Asus mesh solutions

[darkblade]

I already have a very good router and am currently looking to either add more Unifi APs, or ditch Unifi and go for the latest consumer grade mesh solutions that have improved considerably since I first put in the AC Pro APs.
I've been looking at the Asus Pro ET12 and XT8 products (mainly the XT8 as I don't need wireless backhaul), and note that these have routers included. I suspect that you can bypass these and get the units to act purely as an access point, but these solutions are expensive. Do they have a mesh solution that doesn't have the router capability, that is cheaper as a result?

 

[ChrisD.]

UniFi to Asus? Is this a wind up?

 

[darkblade]

From what I've been reading, it seems that Unifi APs are generally designed to work in more open areas (office spaces), where they handle lots of devices and handshakes between APs very well - and as enterprise devices, so they should. They are not so great in residential homes (but by no means "poor") where the APs will start to struggle to go through more than one wall (only really an issue with larger properties). In these situations, more APs are meant to be used to ensure decent coverage.
Despite this, Unifi has been a leading brand in both enterprise and consumer mesh Wi-Fi networks for a number of years.

It seems that times have changed somewhat and consumer brands have, apparently, caught up with the mesh technology and Wi-Fi 6 (at least in some areas). The consumer brands (Asus, etc) have stronger signals that are designed to get through multiple obstacles. The prices are high though, with Unifi APs representing better value.

I've found Unifi to be relatively stable when it's working, but the updates cause issues far more often than I'd like. Stuff that used to work fine, suddenly becomes a nightmare to track down what settings or configuration need to be changed to get things working again.

 

[GregI]

A 2.4 Ghz signal is a 2.4 Ghz signal and the same for 5 Ghz. You can't magically give yourself better penetration because you changed brand. Physics is physics.

 

[ChrisD.]

They are not so great in residential homes (but by no means "poor") where the APs will start to struggle to go through more than one wall (only really an issue with larger properties). In these situations, more APs are meant to be used to ensure decent coverage.
Despite this, Unifi has been a leading brand in both enterprise and consumer mesh Wi-Fi networks for a number of years.

You are forgetting that your device (phone, smart speaker etc) needs to talk back to the AP.

Moving to another brand won’t change physics and laws. Let alone to a brand such as Asus.

 

[darkblade]

It's not as simple as just 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz.
Different APs will have different different goals based on the design use case.
As an example - single AP deployments and multi AP deployments have different design goals. A single consumer AP can go high power and high gain antennas because the devices either work or there is no alternative. If you take that same approach with multiple AP’s, the AP’s step all over each other and degrade each other’s performance.
So, Unifi is not designed like a consumer device with massive EIRP to blast through walls and coated windows, etc. With Unifi you need more APs to ensure coverage.

 

[Simon42]

A single consumer AP can go high power and high gain antennas because the devices either work or there is no alternative. If you take that same approach with multiple AP’s, the AP’s step all over each other and degrade each other’s performance.
So, Unifi is not designed like a consumer device with massive EIRP to blast through walls and coated windows, etc. With Unifi you need more APs to ensure coverage.

EIRP is limited by each country's regulations so consumer devices cannot surpass those not matter how the likes of Asus market their devices. Aerial design depends on the model of AP or other device (Ubiquiti have coverage charts) and if fitting multiple APs then you choose channels appropriately so they don't conflict. Don't be fooled by consumer brands like Asus that make wild claims which are as honest as their approach to security issues.

 

[Orcvader]

From experience I hardly found any difference in wall penetration comparing Asus, TP-Link and Linksys to UniFi.

You're much better off sticking with your AC Pros, U6 Lite+ is a decent drop-in WiFi 6 replacement if you want to move to that, and the U7 Pro also offers 6GHz if you want to dabble with that too.

 

[darkblade]

From experience I hardly found any difference in wall penetration comparing Asus, TP-Link and Linksys to UniFi.

You're much better off sticking with your AC Pros, U6 Lite+ is a decent drop-in WiFi 6 replacement if you want to move to that, and the U7 Pro also offers 6GHz if you want to dabble with that too.

I'm thinking the U7 Pro is the way to go.

 

[Simon42]

I'm thinking the U7 Pro is the way to go.

The only point to consider with that one is it has a fan inside. I've not used that one yet so don't know if it only kicks in very rarely under high ambient temp or high load, but I would be wary of sticking one where that would be an issue until there's more reviews/comments about that.

 

[darkblade]

The only point to consider with that one is it has a fan inside. I've not used that one yet so don't know if it only kicks in very rarely under high ambient temp or high load, but I would be wary of sticking one where that would be an issue until there's more reviews/comments about that.

The fan only spins up as required - under heavy load, high temps etc. In normal use it's silent.
I'm not going to be saturating it with 6 or 6E devices for quite a while yet.

