Confused about body composition (Newbie-ish)

Wardie said:
Have you ever seen the Cirque De Soleil performers?

There was an article on T-Nation about their training. They have amazingly developer physiques but all they really do is train for their performance for hours daily.

They can't afford to do anything too intense weights wise because they can perform several times a day, so being sore really wouldn't be good.

Instead they are frequently hitting muscles by practicing their routines daily. Although not as intense as lifting weights to failure, they are frequently training the muscles.

Makes you think ;)

HST follows similar principles in that you should be in a constant state of hypertrophy, you do not need to rest muscles for a week. You'll be hitting them every 48 hours so there's no need for every session to be majoirly intense.

Believe me, if every session in HST was heavy, the program would be nowhere near as effective.

By also having light days you are de-loading, meaning that you will be constantly breaking PBs every two weeks. Periodisation is probably the most effective way of getting continual strength gains.
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Look at surfers, especially the big wave guys, they arent huge but they have significant muscular size yet they surf for up to 10 hours most days (the pro's) there are no rules in muscle growth except that repeated demand for strength that isnt there promotes it :D

Laird Hamilton

laird.jpg


Those are the arms of someone who PADDLES large boards between hawaiian islands for up to 16hours at a time, yet we are told we will shrivel up and die if we do more than 40mins of cardio.
 
Zip said:
Im after strong powerful muscles with a hell of a lot of endurance aswell.

What would be my best way to do this? HST?

At the moment im doing 10-15 reps and using as much weight as i can possibly/physically can.

Im not after muscles for looks, im after the most efficient powerful and endurance muscles as i can get.
In car terms, Its function over form:D
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For performance, as you term it, you want to focus on bodyweight exercises, this will give you the best power to bodyweight ratio, you can pretty much ignore most weight training methods. Concentrate on large numbers of chins, dips, push ups, handstand push ups, sit ups, crunches stuff like that. Only add weight when the reps start getting sill like 50-100. Try to work toward the real strength bodyweight moves like single arm chins and pressups etc.

If you are going for that balanced bruce lee type physique thats the way to do it. Most guys here lift heavier than bodyweight and thus get heavier through muscle mass, but you'll find the strongest of guys on here would struggle to do 20 wide chins, im pretty stron and i can do about 2 :D
 
Ultra_Extreme said:
For performance, as you term it, you want to focus on bodyweight exercises, this will give you the best power to bodyweight ratio, you can pretty much ignore most weight training methods. Concentrate on large numbers of chins, dips, push ups, handstand push ups, sit ups, crunches stuff like that. Only add weight when the reps start getting sill like 50-100. Try to work toward the real strength bodyweight moves like single arm chins and pressups etc.

If you are going for that balanced bruce lee type physique thats the way to do it. Most guys here lift heavier than bodyweight and thus get heavier through muscle mass, but you'll find the strongest of guys on here would struggle to do 20 wide chins, im pretty stron and i can do about 2 :D
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Thanks for the advice so far:)

Im not too strong(im lifting between 70-100lbs depending what im doing) at the moment so would it be a good idea to mix in the higher weight with lower reps with Lots of reps and lower weight+chin ups/pull up/other things like that?
 
Chin ups are great, phenominal exercise.

I reckon I can just about do 20 wide grip chins, as long as it was the first movement in my routine :D

I don't actually weigh anything though lol
 
Wardie said:
Chin ups are great, phenominal exercise.

I reckon I can just about do 20 wide grip chins, as long as it was the first movement in my routine :D

I don't actually weigh anything though lol
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your bodyweight only exists in other dimensions :D

Zip, yeah work on building a good foundation of strength, then concentrate on repeatedly hammering your muscles with lifts and moves that involve your bodyweight. At least thats what i would suggest for your goals, others will prolly turn up and suggest other things no doubt
 
Ultra_Extreme said:
Look at surfers, especially the big wave guys, they arent huge but they have significant muscular size yet they surf for up to 10 hours most days (the pro's) there are no rules in muscle growth except that repeated demand for strength that isnt there promotes it :D

Laird Hamilton

http://www.gotumbleweed.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/laird.jpg[img]

Those are the arms of someone who PADDLES large boards between hawaiian islands for up to 16hours at a time, yet we are told we will shrivel up and die if we do more than 40mins of cardio.[/QUOTE]Yeah, it makes sense seeing as we're just more intelligent animals. 'In the wild' we'd just have to work all day every day so eventually muscle and fitness would grow like that. I guess that's how real strength is grown but like someone said, the way to make the actual muscle grow bigger (but not necessarily proportionately stronger) is to do it like how the weightrainers advise.

Nevermind my random thoughts heh.
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Wardie said:
Chin ups are great, phenominal exercise.

I reckon I can just about do 20 wide grip chins, as long as it was the first movement in my routine :D

I don't actually weigh anything though lol
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These are my fav exercise that and dips :D
Wide grip (or Rocky pulls as I like to call them).
I did them loads, so now have to strap a load of weight to me. I like to rep on about 8 so whatever weight keeps me there is good.

Wardie - have you started adding weight to your chins/pulls/dips?
 
I'm starting to find dips easy, only been back to the gym for 2 weeks after a 3 years off! Think i'm going to have to start adding weight on them, but chins! Omg can't do them for love nor money atm. Whats the best way to get back into them? lat pull downs or use a macine with some assisted weight.
 
Yep do negatives OR as you say use an assisted machine, but really push yourself and drop that weight quick! You'll be ADDING weight in no time ;)
 
Thanks! Did a qwick bit of google work ;) Going to get a bench to stand on, next to the pull up bar tomorrow and wait for the pain on sataday morning :D
 
Ultra_Extreme said:
Those are the arms of someone who PADDLES large boards between hawaiian islands for up to 16hours at a time, yet we are told we will shrivel up and die if we do more than 40mins of cardio.
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I don't know if that is quite fair although I'd agree with the first bit, making demands on muscle that isn't there will usually force it to grow. That probably took him years to achieve so if you want the fast route then limited cardio and heavy weightlifting is probably a better option but as you rightly say not the only option.
 
semi-pro waster said:
I don't know if that is quite fair although I'd agree with the first bit, making demands on muscle that isn't there will usually force it to grow. That probably took him years to achieve so if you want the fast route then limited cardio and heavy weightlifting is probably a better option but as you rightly say not the only option.
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yeah thats the reality, you could be his size in 2 years but he's like 30-odd and been in the water all his life
 
I am getting annoyed with this now. Today was Chest/Tri/Shoulder day, and my lifts were as follows;

Bench: 60kg (yes, not amazing, I know)
Shoulder Press : 55kg
Chest Press machine : 63kg
Tricep pushdown (with the rope thing not sure of name) : 35kg

(A couple of others thrown in for good measure but theyre the main ones, and each doing 4 sets of 8 [1 warmup set] with strict form)

For the time I've been training I'm pretty happy with my strength increases, but still am not seeing any physical change with my body. Weight seems to be stuck at 11.5 stone, even eating 3k clean cals a day and tonnes of protein.

I might just go on a cut, at least then I may see some changes/muscle definition. :(
 
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