Nobody cares about football

Column Matrix

Column Matrix

Column Matrix

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16 Oct 2007
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391
The media ruin football. It rubs off on everyone else as well. When was the last time you read an article or saw a discussion about the topics that really matter? Discussions about technique, different training methods, phsycology or dare I say tactics?

Instead, the media focus on transfer rumours, making up quotes, digging up rifts within teams or piling pressure on managers and critising their individual performances - nevermind them getting most of the facts wrong. They are able to brainwash any set of fans they want through making absurd sweeping statements. Let's take 'Rafa's Rotation' which has certainly been a massive media buzz phrase for a while now. The media have taken a massive dislike to this and seem to blame every defeat on 'rotation' and in turn most fans end up getting frustrated. Yet I see very little coverage on just why he uses this method. I see people branding about things like 'it works in Spain but not here' and yet do these people know that players like Steven Gerrard are simply unable to train because of the amount of matches they play? Imagine how much better he could be if he was able to train. Perhaps this is a reason for the rotation (if it even exists). Yet the media choose to take a negative stance on it. That's just one example. Even when Benitez first came the Liverpool he got slaughtered in the media for using Zonal Marking - I bet those journos are eating their words now.

Let's take what happened with Martin Jol earlier in the season. The media seem to be able to pass off fiction as fact, and better still they are able to pick faults in one manager while praising another for making the same decisions in the similar situations. MJ got absolutely berated about how he was 'unable to coach a defence' or how Spurs were unable to defend set pieces because of him. Yet they pushed under the carpet the fact that in his first full season Spurs' had pretty much their best defensive record since WWII. They even managed to place the blame fully on him for Spurs being awful at set pieces, despite the fact that bar deciding whether to go Zonal or Man Mark, there is very little a manager can do and the rest is down to the players. It is ironic how I was saying that Jol wasn't at fault for this and it was the players, and now Spurs have just signed 3 new defenders (two of whom are vastly experienced). Nevertheless I'm sure you will find Sky Sports telling you it was otherwise back then.

In addition, Jol was once more slaughtered in the media for taking Berbatov off when Spurs were 3-1 up against Chelsea. Once again they brushed under the carpet that Berbatov was injured and Spurs had played in Spain only 36 hours before. I feel the way the FA did nothing to prevent this is a far more pressing issue in football at the moment. Do they seriously put TV companies before the welfare of the players?

There are countless other examples but I feel that the important aspects of football are the ones nobody cares about. I saw a thread about how to improve as a player and it got a mere 3 replies and yet topics like 'RAFAS ROTATION LEADS TO LIVERPOOL NIGHTMARE' or transfers get into the hundreds
 
Hot damn that's a lot of words.

EDIT: Ok read it now. First thought: No-one talks about tactics, technique and training methods - where on earth are you reading? I suggest you stop and try somewhere else. I see talk about tactics all the time, and the latter two are the main focus of the debate in nearly every "The Prem has to many foreigners" thread on here alone. If transfer gossip is getting to you, stop reading the tabloids.

Secondly, about Jol. I had sympathy for the guy when he went, but I'm really begin to see why he went now. Unless someone can truly convince me he was being hadicapped by the board, I really don't see why he never shored up the utterly broken Spurs defence (I'm sorry, just look at your Goals Against tally this season, there's no defending (oho) that at all), when Ramos comes in and has fixed it almost instantly. Sign experienced, quality CB, LB and RB, job done. How did MJ not do this?
 
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No this is actually serious. There are very few people who seem to care about the things I mentioned. All everybody wants is just gossip of the next sensational big money move. Can anybody here without researching first actually describe a working week for a footballer, or any sports person? I doubt it. This is why I see people laughing at Ronaldo crying when he loses or ask why athletes cry when they medal in the Olympic games - very few people actually what goes on behind the scenes and what sacrifices they make to get them there in the first place.
 
To be fair to Jol, he turned all those bright young prospects into pie eating lard arses who couldnt defend so he needed to go, certainly the new manager has seemingly turned them from fatties to footballers since he has been there.

Benitez is a clown who you wont have to worry about at the end of the season as he will be out of a job as he is taking liverpool nowhere, he has made no in roads to the top four and bought poorly.
 
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I read this board quite a lot (but rarely post) you don't know whether posts are written by someone with at least some understanding of the game or a level 19 warcraft character. :D

Take the Mascherano thread for example - it's brilliant, there are about 20 replies from defensive midfield experts but when Georges asks about tips on improving his game (who ironically plays in a defensive midfield role) the experts all run for the hills.

I watch the games at the weekend, plus match of the day. I take little notice to the build up of games and never watch (ezzzzie ezzzzzie) Soccer AM (throws up) trying to ignore as much of the media rubbish as possible. The 'Sunday Supplement' is the funniest thing ever. A load of old men talking about the most intricate irrelevant parts of the game - over and over. Then you've those who build everyone up only to pull them to pieces, think of David Beckham, Martin Jol (best manager since sliced bread last year) it's just all hyperbole.

