Way too loud!

Tommy B

Tommy B

Tommy B

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I just read this review on a competitor's website and it got me thinking.

The songs on this debut album are not that bad sounding like a cross between Keane and Coldplay,but there is one major fault that ruins it for me.

The record level has been set way too high!
Even by the already too high levels of modern standards this album has been well over recorded.(Interestingly Keanes Under The Iron Sea is also too loud)And even when compensating with the volume control the sound still retains a certain "loud" quality in much the same way as an over recorded cassette tape use to if you didnt play proper attention to the VU meter and the peaks went well into the red.

I think record producers think we all own ghetto blasters or similar and boost up the levels to make their albums sound loud and impressive,but some of us listen to our music through expensive hi-fi systems and we want quality recordings that such systems demand.Not distorted over blown rubbish!

So,this album is now going to gather dust in my rack which is a shame as otherwise it`s not bad and as I live near Bournemouth where Air Traffic are from I wanted to like it and support a local band.

Only buy if you own any form of music playback system other than proper hi-fi.
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I completely agree with him. Is anyone else fed up of awful quality recordings. I for one only buy CDs as I want a high quality source to play on my Hi-Fi and rip to lossless on my PC. However, I'm finding myself increasingly dissapointed by awful recording jobs of modern record labels. If I were going for a demo in a Hi-Fi shop there's no way in a million years I'd take any album released in the last few years.

The other thing they do is digitally process the recordings. The latest White Stripes album was ruined by digital distortion. I like my music to sound raw and pure, not processed and ruined. Kings Of Leon's last album was an example of a well recorded album. The bass guitar sounds absolutely awesome on my Hi-Fi.

Anyone else agree or am I being ridiculous :D
 
Tracks that are mastered so loudly it clips or that are over compressed just sound awful. I think it's pretty shameful really that they can get away with it. Music certainly sounds better loud, in fact i think a study proved it but i think someone should tell the people that engineer these tracks that we do actually have volume controls on our sound systems!!!
 
It is quite well known that boosting the mastering compression/limitation at the final stages will make a cd "punchier" but also tiring to listen to for any length of time. This is what the person in the quote is getting at: the cd has been mastered and over-compressed so all the dynamic range has been lost.

This is even worse for songs that are played on the radio, in which yet another level of compression has been added to make the most of the limited rf bandwidth.

This is a common issue that people are starting to have with the music industry. Cd's are now being designed to be listened to in the car, or on the dancefloor so they have to get above the background noise, but those of us who want to listen to an album for its own merit are losing out. This effect only happens with cd's, though the irony is that vinyl has a lower dynamic range anyway so with the introduction of cd's, people were saying that they could hold a much larger dynamic range. Initially this was the case but lately it has gone to pot...

So thats compression on input to the recorder, compression to help seat it in the mix, compression on busses etc. to get the instruments balanced, a master compression of the whole mix, then limiting to stop it peaking. Finally finish it off with a load of mastering compression and radio broadcast compression. You have to start wondering where the dynamic range has wandered off to in the end,

Why don't we name some particularly notable mentions:

RHCP: Californication - the classic example of bad mastering, it actually clips(!) during tracks
Audioslave: Audioslave - as much as i like the guys themselves, and Rick Rubin, the mastering engineer should be shot
QOTSA: Songs for the deaf - again love the album but pretty poor mastering

In contrast some good albums:

Pink Floyd: Dark side of the moon - pretty much the perfect album in every way
Tool: Lateralus - bucking the trend by being a modern rock album with attention paid to the mastering

Discuss...
 
Ah, the loudness war, whereby the real appreciators of music - i.e. those who care enough to invest in serious reference Hi-Fi - are the ones who lose out.

It's very annoying, isn't it?

I've got numerous victims of over-compression in my album collection, some that I really can't listen to because of the aural fatigue that it brings on [the brain isn't configured to listen to persistent tiny-dynamic-range noise, apparently].

Pretty much everything by The White Stripes, Sleater-Kinney [producer Dave Fridmann is gaining quite the rep for this particular trick], System Of A Down, Maximo Park... it's a depressingly long list.

It's worth pointing out, though, that it's not uniquely the work of the record producers; mastering engineers get put under a lot of pressure to do this from record label execs and their "louder=better=more lucrative" philosophy.

As the great rock prophet once said, "Everything louder than everything else..."

There's some more audiophile grumblings on the subject here , and a nice YouTube-flavoured demonstration here.
 
Mindriot said:
[...]RHCP: Californication - the classic example of bad mastering, it actually clips(!) during tracks[...]
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Classic mastering atrocity indeed :(

I know that the record label were petitioned to release a less idiotically-compressed version, and I seem to recall there is one floating around somewhere [or maybe it was remastered unannounced?].
 
Obviously I don't have as much of a problem with danec/trance music because I listen to that extremely loud. What annoys me is when you buy a CD by someone like Damien Rice (which makes great gentle/background play) completely destroyed by poor mastering. (Edit: artists "like" Damien Rice, both his albums actually seem quite good to me :D)

simisker, that is an excellent youtube video. Thanks for sharing.

