Winter Transfer Window 22/23

adam cool dude · 7 Dec 2022 at 12:04

sigma said:
Probably didn't make commercial sense at the time.

20 million to United is like treating yourself to a takeaway for us mere mortals. We spent more than that on Diallo and Pellistri wasn't much cheaper.

Shamikebab · 7 Dec 2022 at 12:17

adam cool dude said:
Another stupid move from United when we could have bought him for 15-20 million.

When? He chose Dortmund

adam cool dude · 7 Dec 2022 at 12:21

Shamikebab said:
When? He chose Dortmund

Do you honestly believe if there was a real choice between Manchester United and Dortmund that you would pick the latter? The fact is we didn't go in hard enough for him at the time.

CliffyG · 7 Dec 2022 at 12:22

adam cool dude said:
Do you honestly believe if there was a real choice between Manchester United and Dortmund that you would pick the latter? The fact is we didn't go in hard enough for him at the time.

Surely he would have picked Dortmund if he wanted more playing time?

shipinabottle · 7 Dec 2022 at 12:31

adam cool dude said:
Do you honestly believe if there was a real choice between Manchester United and Dortmund that you would pick the latter? The fact is we didn't go in hard enough for him at the time.

Bellingham chose Dortmund because of it's ability to develop players in their early stages. They have a proven track record and he's been given the chance to play consistently which is important in development and in a league with a decent level but not too physically taxing.

As for his next step, IMO he won't choose PSG - he seems driven by football and the French ligue won't cut it for him. It's Liverpool, City or Real. I have feeling he's ending up at Liverpool to work with Klopp and follow in Gerrard's footsteps. I think he will see that as a project with potential to create a period of football history and become a legend. I just don't get the feeling City have that draw... but who knows, maybe he really wants to work with Haaland again!

BaZ87 · 7 Dec 2022 at 12:33

adam cool dude said:
Do you honestly believe if there was a real choice between Manchester United and Dortmund that you would pick the latter? The fact is we didn't go in hard enough for him at the time.

Yes. He made a decision that was best for his career. He chose Dortmund because they gave him a clear pathway into the first team rather than risk becoming one of those expensive teenagers you've mentioned that Utd have signed and developed into nothing. IIRC, Klopp was asked about Bellingham shortly after his move to Dortmund and admitted we were interested but that it was clear that he was only going to join Dortmund.

fez · 7 Dec 2022 at 12:47

If I was a young player who wasn't 100% guaranteed time at a "big" club Dortmund would be the first place to go on my list. They have a fantastic record for developing players and allowing them to leave once they have matured.

scarps · 7 Dec 2022 at 12:52

99% sure Bellingham will go to Liverpool, think it's probably already nearly done.
Probably the best place for him, or city perhaps.
Not sure about Real, they have already started their midfield rebuild and have two great young CMs already.
Yes adding more is great but I feel he becomes a far better player in the long run at Liverpool.

The_One · 7 Dec 2022 at 13:15

if he went anywhere in the prem he would go city to link up with haaland,

personally and yes im bias he would be perfect at arsenal for what we are building with a young team

Robbo · 7 Dec 2022 at 13:17

adam cool dude said:
Do you honestly believe if there was a real choice between Manchester United and Dortmund that you would pick the latter? The fact is we didn't go in hard enough for him at the time.

Yes, I think plenty of people would pick the latter, and he did. Dortmund made a lot more sense.

I think PSG will push for him as they're likely losing Mbappe to Real Madrid before too long.

adam cool dude · 7 Dec 2022 at 13:53

scarps said:
99% sure Bellingham will go to Liverpool, think it's probably already nearly done.
Probably the best place for him, or city perhaps.
Not sure about Real, they have already started their midfield rebuild and have two great young CMs already.
Yes adding more is great but I feel he becomes a far better player in the long run at Liverpool.

Liverpool cannot afford him. They had their chance last summer. Now it is out of reach.

adam cool dude · 7 Dec 2022 at 13:58

BaZ87 said:
Yes. He made a decision that was best for his career. He chose Dortmund because they gave him a clear pathway into the first team rather than risk becoming one of those expensive teenagers you've mentioned that Utd have signed and developed into nothing. IIRC, Klopp was asked about Bellingham shortly after his move to Dortmund and admitted we were interested but that it was clear that he was only going to join Dortmund.

Which Man Utd could have provided him with. I cannot think of another club that promotes youth and academy players through the ranks like we do in this league.

