Poll: Is the 2016 F1 Qualifying format better than the 2015 format?
- Thread starter Skeeter
- Start date
TBH I'm a purist and I'd like to see all of the artificial rubbish brought in during the past 15yrs to be completely reversed.
Due to all of the rules & regulation changes aimed at increasing entertainment - go faster buttons, run offs to reduce retirements and make the sport less difficult, tyre degradation/limits, fuel flow limits etc. they might as well just copy the WWE model and script races rather than constantly moving the artificial goalposts in a bid to try and spice things up more. It's the only way you're going to avoid 'dry spells' that the F1 viewers of today like to complain so much about.
Due to all of the rules & regulation changes aimed at increasing entertainment - go faster buttons, run offs to reduce retirements and make the sport less difficult, tyre degradation/limits, fuel flow limits etc. they might as well just copy the WWE model and script races rather than constantly moving the artificial goalposts in a bid to try and spice things up more. It's the only way you're going to avoid 'dry spells' that the F1 viewers of today like to complain so much about.
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This x9999999
Especially when the rules can be fixed.
Make cars follow better in dirty air. This is done by single barge front wing, which is less affected by dirty air.
Simplified rear wing, created less dirty air.
Bigger tyres for more mechanical grip.
2017 rules are pretty good, except they haven't band all the winglets on the wings.
Unless you have a pit exit that joins the straight at the last corner, and a pit entrance at the first corner, then it'll never be good. Time to complete 2 laps to save your skin or 3 laps for everyone else, just takes to long. Then you still have the silly rule of starting on tyres from q2.
Soldato
dumbest question of the year award goes to.....
Are you reading the same rules as me? The 2017 rules will make F1 worse in almost every area they touch.
Wider cars, lower cars, wider tyres. These are all good things. they just need to simplify front and rear wings. As they aren't, the rules completely fail, but the base rules with a few adjustments are actually pretty good.
The wider cars and tyres benefit is totally wiped out by the increased complexity of the aero. They are undoing all the simplification they made in 2009. Its basically 2008 horrific ugly aero messes photocopied at 120%. The tyres were reduced in width in 2010 too, so we are just clawing back what we had before anyway (in terms of fronts at least).
The racing will be worse under the 2017 rules.
The racing will be worse under the 2017 rules.
I know, that's why I said it.
Again the underlying rules are pretty good, but due to a couple of things they totally fail.
I don't get the sudden shock that it takes a few minutes to change tyres and get onto a hot lap - if you think you're vulnerable you make sure you're in position to get an improved time when you need it.
If that's at the end of the next few 90 second eliminations or at the end of a session isn't important, it's not hard for the team to work it out. Some will make mistakes, but that's no different to top teams going out in Q3 because they misjudged something.
Was there an expectation that a driver could be sat in the pits or trundling around (why?) until he was in the 90 second zone, then do something about it?
The one thing that must be obvious, is this format does nothing to address the 3 elimination sessions or the previous 1 hour format - teams won't go out if they can't improve, they need to be given a reason to.
It was a bit weak of several teams to accept their positions after one run, even if Ferrari couldn't realistically get close to Mercedes are we to believe Raikkonen doesn't believe he can get close to Vettel in the same car?
It isn't a sudden shock. We were saying this was one if the issue since it was announced.
You can't make sure your in a position, it wasn't misjudgement, they weren't just sat in puts getting it wrong, it takes to long that's the issue, and this isn't even near the longest lap on the calendar. Out lap, fast lap, in lap. Reverse car in to garage, refuel. get out, do out lap, do fast lap. That's a very large chuck of time more like 8 minutes. Even if your just talking about defending, your looking at 4mins time need to set a fast lap.
It was rare for teams to misjudge and go out, due to a lot if lee way, in this qualifying, it isn't even misjudgement there's simply not enough time,
Why would Ferrari run and destroy another set of tyres, did they even have any new super softs left? Ferrari used two sets of tyres in q2 compared to mercs 1, thus mercs had an extra set to use in q3.
It simply doesn't work and can't not work, unless the put is massively changed so cars don't need to di an out and an in lap. And that's not going to happen, it needs sticking in the in, like most of us said, it was obvious it wasn't going to work. For many reasons. Time needed for those laps and refuelling being one of them.