The depressing fact remains, that in this era of iPods and god-awful chart music (designed to be played loud) the problem will most likely only get worse :( Especially when more and more people are buying their music digitally and couldn't care less about quality. It's irnoic that one would expect sound quality to get better over time, not worse :rolleyes:

I think I'll keep the Stranglers's old recordings when I go for demos in Hi-Fi shops in the future.
 
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Is there a website that names and shames the record companies mainly responsible for doing this? Or alternatively the ones who I can rely on (in the future) to purchase my CDs from in good quality.
 
Californication would be one of my favourite albums if the mastering was better, it genuinely ruins it. Surprising since Blood Sugar Sex Magik is one of my favourite albums for production and John Frusciante goes on and on about audio quality (probably the reason for the separately mastered vinyl version of Stadium Arcadium).
 
I hate this trend too, its very noticeable in hip hop/rap. Compare modern commercial releases which are engineered to provide an aural onslaught from the first second to A Tribe Called Quest's 'The Low End Theory', where the jazz elements and the drumming have plenty of room to breathe, providing a natural ambience.

One solution is to avoid any CD that is remastered, the originals are often far superior.
 
Its frustrating that record producers don't aspire to higher production values. I'm guessing that many of them must have crap systems or damaged hearing!
 
Tommy B said:
What annoys me is when you buy a CD by someone like Damien Rice (which makes great gentle/background play) completely destroyed by poor mastering.
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I know what you mean - it's not so noticeable on 9, but on 0 some of the recording is destinctly "garage" quality. I think it doesn't really detract from the album though as it makes it sound slightly more raw - I think a perfectly polished Damien Rice album would sound strange. He sounds better with a bit of crackle and distortion on the record I think :)
 
Dave said:
I know what you mean - it's not so noticeable on 9, but on 0 some of the recording is destinctly "garage" quality. I think it doesn't really detract from the album though as it makes it sound slightly more raw - I think a perfectly polished Damien Rice album would sound strange. He sounds better with a bit of crackle and distortion on the record I think :)
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I'll admit that was a bad example as both albums seem OK on my Hi-Fi. What I mean is artists like Damien Rice (gentle music) whoose albums are ruined because of the poor mastering. I do think there is a good dynamic range on O though. "I remember" is really gentle and quiet, and then he starts screaming and it's so loud it makes you jump.

edit - OK, I'll take that original comment back. I've just given O another listen and the quality (ripped to lossless from CD) is pretty awesome.
 
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Triad2000 said:
Anyone notice that the latest Iron Maiden album wasn't compressed? It sounds very raw, and very good.
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Thats cause they wanted to keep it unmastered so it sounded just like it does when they played it live in the rehersal studio.

I don't have a decent stereo system, but I can noticed when albums are mastered louder than others, that makes sense?
 
O is a well mastered album imo. i still think the absolute best (mainstream) ive heard is metallica's black album, i really cant fault it. there are many many examples of poor albums. i remember a corrs album getting a slating because it was so compressed. the latest white striped album is pretty terrible, as said. RHCP's are guilty of it, metallica's St.Anger. Christ that's the worst thing ive ever heard.
 
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james.miller said:
O is a well mastered album imo. i still think the absolute best (mainstream) ive heard is metallica's black album, i really cant fault it. there are many many examples of poor albums. i remember a corrs album getting a slating because it was so compressed. the latest white striped album is pretty terrible, as said. RHCP's are guilty of it, metallica's St.Anger. Christ that's the worst thing ive ever heard.
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As an enormous fan of The White Stripes, what I find most upsetting is Jack White used to go on and on about how he wanted his albums to sound raw and natural. Elephant apparently had no computers involved in the recording. The new album though is just awful.

How the hell can those record label CEOs just sit there and carelessly ruin their releases in such a manner?

According to someone on the Hydrogenaudio forums, the DVD-A releases of Porcupine Tree's albums are much better masters. Can anyone confirm this?
 
Tommy B said:
How the hell can those record label CEOs just sit there and carelessly ruin their releases in such a manner?
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Probably because most people that buy the top selling albums aren't audiophiles, so they don't notice/care if the album sounds really compressed or crackles at really high volumes. Ignorance is bliss, as they say.
 
james.miller said:
metallica's sound butchery: how they can go from this to this i just dont know.
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Lars clearly thought the trash can sound was the way to go. It's quite funny that they decided to make a nu metal album nu metal was all but dead. St Anger may be one of the worst albums of this decade.
 
Stadium Arcadium is a victim to the loudness wars. Well almost any band really heres a decent article about it:


http://www.stylusmagazine.com/articles/weekly_article/imperfect-sound-forever.htm

Probably because most people that buy the top selling albums aren't audiophiles, so they don't notice/care if the album sounds really compressed or crackles at really high volumes. Ignorance is bliss, as they say.
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Hit the nail on the head there, People just don't care about it as long as they can play it on their ipod's. Itunes is an example with their really low bitrate songs, i wouldn't pay for that rubbish. Personally it is destroying the music.
 
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