Another 3DMark06 score check...

[easyrider]

It does improve gameplay for games that support it.

But 99% of people in the know and with extensive knowledge of PC hardware would always choose the faster single card solution.

Heat, power all impact on maxing out your hardware.

SLI gives little gains.

I have tried it

Tested countless C2D mobo's

and was hugely dissapointed with the results.

 

[Dark_Angel]

Somewhat off topic,

Easy, I noticed you got your Q6600 to 4GHZ in 3d mark, what is the Maximus Formula like as a motherboard, and is that overclock on air (if so which cooler may I ask?).

 

[V|per]

But you got sent 2 by mistake (I await the moral police about not sending it back any moment now)

But what we are saying is that going the mid card route straight away (in other words ordering right now 2 8800 gt's) is pointless, and it is better to get the high end card.

If you have a large display, and get 2 of the best cards, or you can get a second card real cheap, then I think thats viable. As long as you know you won't get twice the performance. (which clearly you do).

As for the water cooling, I still think thats a bit of a bad argument.

Firstly, you can reuse the water cooling setup on a rig in a year from now (maybe just change the cooler for the CPU, but everything else will be ok).

Secondly, I think there aren't many people who would buy an E2180 or similar to put it under water (unless they had the water cooling from a previous build) or they are one of those guys that buys a chip just to see what they can squeeze out of it, such as some of the people on xtremesystems forums. (which is fair play to them, as long as they like it).

'tis a very good arguement there actually...

My only retort would be that i would have bought a 2nd 88gts the following month, and at the time of purchase (release day...) they were top end (bar the ultra and gtx, which, at the price range they were at the time, didn't give me enough performance increase over the gts 512.. infact, i sold the ultra i had for £400 a couple of weeks earlier with the intention of getting 2 gts's.. where i only spent £280 on them including water blocks... With the res and detail levels i use, i call that a worthy upgrade

But yeah, generally speaking, no point...

 

[easyrider]

Somewhat off topic,

Easy, I noticed you got your Q6600 to 4GHZ in 3d mark, what is the Maximus Formula like as a motherboard, and is that overclock on air (if so which cooler may I ask?).

Maximus Formula : Best C2D mobo I have tested to date.

Water Apex ultra water kit.

Always maxed every chip I have thrown at it.

Never needed to go custom.


Had it since the P5WDH days!

 

[Dark_Angel]

'tis a very good arguement there actually...

My only retort would be that i would have bought a 2nd 88gts the following month, and at the time of purchase (release day...) they were top end (bar the ultra and gtx, which, at the price range they were at the time, didn't give me enough performance increase over the gts 512.. infact, i sold the ultra i had for £400 a couple of weeks earlier with the intention of getting 2 gts's.. where i only spent £280 on them including water blocks... With the res and detail levels i use, i call that a worthy upgrade

But yeah, generally speaking, no point...

Truthfully, if I did the whole SLI thing with say a pair of 8800 Ultras when they first came out (ignoring the price for a moment) I would be pretty damn happy because the performance is so good. (despite the aforementioned SLI drawbacks) I guess you could still play almost anything maxed.

Then again, those that purchased 8800 ULTRA SLI for crysis must be a bit sad :/

I think top end SLI is ok, maybe even tri SLI if literally money is completely no object at all, I just think the mid range SLI is not worth it.

Though, I have always wanted to do bottom road SLI, literally get 2 of the lowest end cards possible and SLI them, and do crazy mods to them on a test system for fun. When I replace my P5N-E SLI with a nicer motherboard, I might well get a cheap CPU and do just that.

Further off topic, I need to start using water cooling I think... I know very little about it at the moment, but the subject has long been interesting to me... with OCUK now stocking a larger variety of parts I may have to look in to it further.

 

[Dark_Angel]

Maximus Formula : Best C2D mobo I have tested to date.

Water Apex ultra water kit.

Always maxed every chip I have thrown at it.

Never needed to go custom.


Had it since the P5WDH days!

[IMGhttp://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k224/easyrider_01/PICT0569.jpg[/IMG]

[IMGhttp://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k224/easyrider_01/PICT0570.jpg[/IMG]

That is actually a nice setup, I will have to do some further research on water and figure out how much of a boost I would get from good air. Better not pull this thread any more of topic than it already is though

*last thing*

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=WC-014-SW that the kit ?

