What can be done to save English Rugby?

AJUK

AJUK

AJUK

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Apparently Austin Healey (aka mighty mouth) has called for the sacking of Robinson along with Larder and Lydon at the same time. He also commented that some of the players consider the coaching they recieve at club level to be better than they recieve at England. However, in an interview this morning Fran Cotton says the RFU is giving the coach their full support but he did acknowledge that since the world cup, despite the rebuilding excercise, the performances have been unacceptable. He added that it was an embarassment given England has the largest player base in the world.

It all looks bleak but I do agree that a shake up iof the coaching staff is needed, perhaps get rid of the League people they have brought in and go back to basics. So, what do you think needs to be done?

(Taffies, Sweaties and Bogtrotters are welcome to comment but no gloating please. ;) :) )
 
As I don't know a great deal about rugby union I was just wondering what is going wrong with the england team recently? Is it the coaching or do we just not have good enough players?
 
I wasn't aware that England had the largest player base in the world actually(I would have thought that France having a roughly similar population size would have a similar player base?). Anyway that isn't really the point as I'll assume Fran Cotton has done his homework on this one.

For a start I'd pick a coach who really inspires the players, England do have good players, even some great players but you need cohesion as a team and a great coach will inspire that. For all Sir Clive Woodwards success I never felt that he was a particularly great coach, I wouldn't have thought him inspiring enough and sometimes poor tactically so I wouldn't go down that route again.

I'd start 'blooding' more of the youngsters on the fringes particularly as the Six Nations is all but over after the defeat to France, oh and I'd find a decent kicker - the attempts at touch were shocking from both sides in the game.

England are still in with a shout of the Six Nations but it comes down more to France losing it than England winning it so I'd just write it off for this season. The fact that they are still in with even a vague shout does show that it hasn't all been a total disaster but some basis skills and a bit of luck seem to have been lacking recently.
 
I don't think you can underestimate the importance Martin Johnson had as captain during Woodward's time as coach. He was quite clearly the best captain in rugby at the time and has been sorely missed.

Robinson needs to go and a more creative style of play brought in. Tindall and Noon aren't working as a centre partnership, there needs to be more creativity. Call me biased (check my location), but sinbad might be worth a try in the centre as he's much more inventive. I don't really rate Harry Ellis at scrum-half either and I think Dawson sould continue to start now. His leadership would be handy as well as i don't think Corry is terribly effective in terms of motivation as a skipper.
 
Mad old tory said:
I don't think you can underestimate the importance Martin Johnson had as captain during Woodward's time as coach. He was quite clearly the best captain in rugby at the time and has been sorely missed.

Robinson needs to go and a more creative style of play brought in. Tindall and Noon aren't working as a centre partnership, there needs to be more creativity. Call me biased (check my location), but sinbad might be worth a try in the centre as he's much more inventive. I don't really rate Harry Ellis at scrum-half either and I think Dawson sould continue to start now. His leadership would be handy as well as i don't think Corry is terribly effective in terms of motivation as a skipper.
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I agree players such as James Simpson-Daniel and Andy Hazel have been around the fringes for a while, they perhaps need to be given a better chance. I also agree that the Noon/Tindall partnership isn't working.

I know my rugby but I just can't see a way forward at the moment, everything just fell apart all of a sudden. I can only suspect that it is the fault of the game plan or style of rugby they are told to play. During Sunday's game I felt that some players wanted to 'break out' and display their obvious talents but the way they are told to play seems to have stiffled that. Tindall is a good example of that, everytime he got the ball he ran the same line, not a side step or dummy in sight.

I was pleased to see Gomersall warming up and I would let him have another bash to put a rocket up Ellis's and Dawson's backside.

On the forward fron, there is nothing essentially wrong but I do think we need some new line out calls, both France and Scotland new what was happening in every one of our line outs.

Lydon and Larder have got to go but I'm not sure if we should get rid of Robinson as well. The problem is who would replace him, Rob Andrew, Nigel Melville or someone else. I can't think of anyone good enough.
 
I really think there is a lack motivation/spark in the squad and coaching staff. Replacing some of the backroom staff would probably be the best idea rather than doing away with Robinson, even though he doesn't seem like the most inspirational coach we've ever had. I don't think England lack talent, but the players do seem low on confidence and form , which is probably partly due to the coaches and tactics. A breath of fresh air is really needed in the England setup to get out of this rut.
 
Mad old tory said:
I don't think you can underestimate the importance Martin Johnson had as captain during Woodward's time as coach. He was quite clearly the best captain in rugby at the time and has been sorely missed.

Robinson needs to go and a more creative style of play brought in. Tindall and Noon aren't working as a centre partnership, there needs to be more creativity. Call me biased (check my location), but sinbad might be worth a try in the centre as he's much more inventive. I don't really rate Harry Ellis at scrum-half either and I think Dawson sould continue to start now. His leadership would be handy as well as i don't think Corry is terribly effective in terms of motivation as a skipper.
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I mentioned Johno in my post on the 6 nations thread last night. IMHO, he was an awesome captain. He knew what worked and at what time.