The media just stoke the flames for the average plastic flag waving, jester hat wearing, same song signing, sack the manager after 20 games fickle fan. And so it continues


prawn sandwich anyone?
 
player said:
I read this board quite a lot (but rarely post) you don't know whether posts are written by someone with at least some understanding of the game or a level 19 warcraft character. :D

Take the Mascherano thread for example - it's brilliant, there are about 20 replies from defensive midfield experts but when Georges asks about tips on improving his game (who ironically plays in a defensive midfield role) the experts all run for the hills.

I watch the games at the weekend, plus match of the day. I take little notice to the build up of games and never watch (ezzzzie ezzzzzie) Soccer AM (throws up) trying to ignore as much of the media rubbish as possible. The 'Sunday Supplement' is the funniest thing ever. A load of old men talking about the most intricate irrelevant parts of the game - over and over. Then you've those who build everyone up only to pull them to pieces, think of David Beckham, Martin Jol (best manager since sliced bread last year) it's just all hyperbole.

The media just stoke the flames for the average plastic flag waving, jester hat wearing, same song signing, sack the manager after 20 games fickle fan. And so it continues


prawn sandwich anyone?
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Harsh(firm) but fair!.......although Mascherano WILL prove to be a world class player (shame every midfielder apparently has to score 20+ goals or he's crap these days - whilst they are still happy to fork out 30million for a guy who can't seem to score on a good day!) given another season in the Premiership.

Yes, we can all become armchair critics, but quality is only too obvious sometimes, and regardless of the "old men" talking a load of old BS in the papers, some of it sometimes makes sense.....proportionally like 10% of the total posts on this website!!......quality or quantity......all in the postings of the beholder!!:)
 
player said:
I read this board quite a lot (but rarely post) you don't know whether posts are written by someone with at least some understanding of the game or a level 19 warcraft character. :D

Take the Mascherano thread for example - it's brilliant, there are about 20 replies from defensive midfield experts but when Georges asks about tips on improving his game (who ironically plays in a defensive midfield role) the experts all run for the hills.

I watch the games at the weekend, plus match of the day. I take little notice to the build up of games and never watch (ezzzzie ezzzzzie) Soccer AM (throws up) trying to ignore as much of the media rubbish as possible. The 'Sunday Supplement' is the funniest thing ever. A load of old men talking about the most intricate irrelevant parts of the game - over and over. Then you've those who build everyone up only to pull them to pieces, think of David Beckham, Martin Jol (best manager since sliced bread last year) it's just all hyperbole.

The media just stoke the flames for the average plastic flag waving, jester hat wearing, same song signing, sack the manager after 20 games fickle fan. And so it continues

prawn sandwich anyone?
Click to expand...
This is what I'm talking about. The Sunday Supplement is a prime example of it, spending 20 mins talking about the Benjani/Defoe transfer or Beckham getting his 100th cap - going into huge detail about quite frankly minor aspects of the game. That Danny Fulbrook is especially awful. I think the only football pundit I see that tries to move away from this rubbish is Alan Hansen. You might not agree with what he says but at least he tries to give a proper insight on what went wrong or where a player/team can improve and gives valid examples and reasons to back his views up. The rest (when they actually try to talk about actual football) just seem to make sweeping statements with nothing to back it up.

In Mascherano thread we've now got onto 3 pages of discussion whether a player is worth £18m. Does it REALLY matter how much he is worth? Most of the time nobody actually knows how much a player is bought for in total unless you wade through accounts by yourself. People are making statements about him being being the best DM in the league, or how he isn't as good as Hargreaves or whoever without backing anything up. What is it that makes him a good player? What is it that makes Hargreaves better? In football there is no easy way to say one player is better than another - its not like athletics where if one person runs 400m in 50 seconds and another runs in 46 and there is no question about who is better. Nobody backs their statements up and if they do it is usually with something very weak like scoring record/rate or assists.
 
player said:
I read this board quite a lot (but rarely post) you don't know whether posts are written by someone with at least some understanding of the game or a level 19 warcraft character. :D

Take the Mascherano thread for example - it's brilliant, there are about 20 replies from defensive midfield experts but when Georges asks about tips on improving his game (who ironically plays in a defensive midfield role) the experts all run for the hills.

I watch the games at the weekend, plus match of the day. I take little notice to the build up of games and never watch (ezzzzie ezzzzzie) Soccer AM (throws up) trying to ignore as much of the media rubbish as possible. The 'Sunday Supplement' is the funniest thing ever. A load of old men talking about the most intricate irrelevant parts of the game - over and over. Then you've those who build everyone up only to pull them to pieces, think of David Beckham, Martin Jol (best manager since sliced bread last year) it's just all hyperbole.

