Whats happing to the economy?

And only an idiot thinks a house price crash happens in isolation and makes people better off... Prices crash because there's no demand, there's a reason why there's no demand, because people can't afford to move.

How is that being onto a 'winner'?

People who have very large deposits might be better off, but in general I agree.

Everyone was blathering on about supply and demand keeping house prices high and thinking that demand was related to the number of people wanting to buy houses.
In actual fact the demand was related to the amount of credit available to those people wanting to buy houses.

If the credit goes away (as we're seeing signs off now) then house prices may well fall, but it won't make them any easier to buy and in some cases a lot more difficult to buy.
 
People who have very large deposits might be better off, but in general I agree.

Everyone was blathering on about supply and demand keeping house prices high and thinking that demand was related to the number of people wanting to buy houses.
In actual fact the demand was related to the amount of credit available to those people wanting to buy houses.

If the credit goes away (as we're seeing signs off now) then house prices may well fall, but it won't make them any easier to buy and in some cases a lot more difficult to buy.

Exactly my point. Many people here have also been conditioned in the 90's to think housing is cheap, when traditionally getting on the ladder has always been a struggle.
 
Ive just come off a 3.99% fixed rate with Northern Rock and didnt sort out another deal fast enough so went onto their variable rate (forgot as I was on holiday). It went up from £680 to £930 :rolleyes: not a problem but still a bit of a shock. Anyway just sorted out a 2 year fixed rate from First Direct for 5.25% so Im happy :)
 
Ive just come off a 3.99% fixed rate with Northern Rock and didnt sort out another deal fast enough so went onto their variable rate (forgot as I was on holiday). It went up from £680 to £930 :rolleyes: not a problem but still a bit of a shock. Anyway just sorted out a 2 year fixed rate from First Direct for 5.25% so Im happy :)

Good, I am glad you have got it sorted that is a huge increase. Unfortunately it seems many are not in such a good financial situation to make that saving.

Remember we were told that Great Britian had no subprime....

http://www.spectator.co.uk/the-maga...bprime-britain-how-scared-should-you-be.thtml

I wonder how many of these are Northern Rocks?
 
Thing is IF you have been sensible and seen through all that 'buy now or you will never have a house' rubbish then you're on a winner, its only in the last 6 years that house prices have become ridiculous, only a matter of time before the prices are corrected.

Prudence always win through.

Only an idiot thinks that the house prices that we have seen in the last 6 years are healthy, no one benefits. Sadly the majority of the population only see as far as the end of their noses.

Not everyone can sit out 6 years and wait to see what happens, i've had to buy a house and the likelihood is i'll need to move to a bigger one within the next 5 years to accommodate a family.

Nobody likes the current prices but what choice is there, I still personally believe that the demand for houses will avoid any massive price drops, especially in London. Maybe other parts of the country will be hit harder but i've got my fingers crossed.

I've said this many times on this forum, that most people who are hoping for a house price collapse so they can buy on the cheap do not fully appreciate what the real consequences of that will be.
 
I still personally believe that the demand for houses will avoid any massive price drops, especially in London.

You're confused about what demand actually is though, see my post a few above.

Imagine a hypothetical situation where all banks stopped all mortgage lending.
There would still be the same number of people chasing the same number of houses, but prices would fall massively from what they currently are because no-one could afford to buy them.
It's all down to how much credit is available.
 
i'm a tamp at a bank and there is another chap temping here too

on friday they gave him his 1 weeks notice because they cant afford to keep him on irrespective of the work that needs doing

ive read 10k - 20k job loses in the city this year, this is going to be a rough year

they are continually moving operations to india becuase we are too expensive

AVERAGE ANNUAL PAY-INDIA
Project manager: £5,220
Software engineer: £5,344
Accountant: £2,956
Sales rep: £2,464
Production worker: £964
Source: Mercer Human Resource Consulting

we're screwed if you ask me
 
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You're confused about what demand actually is though, see my post a few above.

Imagine a hypothetical situation where all banks stopped all mortgage lending.
There would still be the same number of people chasing the same number of houses, but prices would fall massively from what they currently are because no-one could afford to buy them.
It's all down to how much credit is available.

