WestMids - Stop and Search + survey

[Burnsy2023]

So West Midlands Police are looking for feedback on the below stop and search encounter.

I'd be interested to know what people think, stop and search is emotive.

Some details from the YouTube description:

We’re listening to people in Birmingham who have been stopped and searched by our officers as we strive to improve the use of our powers. Stop and search is a very important tool available to officers and has a role to play in our wider work tackling violent crime and make communities safer.

***Let us know your views on this stop and search - complete our quick survey here.***
https://westmidlandspolicepnn.researchfeedback.net/s.asp?k=159905454804

However, we understand being searched by a police officer could be a very uncomfortable experience. We recently hosted an event in which people who’ve previously been stopped on the streets of Birmingham were invited to tell us about the experience. Their feedback will be used as part of our police officer training programme and continual development in our use of stop and search powers.

This video shows a stop and search of a man by our officers who were called to the scene of a robbery on a Birmingham canal towpath. We'd been told by the victim that the offender was wearing a black jacket, had a beard and was of Asian appearance.

We stress to our officers the importance that the person being searched understands why they've been stopped, that they are listened to and speak to the person fairly and with respect. We won't always get it right. But we are striving to get better - and hearing your views is crucial for us to improve our service.

 

[Burnsy2023]

They want to listen to people, not trolls

#EqualRightsForOgres

 

[Burnsy2023]

What type of feedback are the expecting from sharing this video? As intentions are currently being interpreted, and not favourably.

I'm not expecting any feedback, just sharing what WestMids have put out. I'm just interested in how people perceive the interactions. It shows a lot of misconceptions over how the police operate and what information they have to act on.

Often the 'matched description' is a load of old toot though.

"Youth, dark skin, medium build" = lets bother minorities all afternoon. It's one way to do policing.

If the public give us better descriptions, then we'll have more to work with, but ultimately it's more often than not the public giving us these limited details.

 

[Burnsy2023]

I'm not sure it's as simple as police, robot-like, perfectly executing on limited information. Stereotypes and gut-feel play their part, and are all vectors for bias.

I don't doubt that there is racial bias, conscious or otherwise, but descriptions as limited as in the video are common in initial reports.

 

[Burnsy2023]

It just seems imprecise to the point of harm.

Maybe. It's a difficult balancing act. S&S is a very useful method to deal with hard-line criminals, but has collateral damage. When it works, it's the returns are big, but I don't deny that especially when it's used improperly, it does have negative effects that ultimately reduce confidence in police. From my own anecdotal evidence, it seems that the threshold for a search seems to be lower in metropolitan areas such as London than where I am. Although, the crime that S&S is designed to help combat is more prevalent in London than where I am. There are no easy answers here.

 

[Burnsy2023]

I guess it comes down to whether that bias is fair or not.

Be weary of trying to draw conclusions on that. If you only search black people, don't be surprised if you only find black people carrying weapons. My point is to be careful of what the stats and methodology actually show.

 

[Burnsy2023]

The police officer seemed too wet IMO, very unassertive and woolly.

Do you think changing her approach would have changed the outcome?

 

[Burnsy2023]

Infact in 2018/2019 over 100 000 more stop and searches were conducted against white people than black plus mixed...

You're posting stats that support my point that people of a minority ethnicity are searched disproportionately more than white people. I'm not sure what your point is.

There are underlying societal reasons for it being disproportionate such as social-economic background, but that doesn't account for all of the disparity.

 

[Burnsy2023]

But you said that the reason for a higher % of knife crime from ethnic minorities was due to how many get stopped etc.

Twice as many white people get searched overall but in London only account for less than 1/3 of knife crime although they get stopped only 10% fewer times in absolute terms...

Ergo there is no relationship between the number of stop and searches and the outcome of the knife crime stats. The knife crimestats are disproportionate based upon who is commiting them alone not bevause they are being stopped more significantly.

When you say "knife crime" what you mean, from the full fact link you added, was convictions. The fact that BAME suspects are more likely to be charged and convicted than white people skews these stats, so your conclusion isn't valid on the evidence presented.