Whoever you support, which players would you like your club to sign from Italy?

[wedgie]

Now we know the fate of the clubs from the Italian match fixing scandal, which players would people most like to see their team go for?

I'll go first........

Man U

Buffon
Kaka
Pirlo
Ibrahimovic
Gattuso
Gilardino
Zambrotta
Oddo
Vieira

Obviously not all the players will be leaving and not all to the same club, but i'd like to think we're in with a chance of getting at least 1 or 2 of them.

 

[wedgie]

It's true that some of the players involved will stay at their clubs, infact I belive most of the big name players will probably stay and help the club out of trouble.

However, by law of averages some of the big name players will end up moving on for one reason or another. Don't forget, 2 years is only the minimum amount of time before we will see these clubs back in europe. I would expect any players aged from around 27 and upwards to be seriously considering their future.

 

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It wasn't the players who were cheating

 

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I was thinking, contracts with players in top devisions only ever have 1 layer of 'protection', and thats from relegation.
So really, regardless of if a player wants to leave Milan, they cant unless Milan want to sell.

You're being a little optimistic there. I think Milan are in serious danger of losing any of their players who have 2 years or less left on their contracts and possibly quite a few more. None of the big players at the club will be signing a new contract for at least the next 2 years, by which time there will be a few not far off being able to leave on a free.

No club in the world is in a position to force a player to stay when he really doesn't want to. Clubs may try to persuade players to stay for a while but in the end if a player wants to leave then he will. The sanctions that have been imposed upon Milan and the other clubs only puts them in a weaker than usual position.

I don't think Milan wanted to sell Shevchenko, but he wanted to leave so he did. And that was before the match fixing scandal. If your top player is able to walk away from the club under normal circumstances, what's going to happen now?

 

[wedgie]

Actually, if a club doesnt want to sell, and no contract rules are being broken, then a player has no choice. Its either play or rot on the bench.

I can't think of a single example of a player of even half decent value being forced to sit out the remainder of a 2 or 3 year contract on the bench.

Back in the real world clubs may dig their heals in for a while in the hope that the player will change his mind or to get a good price. As I said before if a player really wants out of a club their contract doesn't mean a whole lot. Until an example is given otherwise then their is no argument against this.

I do however think of all the clubs Milan have the best chance of keeping their star players, not because they force them to stay but because most of them will want to stay and help the club out of trouble.

The same with what seems to be happening at United. RvN asked to go, they said yes, so he's going. C.Ronaldo wants to, but isnt being let.

Ronaldo hasn't said he wants to go, he has said it would be fine if he signed for Madrid and it would be fine if he stayed at Utd. Either way Man U are obviously going to say he is not for sale to get the best price for him should it come to that.

 

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Dont compare Shevas sale to the sale of any other player at any other club.
Milan didnt want to sell him based on how good he was and how much he is loved by the fans. Sheva asked Silvio & Gallani if he could go, and put across some very personal reasons as to why he wants to go. So they let him.
Milan v.rarely sell their star players, and as has been said in press releases since, the Sheva sale was a one off that wouldnt be happening again.
Its different with Kaka, hes an excellent player, but he doesnt have the stature at the club that Sheva did. The president & vice-president of the club are not family memory and/or great friends like they were with Sheva.
If he said he wanted to leave, his choice of leaving or not would not be upto him. Fact. And he knows that if Milan dont want to sell, then he's gona do more good for himself playing on the field than sitting on the bench. Short of some rediculus offer coming in for him, Milan simply wouldnt sell him.
And while your right, that few clubs could afford to sit a player on the bench, Kaka is at the age now that if he spent significant amount of time on the bench, that his rep would go down, interest in him would go down, and thus money offered for him would go down. He would have to play and play well for the good of his career.

Why can't you compare the sale of Shevchenko to that of any other player? The reason for him wanting to leave is irrelevant, if even true at all. If it was as simple for a player to just say they want a move for family reasons then all unhappy players would use that excuse.

Yes Milan rarely sell their players, but the same can be said for all of the big clubs around europe. It would have to be pretty extreme circumstances for a star player of a team such as Milan, Madrid, Barca, Utd etc to want to leave the club, so to say Milan don't sell big players makes no sense. Of course they don't sell them because they rarely ask to leave.