The risk of those expensive teenagers wasn't because they were not given a chance but because they were just poor buys and not really any good. At that time when Bellingham went to Dortmund we were fielding one of the youngest teams in the league as well.

Squad age profiles: Premier League, 2020-21

These graphics are intended to give a quick visual overview of the age of players that each club has fielded in league matches using a technique very similar to “population pyramid” gra…

experimental361.com

omnomnom · 7 Dec 2022 at 14:17

Robbo said:
Yes, I think plenty of people would pick the latter, and he did. Dortmund made a lot more sense.

I think PSG will push for him as they're likely losing Mbappe to Real Madrid before too long.

I bet you a quid he goes to Liverpool.

BaZ87 · 7 Dec 2022 at 14:17

adam cool dude said:
Which Man Utd could have provided him with. I cannot think of another club that promotes youth and academy players through the ranks like we do in this league.

The risk of those expensive teenagers wasn't because they were not given a chance but because they were just poor buys and not really any good. At that time when Bellingham went to Dortmund we were fielding one of the youngest teams in the league as well.

No you couldn't have. At 17 years old Bellingham wasn't going to be guaranteed first team football at Utd. Furthermore Utd have been a madhouse of a football club, chopping and changing between different coaches, set-ups and ways of playing. Any young player would have been mad to take any assurances from Utd, not knowing if the person that gave those assurances would be at the club in 6 months time.

Unlike at Utd, Dortmund could both offer him first team football from an early stage and the stability that didn't just guarantee that on day 1 but also 6 months down the line and beyond. There's a proper structure in place at Dortmund so that if the coach changes, they're not ripping things up and starting again, leaving players as collateral damage.

adam cool dude · 7 Dec 2022 at 14:49

BaZ87 said:
No you couldn't have. At 17 years old Bellingham wasn't going to be guaranteed first team football at Utd. Furthermore Utd have been a madhouse of a football club, chopping and changing between different coaches, set-ups and ways of playing. Any young player would have been mad to take any assurances from Utd, not knowing if the person that gave those assurances would be at the club in 6 months time.

Unlike at Utd, Dortmund could both offer him first team football from an early stage and the stability that didn't just guarantee that on day 1 but also 6 months down the line and beyond. There's a proper structure in place at Dortmund so that if the coach changes, they're not ripping things up and starting again, leaving players as collateral damage.

You are looking at it through hindsight which wasn't available in 2020. At that time United had gotten rid of a lot of deadwood, had qualified for the champions league and got to the semi-finals of every cup they were in. Things were looking very positive at that time. You had all young players like Mason Greenwood, Rashford and Martial all coming off a season which they all got 20 goals a piece in all comps. Greenwood had 49 appearances in 19/20. He was a teenager at that time. Bellingham could have been offered that as well at a far bigger club.

United were just very poor in their recruitment even though as shown by Greenwood they could have offered him exactly the same what he got in Germany.

Robbo · 7 Dec 2022 at 15:16

I disagree, I think we made the best offer that's realistic for a 17 year old and he chose Dortmund, who offered similar.

If he came to Man Utd he wouldn't be the player he is now - so his decision was the correct one.

adam cool dude · 7 Dec 2022 at 15:22

Robbo said:
I disagree, I think we made the best offer that's realistic for a 17 year old and he chose Dortmund, who offered similar.

If he came to Man Utd he wouldn't be the player he is now - so his decision was the correct one.

I agree his decision was the correct one but again hind sight is a good thing. At the time it wouldn't have been as clear cut. I am sure if we had did more we could have landed him.

Pigeon_Killer · 7 Dec 2022 at 15:34

I thought he made it clear he wanted to go to Dortmund because he thought they were the best club for nurturing young talent? I'm sure United could've offered him more money but there's no chance he would've got the game time and become the player he is now.

sigma · 7 Dec 2022 at 15:46

United can definitely offer him more now... we're improving, Pool are on the decline (hopefully for another 30 years).

adam cool dude · 7 Dec 2022 at 15:58

Pigeon_Killer said:
I thought he made it clear he wanted to go to Dortmund because he thought they were the best club for nurturing young talent? I'm sure United could've offered him more money but there's no chance he would've got the game time and become the player he is now.

I literally pointed out that Mason Greenwood who is only 18 months older got 49 games the previous season (where he would have been the same age) he was sold to Dortmund. I mean we was salivating for Sancho at the time who was equally young.