Did anyone see Guscott's bit of computer analysis before the match? Against Scotland we had a number of clear overlaps but somebody just ran a poor line and the moves went to nothing. I'm not sure there's a complete lack of creativety - in the examples shown the move was started but not finished.
 
#Chri5# said:
I mentioned Johno in my post on the 6 nations thread last night. IMHO, he was an awesome captain. He knew what worked and at what time.

Did anyone see Guscott's bit of computer analysis before the match? Against Scotland we had a number of clear overlaps but somebody just ran a poor line and the moves went to nothing. I'm not sure there's a complete lack of creativety - in the examples shown the move was started but not finished.
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So many times this championship, there's been men out wide and theyve just gone inside and tried to crash through. id love to see a winger actually get the ball on the wing, but i dont think its happen so far since the wales match...
 
Mad old tory said:
So many times this championship, there's been men out wide and theyve just gone inside and tried to crash through. id love to see a winger actually get the ball on the wing, but i dont think its happen so far since the wales match...
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Indeed, let Sinbad have a run at them and then we may see them actually create something let alone get over the gain line.
 
I think there is a very league emphasis on a lot of the backroom coaching, and that tends to result in the boring (sorry league fans) style of rugby that we are seeing from england, also a complete lack of adaptability when things go differnent to plan.
 
Last game I watched where the Glorious Gloucester were discracefully robbed of a victory over the We don't allow that word in the SA, Big Kev (Bath :p ) he was not palying but before that the last time he played was against Listeria (Leicester) and was in at No8 but he does sometimes switch around. I agree Jango should get a run out with the full squad.

Others who should be brought in or back into the squad:

Adam Balding (Balders) - Gloucester
Alex King - Wasps
Andy Gomarsall (Gomers) - Worcester
Chris Fortey (Fouro) - Worcester
Pat Sanderson - Worcester

Any others?
 
Cookie-Monster said:
I think there is a very league emphasis on a lot of the backroom coaching, and that tends to result in the boring (sorry league fans) style of rugby that we are seeing from england, also a complete lack of adaptability when things go differnent to plan.
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They brought Lydon in to help with the defensive coaching, well, that worked dodn't it. :rolleyes:

They should keep heathen rugby as far away as possible from real rugby, I don't feel the use of League coaches or players has brought much to Union. Don't even get me started on the Farrell issue. :mad:
 
I think Abbott should be playing IC with Noon outside him. Tindall just doesn't have the distribution skills to play IC. Lund should be tried at 7 seeing as Moody is really a 6 and not a 7. Also we should get decent, young no.8 playing some games because Corry and Dallaglio could well be past it by the world cup.
 
England team to face Ireland at Twickenham:
T Voyce (Wasps); M Cueto (Sale), J Noon (Newcastle), S Abbott (Wasps), B Cohen (Northampton); A Goode (Leicester), H Ellis (Leicester); A Sheridan (Sale), L Mears (Bath), M Stevens (Bath); S Borthwick (Bath), S Shaw (Wasps); J Worsley (Wasps), L Moody (Leicester), M Corry (Leicester, capt).
Replacements: S Thompson (Northampton), J White (Leicester), D Grewcock (Bath), L Dallaglio (Wasps), M Dawson (Wasps), D Walder (Newcastle), M Tindall (Gloucester).


Not sure why Hodgson and Lewsey aren't in the team (I'm guessing Hodgson hasn't recovered from his injury). Lewsey should be on the bench instead of Cohen, if not starting. At last Abbott has been brought in to play IC, I really hope he performs well, but knowing our luck he will have an off game and we will end up with Tindall again. We are also looking a bit short at fly half, but Wilko is injured and MVG has just come back from injury. I still think the back row needs addressing though.
 
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Not convinced with Thompson on the bench - the lineout was dire when he went off - his throwing has been much improved this year.

I'd have taken Lewsey over Cohen too.
 
#Chri5# said:
Not convinced with Thompson on the bench - the lineout was dire when he went off - his throwing has been much improved this year.

I'd have taken Lewsey over Cohen too.
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Agreed on both points. While Thompson hasn't been great, at least the lineout was working when he was throwing and Lewsey is just a better player and can cover more positions.
 
Shocking decision to drop Lewsey, sure he hasn't exactly set the world on fire this tournament, but he has been no worse that anyone else. Thompson has been good this championship, can't really see why he's been dropped either. Glad to see Abbott in there, should be some creativity now. Shaw is a good inclusion for me, Grewcock can be a liability and he looked very good in the powergen cup..
 
Not sure about that team. I don't think Lewsey ahs played that badly, the big mix up on Sunday was Noon going for the high ball that was clearly lewseys, the fumble led to the French openining try. I am glad to see Voyce back in though.

As I said earlier, I don't know what is needed but a win is the only acceptable outcome on Saturday.

As for Hodgson, I don't belive he is injured, he has bottled it. I know he went off on Sunday but the game did seem to improve a little when fat boy, sorry Goode ( :p ) replaced him.
 
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