You can't make sure your in a position, it wasn't misjudgement, they weren't just sat in puts getting it wrong, it takes to long that's the issue, and this isn't even near the longest lap on the calendar. Out lap, fast lap, in lap. Reverse car in to garage, refuel. get out, do out lap, do fast lap. That's a very large chuck of time more like 8 minutes. Even if your just talking about defending, your looking at 4mins time need to set a fast lap.
It was rare for teams to misjudge and go out, due to a lot if lee way, in this qualifying, it isn't even misjudgement there's simply not enough time,
Why would Ferrari run and destroy another set of tyres, did they even have any new super softs left? Ferrari used two sets of tyres in q2 compared to mercs 1, thus mercs had an extra set to use in q3.
It simply doesn't work and can't not work, unless the put is massively changed so cars don't need to di an out and an in lap. And that's not going to happen, it needs sticking in the in, like most of us said, it was obvious it wasn't going to work. For many reasons. Time needed for those laps and refuelling being one of them.
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If it takes longer, start earlier - if you get your hot lap at the wrong time it's mis-judgement, or maybe someone messed up a lap and got eliminated out of expected position - that's the unknown factor.
Which is the real problem, you want teams running to put on a show, but there's no upside for them and several downsides.
Anyway, while the lack of action in Q3 was disappointing I'm not sure the new format had any effect on Q3.
You can't start earlier, which cars weren't lined up ready for the green light?
Did you even watch it or understand the rules, as it seems you don't?
Apart from q1 & q2 being a complete mess and that's on one of the shorter tracks. Several people including Hamilton were blocked for a start. Q3 and the rest still had less running than the old system.
Where before Ferrari would put in a second lap to secure 2nd row, there was no need, in this format as they couldn't be beaten and as they had no chance against mercy, why run.
So yes it did have a big impact in a bad way, Not one part of it worked,
Did you even watch it or understand the rules, as it seems you don't?
Apart from q1 & q2 being a complete mess and that's on one of the shorter tracks. Several people including Hamilton were blocked for a start. Q3 and the rest still had less running than the old system.
Where before Ferrari would put in a second lap to secure 2nd row, there was no need, in this format as they couldn't be beaten and as they had no chance against mercy, why run.
So yes it did have a big impact in a bad way, Not one part of it worked,
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At Spa and Singapore the lap is longer than 90 seconds. How are you meant to react to being in the elimination zone when you haven't even finished the lap that would put you in the elimination zone? Are the drivers expected to be clairvoyant as well now?
It was impossible to react to being in danger unless you were just starting or already on a hot lap this weekend. There is no way you can react to being in danger, you have to have already predicted it. In fact, you needed to be able to predict if you were in danger of the next 3 or 4 eliminations.
The format 100% failed. It needs to be entirely scrapped. Anyone claiming otherwise has misunderstood how it works.
It was impossible to react to being in danger unless you were just starting or already on a hot lap this weekend. There is no way you can react to being in danger, you have to have already predicted it. In fact, you needed to be able to predict if you were in danger of the next 3 or 4 eliminations.
The format 100% failed. It needs to be entirely scrapped. Anyone claiming otherwise has misunderstood how it works.
Soldato
Just seen Quali. Went in with an open mind .... but it was rubbish. 4 minutes to go and there's no-one on track and a queue of drivers going for weigh in. Vettel in 3rd and not yet eliminated is wandering around in his civvies.
Pathetic.
Pathetic.
Soldato
Award points for quali and then reverse the grid for the race 
Soldato
Award points for quali and then reverse the grid for the race
It's what you'd expect from the BTCC, not F1.
The problem is that all unpredictability has gone - everything is too clinical and methodical. For the first time in years I actually groaned when Hamilton went 6 tenths quicker than Vettel in Q2 I think it was, as I knew the season was pretty much over all ready (before a racing lap has even turned), with no signs of any prospect of change. Not that we expected anything else.
As for C4, I watched parts of their rerun and it looked good and fresh. More energy than the dying BBC and much, much fresher than the Sky coverage I watched earlier... Brundle looked a step behind everything today (he really is a shadow of his former self) and for the first time in the history of everything ever, Hill had a moment when he said something interesting and on the ball after qualifying!
C4's pitfall will probably be having brilliant races and horrible ones, depending on which pundits are chosen for the different events. No complaints about Webber and DC though - a good match, and Webber could take on for Hill, Herbert and Davidson combined and still come towering above them. The presenter looked a bit out of place as expected, but given how little time he had to prepare it's too earlier to judge (only turned up in the 2nd test, so presumably he was only told that week).
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