 

[Simon42]

The fan only spins up as required - under heavy load, high temps etc. In normal use it's silent.
I'm not going to be saturating it with 6 or 6E devices for quite a while yet.

Yes it's expected to spin up under high temps and load, the question is how common is that. I've seen quite a few comments that it kicks in unexpectedly and when it does its loud. I've had many Unifi switches with fans and some are way louder than you would expect (mine are in a cabinet so not really an issue but could be for others).

In my own home I've got 4 APs, a mix of AC Pros and U6-Pros and given the fan, size and MIMO differences I am going to keep upgrading to U6-Pros for the moment. I've got hard wired connections in every room around the house so ultimate wifi speed isn't as important for me as guaranteed silence.

 

[Minato]

I already have a very good router and am currently looking to either add more Unifi APs, or ditch Unifi and go for the latest consumer grade mesh solutions that have improved considerably since I first put in the AC Pro APs.
I've been looking at the Asus Pro ET12 and XT8 products (mainly the XT8 as I don't need wireless backhaul), and note that these have routers included. I suspect that you can bypass these and get the units to act purely as an access point, but these solutions are expensive. Do they have a mesh solution that doesn't have the router capability, that is cheaper as a result?

Hi mate

To answer your question I'm currently on an ASUS AiMesh system in a fairly large house.

I've got 2x XT12s connected via wired backhaul at each end of the house, and then 2x AX92U in the middle via wireless backhaul. I've got ridiculously solid thick brick/block walls between every room, including upstairs. Went with AX92U over XT8 just because I found some much cheaper on CEX.

Performance has been good, the main XT12 router is flashed with asus merlin firmware. The main benefit for me is that each of the units can act as a switch with 4-5 ethernet ports to wire local devices e.g. TVs, switches, etc which would have been more of an issue if just mounting an unifi AP on the ceiling.

The handshaking between devices also seems to work well.

I'm not a networking expert or a massive power user, so the plug and play aspect with minimal config required to get my NAS up and running properly was good.

 

[Avalon]

Hi mate

To answer your question I'm currently on an ASUS AiMesh system in a fairly large house.

I've got 2x XT12s connected via wired backhaul at each end of the house, and then 2x AX92U in the middle via wireless backhaul. I've got ridiculously solid thick brick/block walls between every room, including upstairs. Went with AX92U over XT8 just because I found some much cheaper on CEX.

Performance has been good, the main XT12 router is flashed with asus merlin firmware. The main benefit for me is that each of the units can act as a switch with 4-5 ethernet ports to wire local devices e.g. TVs, switches, etc which would have been more of an issue if just mounting an unifi AP on the ceiling.

The handshaking between devices also seems to work well.

I'm not a networking expert or a massive power user, so the plug and play aspect with minimal config required to get my NAS up and running properly was good.

So you mean it acts just like a Deco x20 that cost £100 new for two and have three switch ports, but a pair of XT12’s is over 3x the price new and made by a marketing company with a horrible history when it comes to networking?

 

[Caged]

I have the X20s and it would be nice if they had 3 switch ports and were £100 for two but unless there's different hardware revisions they have two ports on each base

 

[CaNsA]

the main XT12 router is flashed with asus merlin firmware.

I have a pair of XT8 routers with the same firmware.
Wired backhaul, and it works flawlessly.

Yeah Asus may get a bad rep, but if it's config'd correctly it should all be rosey.

 

[darkblade]

Well the new AC U7s aren't seen in the Unifi controller (running on a Raspberry Pi). Tried updating the Unfi Network Manager to latest version (it's stop advising of the latest updates) - doesn't work due to a package issue...
"Skipping acquire of configured file 'ubiquiti/binary-armhf/Packages' as repository 'http://www.ui.com/downloads/unifi/debian stable InRelease' doesn't support architecture 'armhf'"
So I've now got to figure out how to install the latest version of the Network Controller software on my Pi manually. Complete waste of time.

 

[ChrisD.]

No idea what you’re saying. Never had any issue with updates etc.

 

[Orcvader]

Well the new AC U7s aren't seen in the Unifi controller (UDM). Tried updating UDM to latest version (it's stop advising of the latest updates) - doesn't work due to a package issue...
"Skipping acquire of configured file 'ubiquiti/binary-armhf/Packages' as repository 'http://www.ui.com/downloads/unifi/debian stable InRelease' doesn't support architecture 'armhf'"
So I've now got to figure out how to install the latest version of UDM on my Pi manually. Complete waste of time.

Is your Pi running a 32-bit OS? I had to change mine to the 64-bit version last year since the UniFi controller software stopped supporting 32-bit.

 

[ChrisD.]

Is your Pi running a 32-bit OS? I had to change mine to the 64-bit version last year since the UniFi controller software stopped supporting 32-bit.

He has a UDM it seems, so no idea where the Pi fits into things.