All a Club can do once a player is adamant they want to leave is to get the best price they can.

 

[wedgie]

The jewels of the side never get sold? Here's a few examples from the last few years that say otherwise, and in all these cases the club didn't want to sell.

Zidane to Madrid
Rooney to Utd
Ferdinand to Utd (Rio even had to go as far as handing in an official transfer request)
Figo to Madrid
Shevchenko to Milan (Yes his transfer is in the same category as all the others)
Anelka to Madrid (Probably the best case of player power, there was no way Arsenal were ever going to keep him no matter what they said)

I'm sure if I looked it up I would find many more examples.

So why arnt United selling Ronaldo then.

On What are you basing your opinion that Ronaldo wants to leave Utd? Paper talk? If you believe all you read in the paper then you'll have a lot of worrying to do over the next few weeks, I can't see transfer rumours involving the Italian clubs stopping until at least the start of the season.

Once again, Ronaldo only said it would be fine if he went to Madrid and fine if he stayed. If he does decide that he wants to leave Utd at some point then there really wont be a whole lot Utd can do to stop him.

 

[wedgie]

How are any of these teams going to get promoted/back into europe if all their top players are either sold or go out on loan?

They can't have it both ways, either they keep the mojoraty of their best players and recover asap, or lose them in which case it could be a very long road to recovery.

 

[wedgie]

It's true that some of the players involved will stay at their clubs, infact I belive most of the big name players will probably stay and help the club out of trouble.

BoomAM, as you clearly didn't read this comment first time around there it is again. Strange comment from someone using all their effort to prove otherwise wouldn't you say?

The only point I am trying to prove is that if any of the players from the clubs involved want to leave, there is nothing that the club can do to stop them. That includes Milan, whether you think otherwise or not.

This fantasy world you live in where any club can hold a player against their will just doesn't exist.

 

[wedgie]

Boom i think your missing the point; he's not talking about Milan specifically, he is saying, like i was saying earlier, that it is nearly impossible for a club to keep hold of a player that wants to move.
And off subject; i really think you have too much faith in what anybody related to Milan says; just because they are directors/players for Milan doesn't mean there telling the truth. Even when a club wants to sell its players it still will say we want to keep them to get a better price et. BTW im not saying thats the case with Milan.

Spot on. BoomAM seems to think Milan operate in a different way to all the other great clubs in europe, as if what applies to Barca, Madrid etc doesn't apply to Milan. All I am saying is Milan are no different to all the other clubs, as he keeps unintentionally proving in his posts. Everything BoomAM said about Milan not selling their best players etc applies to all the top clubs in europe. All the other top clubs also makes claims about not selling star players too.

As I have said before, I do think that quite a few players will stay at their clubs, and of those clubs involved Milan have the best chance of keeping their top players. Like it or not however, if a player decides he wants out of Milan or any club, then he will leave, that is how the real world operates. It's probably true to say that shouldn't be the case and contracts should be honoured, but that's how football works.

 

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Can you please show a quote of me saying I was going to offer a vast list of players leaving Milan? Once again you think it's all about Milan, the list you refer to was infact of players who left their club (any club) yet the club did not want to sell.

I would like to also point out again the reason Milan and all the other top clubs don't sell their best players is because it would be mad to ask to leave a club such as Milan without a very good reason. Not that I am saying players will now be asking to leave Milan, just that they may and if they do then they will go.

 

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Wether you ment that in regard to one club, or in general is up for interpritation.
But, ive yet to see you list any either way.

I wouldn't say it was up for interpritation at all. Of the 6 transfers I named only 1 invloved Milan so I think it was pretty clear I was refering to all clubs.

Do I really need to do give other examples? I'll give 2 more off the top of my head:

Essien to Chelsea (seem to remember the Lyon president saying he would not be sold for less than £32m)
Andy Johnson to Everton

I have said all along I expect Milan to keep most if not all of their best players, so in that way I agree with you. Where we disagree is Milan would not be able to keep them if they decided they wanted to leave, and you think they would be able to force them to stay.