The media just stoke the flames for the average plastic flag waving, jester hat wearing, same song signing, sack the manager after 20 games fickle fan. And so it continues


prawn sandwich anyone?
Click to expand...


seems to me like you're on something of a high horse about being a proper fan. on this forum we indulge in banter between fans, we talk about headline issues and often we get side tracked into mickey taking. but seeing someones forum posts gives no one the basis to judge other peoples respective qualities as fans. I know that a lot of people on here care deeply for their club and i am sure a lot of people have a sound technical knowledge of the game.

As to why we don't get more posts going into true details about the working of the game, it's quite possible that people want to use these forums as a more social thing (it is an aspect of being a fan that tribalism you know) and are looking for a bit of fun while using these forums. Don't assume that because people don't always talk about it they don't have a sound understanding of the game as a whole. on the threads mentioned, the one with georges i saw and basically i didn't feel qualified to answer, the only football i play is to a fairly low level, i'm no coach and to be honest your answer seemed to cover everything i could think of. does that somehow make you a better fan than me? of course it doesn't. with regards the other thread i simply didn't see it. simple as that really.

Eveyone is aware that the media like to inflame or create suggestions that's nothing new to be honest, people choose to indulge some of those fancies simply because it can be pretty fun to discuss it all to be honest.

oh, and if you asked me to give some key points about what a prawn sandwich eating fan was all about then. 1. doesn't get involved in the build up to the game. 2. doesn't sing chant or wave their silly plastic flags at the game. 3. doesn't sometimes get irrational over their club and make suggestions which when looked back on seem a little silly on occasion. 4. don't want to get involved in any banter with rivals. that would pretty much sum up a corporate prawn sandwich muncher to me, and you would seem to fit into a lot of those criteria. would i call you a prawn sandwich fan? no chance. i'm not going to make those value calls or presume that i'm a better fan than you.

one of the worst things that's come out of keane's rant over the prawn sandwich brigade is a breed of fans who feel some strange desire to somehow show themselves and consider themselves as more worthy, more of a true fan.
 
NokkonWud said:
I don't really understand where the talk of no tactics come from, I see it all over the place.
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Dont get into it dude, matey in the post above has settled the argument already.
Someone has a superiority complex that needs massaging, thats about the some of it.
 
I knew I shouldn't have said tactics but it is actually one of the main things that annoy me. People talk about tactics but half the time they get it completely wrong. For example time and time again I see people start talking about formations like if a team plays 451 (aka 433) and a team doesn't score they start going on about how its a too defensive (even though all the great teams put defense first) or some other rubbish about having only 1 striker. Another is when people talk about set pieces which I've already highlighted.

I once read an article about a new revolutionary way of playing football called 'pass & move' and the author was going on about how great and new it was. Yeah I always thought you had to pass the ball and then stand still for 30 seconds:rolleyes:. The media seem to employ morons and the stupid questions they ask the players like recently with the England Conference are laughable.

It happens in all sports though. Bill Sweetenham gave an interview once for the BBC where he basically just ripped into the interviewer and told him that he knew nothing about the sport (swimming) and in other words don't ask stupid questions.

Here is the interview: http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/sol/ne...=bb&mp=wm&news=1&nol_storyid=4735081&bbcws=1#

I think it applies to most sports in this country.
 
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Column Matrix said:
This is what I'm talking about. The Sunday Supplement is a prime example of it, spending 20 mins talking about the Benjani/Defoe transfer or Beckham getting his 100th cap - going into huge detail about quite frankly minor aspects of the game. That Danny Fulbrook is especially awful. I think the only football pundit I see that tries to move away from this rubbish is Alan Hansen. You might not agree with what he says but at least he tries to give a proper insight on what went wrong or where a player/team can improve and gives valid examples and reasons to back his views up. The rest (when they actually try to talk about actual football) just seem to make sweeping statements with nothing to back it up.
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Stop reading the stupid bits of papers? I'm pretty sure at the Independent or the Observer has articles by managers (think Strachan did one) about tactics every week.
In Mascherano thread we've now got onto 3 pages of discussion whether a player is worth £18m. Does it REALLY matter how much he is worth? Most of the time nobody actually knows how much a player is bought for in total unless you wade through accounts by yourself. People are making statements about him being being the best DM in the league, or how he isn't as good as Hargreaves or whoever without backing anything up. What is it that makes him a good player? What is it that makes Hargreaves better? In football there is no easy way to say one player is better than another - its not like athletics where if one person runs 400m in 50 seconds and another runs in 46 and there is no question about who is better. Nobody backs their statements up and if they do it is usually with something very weak like scoring record/rate or assists.
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STOP PRESS: Debate is more likely to occur when something is not clear-cut! More at eleven!
I knew I shouldn't have said tactics but it is actually one of the main things that annoy me. People talk about tactics but half the time they get it completely wrong. For example time and time again I see people start talking about formations like if a team plays 451 (aka 433) and a team doesn't score they start going on about how its a too defensive (even though all the great teams put defense first) or some other rubbish about having only 1 striker. Another is when people talk about set pieces which I've already highlighted.
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But some 4-5-1's ARE played with only one striker and a 5 man midfield, with the extra mid used to control play but cut down on said team's attacking opportunities. So it's a fair argument to say it's too defensive, isn't it?