I would disagree here. You're thinking about it the wrong way round- if credit is available then there will be a lot more buyers (more demand) for the same amount of houses - there would not be the same amount of buyers.
If credit isn't available, people remain where they are until they can afford to move so there's less demand, and prices drop as a result.
 
While supply an demand are the driving forces any economy it's very unlikely that there will be a massive drop in house prices in the near future due to lack of demand.

It's more likely that they will level off at a level just below where they are now and then show minimum growth over the next few years until the market catches up.

That said however it's definitely a buyers market at the moment and anyone not in a chain and that can afford a mortgage has immense power when negotiating a purchase.
 
The economy is in a delicate balance at the moment. The problem with the last real recession was manufacturing jobs were being lost in there 10's of thousands. That left less moey in the economy, less 2 income families and therefore house prices had to drop. We are now a service-based economy, which is actually MORE fagile. If people are worrying about their mortgage, they cut back on the luxuries - nights out, trips to the cinema etc and this will cause a downward spiral of job losses and less money in the economy.

Gordon Brown should be indited for fraud. He has inflated house prices by his actions of the last 10 years. The minimum wage is a ridiculous idea - it means money is worth less in real terms. Let me explain:

Jane worked at her local pub on £3.22/hour in 1998. In 2008 she gets £5.52 now, meaning she has an extra 2.30 per hour. This is an extra £92 per week or around £400 per calander month. In 1998, my large 3-bed semi was worth £59,950. An average mortgage of £50k would have been around £400/month. Now it's worth £159,950 the mortgage is £950 on 142k. Providing Jane's partner's wage has only increased in line with the cost of living (NOT inflation), she is no better off, probably worse off in real terms.

In the 10 years that have elapsed, petrol has increased 100%, bread by 85%, Council tax over 100% so whilst Jane's wage has gone up by 62%, everything else has risen (more) as a result. The only things that haven't really gone up at all are luxury goods, TV's for example. A 28" Sony Trinitron in 1998 would set you back £1k whilst you'll get a great 42" LCD for that. PC's are still the same price, just higher specs. Inflation has therefore been reported artificially low.

The great labour con-trick. Put more money in your hand, take meven more away and then insist how much better off you are because your house is worth 3 times what it was.
 
The minimum wage is a ridiculous idea - it means money is worth less in real terms.

So your trying to say the minimum wage has caused all the price increases? Without the minimum wage people wouldn't even be able to afford what they can now, and we'd have even more immigration.
 
So your trying to say the minimum wage has caused all the price increases? Without the minimum wage people wouldn't even be able to afford what they can now, and we'd have even more immigration.

Why? Of course the minimum wage has had a major impact. There is more money is the economy, therefore people spend more and you get more two-car families, more families can afford houses and thus demand is greaer than supply, leading to higher house prices. There is also the fact that higher wages have allowed more people to get credit, as the bank's scorecards are set up with salary as a major factor (or certainly were until very recently). Finally, as businesses are having to pay more for staff, they simply pass this on to the customer, the same as when diesel goes up the cost of goods in the shops go up as the delivery firm charge the supermarket more and the supermarket charges us more.


Look at my post again, anyone on a minimum wage is still no better off, even though they are earning more. In fact, whilst it has fuelled the economy by making the bottom earners feel better off, all it has done is helped triple house prices and thus was a wholly pointless excersize.
 
Look at my post again, anyone on a minimum wage is still no better off, even though they are earning more. In fact, whilst it has fuelled the economy by making the bottom earners feel better off, all it has done is helped triple house prices and thus was a wholly pointless excersize.

Judging by what I've seen in other countries like the USA I have to disagree.
 
The lower tier in the US are worse off than us i.e. minimum wage people. Its the upper tier in the US that makes you think they are so mch better off than us.

It's the people that aren't on a minimum wage in the US which makes me disagree, waiters etc aren't required to be paid a minimum wage the same way everyone else is and they suffer for it, it's easy to see how much these people struggle because of their low wages compared to people on a minimum wage. Having no minimum wage just leads to tons more people on benefits which is worse for the enonomy.
 
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