Wow did Bush really say this?

[NuclearWinter]

He's probably just said

"Saddam Hussian says - if you don't like what we tell you to believe in, we'll kill ya - which I think is ridiculous"

but it's been manipulated.

I say probably because I'd never seen the speech before.

Pretty much, he actually said:

"Democracies yield an ideology that is based on an ideology that says, people are free -- free to choose. The ideology of the enemy says, a few people will choose, and if you don't like what we tell you to believe in, we'll kill you, or treat you harshly."

 

[[TR]SweetSpotOz]

.

 

[Energize]

I, like you, am too young to vote. Labour would not have received my vote in the last election, had I been old enough though.

The difference between us, it seems, is that you don't understand the right of the nation to vote for who they want. Of course the benefit scroungers want to vote in the people who allow benefit scroungers. Your constant posting about savings suggests to me that you live a very comfortable existence and I'm guessing you are therefore a follower of the "right" side of politics. For every person like you there is a person who will criticise you for voting for your party (I'm guessing Conservative). You seem to be neglecting their right to vote for the party who will benefit them the most. Their criteria for voting is just the same as your's - everyone will vote for the best deal for themselves.

I wouldn't vote for any of the three major parties, not voting at all would be better than that. The problem is a lot of people keep voting for labour or conservative just because they think they are the only ones with a chance of getting in, they are both useless and voting for them is irresponsible and an abuse of free will tbh. Plus labour are a traitor to their own cause with the abolition of the 10p tax rate, meaning I will be paying even more tax when I get a job.

 

[[TR]SweetSpotOz]

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[Energize]

Not voting at all is not better than that. How can it possibly be? It's not like they won't get in power anyway.

Because at least your not supporting them.

They are the only ones with a chance of getting in, realistically. I didn't know there was an "abuse of free will".

If people didn't think that then another party might actually get in. It undermines whe whole point in elections and democracy if only two parties ever get in because no one will bother to vote for the others.

Abolition of 10p tax rate - right so you are going to be earning more money and therefore paying more tax? Shock horror.

I take it you don't understand the tax system then. You don't earn any more money, you just pay more tax because it has gone up from 10% to 20%.

 

[Tefal]

I take it you don't understand the tax system then. You don't earn any more money, you just pay more tax because it has gone up from 10% to 20%.

but didn't it go down from 22p to 20p so if you earned above a certain amount (something like 18k) you actually gain from he change?

 

[Energize]

but didn't it go down from 22p to 20p so if you earned above a certain amount you actually gain from he change?

Yes, but 5 million of the poorest people are now worse off. Hence brown betraying his own cause.

 

[MikeHunt79]

 

[Tefal]

Yes, but 5 million of the poorest people are now worse off.

then 55 million other people are better off?


oh and

they are both useless and voting for them is irresponsible and an abuse of free will tbh.

WHAT THE HELL?

So I guess free will is only right if it's in your favor?

Sounds like something some odd dictator would say before removing voting rights (for the good of the people ofc)

 

[Energize]

then 55 million other people are better off?

55 million people are not better off, anyone in the 40% tax band does not gain. Tax is supposed to be based on who is able to pay, regressive tax hits the people who need the money most.

oh and

WHAT THE HELL?

So I guess free will is only right if it's in your favor?

Sounds like something some odd dictator would say before removing voting rights (for the good of the people ofc)

No, just don't undermine the democracy system by voting for people that you don't really want to see in power or obviously corrupt governments.

 

[[TR]SweetSpotOz]

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[V4NT0M]

I don't vote it's a waste of time, no-one should vote. All parties are essentially the same, they all promise a lot, deliver little and spend a lot of our money.

 

[Energize]

Who benefits if you don't vote?

Other parties get a greater % of the vote, than if you voted for labour.

You said "meaning I will be paying even more tax when I get a job" - so you will start earning (more) money, check and you will be paying more tax, check... Yup, I'm having real difficulty with the "tax system" here. You don't have a job at the moment from what I read so you aren't actually worse off at all. It's like me saying life is rough for me because fuel has gone up from 60p a litre to 118.9p a litre but it's not true because I only started using the stuff in the last couple of months. The starting price is about 115.9p in my eyes and the 10% tax rate as good as never existed for you.

I will still be paying more tax than I otherwise would have, which is what I meant by my original comment. As well as the 5.3 million people who were originally on the 10p rate or only just into the 22p tax rate.

 

[Tefal]

Other parties get a greater % of the vote, than if you voted for labour.

Not really by your method you'd only be voting if you wanted one of the big parties to win, so they would get all the votes (as every one else wouldn't vote ) :/

 

[Energize]

Not really by your method you'd only be voting if you wanted one of the big parties to win, so they would get all the votes (as every one else wouldn't vote ) :/

I never said everyone votes labour or conversative. Your being ridiculous now.