaranteed to improve things if there a hard fault on the copper part of the network.

If its only a few quid more then do the upgrade.


The Care level mention are applicable to the PSTN(Landline service only) not for broadband. Also its rare for a non business provider to even offer the option of a different care level as the standard consumer doesn't care or wants "as cheap as possible" however, that mentality is slowly changing as with COVID its show a lto of family how important paying for a good service is (Home schooling/ work from home etc)

Also remember there are more than 400 ISP in the UK, do some research on how many are actually "investing in the Uk infrastructure" to make the services better rather than lining their CEO's pockets, but yet these ones are the one that slate the companies that are actually investing. Old article but still very true https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.p...joint-uk-campaign-oppose-openreach-split.html

So like yourself and anyone else with **** internet, if you are with a provider that doesnt invest in existing networks and isn't willing to spend the Billions building their own, don't complaint that you are getting any better than what you have.
 
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