What do you call being manipulative?

Soldato
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I've been thinking about where to draw the line recently regarding what being manipulative is and what it is not...

Is the key factor honesty... i.e. if you wont co-operate with someone but you tell them why you wont co-operate whereas if you try to misrepresent yourself you are being manipulative?
 
I would say it was attemping to indirectly cause somthing to happen without fully disclosing what you are trying to do.
 
good question. i catch myself being quite manipulative at times and the annoying thing is, it's unintentional. i'm not entirely sure if a key factor is honesty, i'd say it has a lot to do with the way you present yourself and the way people perceive you to be. i guess you could relate that to honesty, but if you're naturally manipulative, then you're not lying when doing it.

i'd say that you can manipulate someone and remain perfectly honest. you have to be good at it, but it's possible ;)
 
Kell_ee001 said:
It's influencing or controlling others to your own advantage, which in my opinion usually involves some deceit.

It doesn't always have to be to your advantage though, it just happens that it usually is a reason for doing it.
 
I think everyone is manipulative to some extent, it's part of nature to want what YOU want, and that's something that can't be changed.

Manipulation can be a bonus, take for example gently encouraging someone to do something that they are scared to do, but that becomes a problem when what you think they should do overrides what they want. If that makes sense. That wouldn't usually be considered manipulation, but in it's purest sense I think it is.

Manipulation of people is quite easy, take Derren Brown for instance, by learning the fundamentals of NLP and taking it a step further, he can manipulate not only what people do, but also what they think and say. I find that scary. People by nature tend to want to do what others want them to do. Not everyone, but many humans are 'pleasers' and want validation from others, hence they put themselves up to be manipulated - without ever realising it.

Most people resist manipulation, but sometimes you only realise it too late.

Edit: Realised i've not answered the question, despite ramble.

I think it's using a situation to best advantage, while not being honest about what you're doing. So yes, imo honesty is the key.
 
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cleanbluesky said:
Is the key factor honesty... i.e. if you wont co-operate with someone but you tell them why you wont co-operate whereas if you try to misrepresent yourself you are being manipulative?
I don’t think honesty is a key factor. In your example, whether you’re honest or not, I don’t think you’re being manipulative, I think you’re being uncooperative.

In my mind, being manipulative is getting someone to do something without them really knowing their doing it.
 
William - but I would say that EVERYONE does this in a relationship... if I think someone is treating me unfairly I will apply the same rules to them - this is in response to their attitude

Sic - I think I know exactly what you mean TBH, I am wondering right now if I am a manipulative person, or whether I am just manipulative with people who try to manipulate me...

But having said that I dont do that behaviour with people who are honest with me
 
If you think about it, all communication is a form of persuasion. But there is quite clearly different shades of persuasion. You have subtle persuasion on the one hand, which are harmless acts. I mean for instance, imagine if I were to you ask you whether you would like an Ice cream. But you said no. Then I began to describe the Ice dream, in very vivid detail, telling you how creamy it would taste when it hit your lips, and how you would enjoy the feeling of ingesting it. You would be salivating at the mouth, right now, demanding I take you to the Ice cream Parlor, this very instant! And on the other hand you have malicious and malignant manipulation, where somebody might, for instance, play on the insecurities and fears of another - can you imagine it? Being caused a great deal of anxiety and suffering? Admittedly, knowing someone has a weakness for a creamy Vanilla Ice cream and using this knowledge is playing on a weakness, but it doesn't cause anxiety and suffering, infact it causes happiness and elation, and I happen to think any positive attitude that can be instilled into a person through persuasion should be actively encouraged, and any form of persuasion that causes harm, mental or physical, should be actively discouraged. Some people happen to be better at persuading more than others, so the responsibility lays upon their shoulders to use their talent ethically for good purposes as opposed to bad.
 
cleanbluesky said:
Sic - I think I know exactly what you mean TBH, I am wondering right now if I am a manipulative person, or whether I am just manipulative with people who try to manipulate me...

But having said that I dont do that behaviour with people who are honest with me

without question, someone who i think is taking me for a ride will be treated with due caution...but manipulation for me, isnt something i consciously do. i hate feeling like i've forced someone to do something they didnt set out to do, or i've made someone believe something they wouldnt have without my help. it's a horrible feeling. but if they deserved it then c'est la vie, i guess.

i also agree that this is a last resort. i would never behave like this towards the people i love, quite simply because there's no need to. i guess manipulation could be considered as a defense mechanism? sorry. i've waffled.
 
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