I find it funny you're arguing with atpbx in this thread, when he's one of the posters I immediately thought of as always chipping in his 2p on tactics after/during games.

I once read an article about a new revolutionary way of playing football called 'pass & move' and the author was going on about how great and new it was. Yeah I always thought you had to pass the ball and then stand still for 30 seconds:rolleyes:.
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Haha, nicely done. You rant about how no-one talks about tactics, and then you utterly fail to grasp how the pass and move system works. Funnily enough, most players do actually stand around too much when they've passed the ball on, thinking their role is mostly done. Hence why the system was invented, and why its seen to improve the game, as it gives the receiver of the ball more options to play it on.

It's ironic how you complain about how no-one's talking about tactics/training/technique, and yet I've yet to see an informed post by you on any of the subjects. Rather than challenging us to tell you what a footballer does every day, why don't you baffle and amaze us with your wealth of knowledge?
 
What is so great and different of pass and move then? Why was the author claiming it to be some brand new revolution? It is a fundamental of the game, every single team tries to play 'pass and move', no manager on earth encourages his players to pass the ball and then stand still.

It's ironic how you complain about how no-one's talking about tactics/training/technique, and yet I've yet to see an informed post by you on any of the subjects. Rather than challenging us to tell you what a footballer does every day, why don't you baffle and amaze us with your wealth of knowledge?
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This thread wasn't about how much I know. It was about the lack of proper discussion about those things with people giving reasons to back their views up rather than just making sweeping statements or basing their views on kneejerk reactions. But anyway, are you saying that Set Pieces are not mostly down to the players and not tactics (bar man or zonal)? If you do then ask any manager or read any coaching manual and they will tell you different. Are you suggesting that Benitez using rotation isn't partly down to a major problem we have in this country where some of the top players simply cannot train because they play so many matches?

As for atpbx, his comments on Jol and Benitez show such rational thought, and doesn't he reckon Sven should be sacked? Do you remember where City were last season?

DanH84 said:
seems to me like you're on something of a high horse about being a proper fan. on this forum we indulge in banter between fans, we talk about headline issues and often we get side tracked into mickey taking. but seeing someones forum posts gives no one the basis to judge other peoples respective qualities as fans. I know that a lot of people on here care deeply for their club and i am sure a lot of people have a sound technical knowledge of the game.

As to why we don't get more posts going into true details about the working of the game, it's quite possible that people want to use these forums as a more social thing (it is an aspect of being a fan that tribalism you know) and are looking for a bit of fun while using these forums. Don't assume that because people don't always talk about it they don't have a sound understanding of the game as a whole. on the threads mentioned, the one with georges i saw and basically i didn't feel qualified to answer, the only football i play is to a fairly low level, i'm no coach and to be honest your answer seemed to cover everything i could think of. does that somehow make you a better fan than me? of course it doesn't. with regards the other thread i simply didn't see it. simple as that really.

Eveyone is aware that the media like to inflame or create suggestions that's nothing new to be honest, people choose to indulge some of those fancies simply because it can be pretty fun to discuss it all to be honest.

oh, and if you asked me to give some key points about what a prawn sandwich eating fan was all about then. 1. doesn't get involved in the build up to the game. 2. doesn't sing chant or wave their silly plastic flags at the game. 3. doesn't sometimes get irrational over their club and make suggestions which when looked back on seem a little silly on occasion. 4. don't want to get involved in any banter with rivals. that would pretty much sum up a corporate prawn sandwich muncher to me, and you would seem to fit into a lot of those criteria. would i call you a prawn sandwich fan? no chance. i'm not going to make those value calls or presume that i'm a better fan than you.

one of the worst things that's come out of keane's rant over the prawn sandwich brigade is a breed of fans who feel some strange desire to somehow show themselves and consider themselves as more worthy, more of a true fan.
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Nobody cares if you're a better fan or not.

Also I will directly quote Keane here:

"Our fans away from home are as good as any, but some of them come here and you have to wonder do they understand the game of football? We're 1-0 up, then there are one or two stray passes and they're getting on players' backs. It's just not on. I don't think some of the people who come to Old Trafford can spell football, never mind understand it"

Part of his annoyance was because of fans who don't understand the game, and then have kneejerk reactions when something goes wrong. So basically you've interpreted Keane wrong.
 
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