What is "Fast"?

I'm guess I'm kinda spoilt when it comes to "fast" cars.

As a kid I was carted about in Dad's ProDrive Scoob, then Pug T16, friends M3s and M5s etc. Joe Public would probably call them "Fast", but I'd call them "quick".

These days I'm used to Dad's race spec Westfield, which is 500BHP/Tonne, 60 in 3.2 and tops out at 150mph up Avon Rise. Also I'm used to a friends Ultima, I don't know the weight of it but it's got 550BHP of Chevy Brutus shoving you along. Those two I'd call "fast".

Yesterday I was out in a Radical. I'd forgotten just what they're like. That I would call "Fast".
 
[TW]Fox;17640283 said:
That's what I thought.

Makes you wonder what happened with the m3 Mike raced, really.
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Shock, horror that a near 8 year old E46 M3 doesn't make its manufacturer book figures any more.

I gave my account of what happened in perfect English, take it or leave it :).

For the record, the RS does 60-100 in 6.9 seconds according to the internet, I don't expect a mapped ST making nearly as much power, but a bit lighter to be too far off that figure.
 
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MikeHiow said:
Shock, horror that a near 8 year old E46 M3 doesn't make its manufacturer book figures any more.

I gave my account of what happened in perfect English, take it or leave it :).

For the record, the RS does 60-100 in 6.9 seconds according to the internet, I don't expect a mapped ST making nearly as much power, but a bit lighter to be too far off that figure.
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Really, an 8yr old M3 won't make its power? I think you will find most do. :rolleyes:

If some BMW are very good out is engine, my 525i had 235,000 on the clock and judging by its performance stats from the vbox it was well within manufacturers claims for performance which in turn means it was clearly making its full power some 15years plus later and with a stupid amount of mileage on the clock. Even on a track day it kept within 1 car length of a very members remapped 330D on these forums.

Out of all the M3's I've driven they perform very well and most M3's are serviced when they need servicing, for an M3 to be down on power it would have to be very poorly looked after or not have been serviced. As the servicing on M3's is expensive because on INSP2 they do something to the heads to make sure they maintain peak performance.

So an M3 with FSH will be making its horsepower, I am quite confident of it. :)


Why is it not possible the guy you raced expected to beat you easily expecting a stock Focus ST and so never bothered to drop it a cog or too and hence why he did not pass you until gone 90mph, that sounds the far more plausible explanation. Basically he was not trying.


Your car is circa 8s as has already been mentioned in this thread, your car is not as quick as an RS through the gears as we discovered in your last thread about your warp drive equipped Focus ST.
 
Gibbo said:
Why is it not possible the guy you raced expected to beat you easily expecting a stock Focus ST and so never bothered to drop it a cog or too and hence why he did not pass you until gone 90mph, that sounds the far more plausible explanation. Basically he was not trying.


Your car is circa 8s as has already been mentioned in this thread, your car is not as quick as an RS through the gears as we discovered in your last thread about your warp drive equipped Focus ST.
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Because I asked him?

I didn't say my car is as quick as an RS, nor have I ever. I just do not think it is far off the RS figure (certainly not over a second 60-100!).
 
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MikeHiow said:
Shock, horror that a near 8 year old E46 M3 doesn't make its manufacturer book figures any more.
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If the car was not well maintained that might be true. I think the S54 engine is supposed to hold onto it's power well with age if maintained well (and driven properly!).

Few years back I had my 1988 M3 Evo 2 with 125,000+mile car tested on a dyno and after clearing a fault with the distributer actually showed 7BHP more than the original BMW quoted figure. Bear in mind the car was 20 years old! It;s an engine well known for keeping it's power into old age. The dyno operator a friend also so I know nothing was tweaked to show a higher figure.
 
MikeHiow said:
Shock, horror that a near 8 year old E46 M3 doesn't make its manufacturer book figures any more.
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Don't talk out of your arse!

I had a 15 year old BMW that made ~20bhp over stock on rollers and they are known to only ever make stock...and other cars on rollers made correct figures.

Cars don't lose power over age as much as you might like to think.


As for the OP question:

Not my car.
 
Here we go - I wondered how long it would take, people using guesswork flywheel figures from dynos to claim old, probably high mileage cars never lose power (But I couldn't have guessed there would be people claiming they made an increase in power when standard!)

Which BMW was this, then?
 
L0rdMike said:
My 16+ year old MK1b MR2 made pretty much book figure on the rollers.
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Yup. I've had my fair share of old cars and whenever I have dyno'd them, they have pretty much come out bang on stock.

My E34 525i came out at 197bhp at powerstation...
 
MikeHiow said:
Here we go - I wondered how long it would take, people using guesswork flywheel figures from dynos to back up their argument.

Which BMW was this, then?
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e36 328i

And as Mike has said, his MR2 did fine too, completely different day etc. etc.

The car performed extremely well for the time I owned it apart from the slight issue with blowing an engine.

Also the post before me backed up my point too, so really, you're wrong. ;)
 
PeterNem said:
Here we go - I wondered how long it'd take for MikeH to disagree with everyone else and talk a load of nonsense.
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I'm not disagreeing with everyone, they are disagreeing with me.

I tell a simple story that a friends car took until a certain speed to obliterate mine (so its not even a 'lol look how good my car is'), before people start throwing numbers off the internet at me.
 
InvaderGIR said:
e36 328i

And as Mike has said, his MR2 did fine too, completely different day etc. etc.

The car performed extremely well for the time I owned it apart from the slight issue with blowing an engine.

Also the post before me backed up my point too, so really, you're wrong. ;)
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You are the one using a guesswork figure to support a mostly irrelevant argument on a different car than being discussed, and you're telling me I'm wrong?

Stop talking out of your ass, really.
 
MikeHiow said:
You are the one using a guesswork figure to support a mostly irrelevant argument on a different car than being discussed, and you're telling me I'm wrong?

Stop talking out of your ass, really.
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I, and everyone else has proven to you that your guess work of 'it was 8 years old so obviously had lost loads of power' is complete and utter tripe.

Stop making wildly inaccurate and unsubstantiated statements as fact. RR figures may not be perfect, but then neither are stock figures either, I mean, you can't find them out without some form of dyno can you? ;)

Point that you're missing is that cars do not lose power over time unless they are extremely badly treated and have major engine problems. You seem to think this is not the case when myself and many others have proven you wrong.
 
PeterNem said:
Here we go - I wondered how long it'd take for MikeH to disagree with everyone else and talk a load of nonsense.
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To be fair not many of us wondered, its inevitable really.

I doubt that a Focus ST matched an E46 M3 between 40 and 100 at all, and neither is there any real reason to suspect half the horses in the M3 had run away.

Oh, and for the record, 150,000 miles, 5 years old and 232bhp ;)
 
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How have you or anyone else proven me wrong? You say a dyno guessed you were making 20bhp more than stock, two other people said a dyno guessed they were making standard power. All of these guesses were on completely different engines to the one in question too.

Many engines are down on power as they get older/more wear - this is quite often the ones with tighter tolerances. I've not said all cars do, and I've not stated categorically that the M3 in question definitely have, but merely offered it as an explanation.

The irony is, all of this arguing against my claims are based on numbers you've found on the internet.
 
There's a general theme of you being wrong in most threads. I think we just take it for granted now - I think there's a general feeling of fatigue when it comes to bothering to reply to you.
 
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