 

[easyrider]

That is actually a nice setup, I will have to do some further research on water and figure out how much of a boost I would get from good air. Better not pull this thread any more of topic than it already is though

*last thing*

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=WC-014-SW that the kit ?

It will allow you to max any chip you want.

Thats the one.


Best 150 I have ever spent.

No hassle when changing cpu's mobo's etc..

Could never go air again (shudders)


There is a bit of snobbery with Kits but I have always kept up with the customs kits with a difference in a couple of degrees C under load. Meaning nothing what so ever to the limits of the clocks.

Either CPU gives up or ram or FSB before the kit can ever cool it.

 

[GunRunner]

I read that as "unless you are doing tons of tasks at the same time as rendering a video, you may as well get dual core".

You read it wrong then didnt you? Age and experience shows without doubt forum posting is the clunkiest most misunderstood form of communication. Even a punctuation mark in the wrong place (such as ? or !) when the opposite should have been used changes the emphasis.

I found this really odd, because most games are GPU limited

Most but not all! Not in my case and that is why I keep on harping about IL2.

Of course every purchase in the history of the universe is opinion, but myself and a lot of other people are in the train of thought it is better to have 1 really fast card than 2 mid range ones.

...and it all boils down to what you call a really fast card and a mid range one at the time of purchasing the second one if it is a lot later such as mine was.

 

[Dark_Angel]

You read it wrong then didnt you? Age and experience shows without doubt forum posting is the clunkiest most misunderstood form of communication. Even a punctuation mark in the wrong place (such as ? or !) when the opposite should have been used changes the emphasis.

Well, then I highly recommend you write things better and don't reply with one sentence. And if you didn't mean that what did you mean ? All you simply said was that Dual core performance was good enough, and stated that unless you run multiple creative apps at once then you get no increase.

Most but not all! Not in my case and that is why I keep on harping about IL2.

Yes, crysis and several others do to. But then it doesn't make it good value for money ?

...and it all boils down to what you call a really fast card and a mid range one at the time of purchasing the second one if it is a lot later such as mine was.

I will do my best to understand what you just wrote there.

Basically, the bottom line still remains. As we keep going around and around. I don't see why you keep arguing the point ? I am not saying it is useless, I (and others in the thread) are all saying this:

Top end SLI = when the cards are first released (for example 2x 8800 GTX's on release) on LARGE screens (1920x1200 AT LEAST).

a "dirty" upgrade = you own a 7900 gt now, and see one going cheap and get the second one just to tide you over - after all it only costs you 30 pounds.

Mid range SLI, such as say if I was to order 2 x 8800 GT right this second, is pointless.

As mentioned tons of times:

Cons: SLI scales badly, can inpact performance on overclocking because of heat, is expensive, requires tons of power, disables the use of a second monitor, plus a few other things like not all games support it.

It's pro's: It is faster, so if you can afford to buy 2 x 280 GTX's, for your 30" dell, because you want crysis (or whatever game) to run with everything turned on, and the money is not really that much to you, then by all means grab it.

*EDIT*

Oh, and please stop coming across as so defensive in your posts. If you are enjoying the cards, great. But it doesn't change the fact that most in the know agree that SLI is only good in certain conditions.

You have made several "joking" insults in your posts to me, and I have not made 1 such thing on you. Other than the Quad core comment in a previous post, if you wish to debate, fine and fair enough, but please do so in a manner which doesn't come across as rude or "I am right, and everyone is wrong" way.

 

[easyrider]

Gunrunner is trolling here I feel.

 

[Dark_Angel]

Gunrunner is trolling here I feel.

I have no problems with debating with someone, but he has done this same thing in numerous threads, and some of his replies make no sense, or he posts 1 sentence replies, doesn't explain himself, and then comes across defensive if you question him afterwards :/

*edit*

By the way, thanks for the tips easy look for my "I am a noob to watercooling" thread coming soon lol.

 

[easyrider]

By the way, thanks for the tips easy look for my "I am a noob to watercooling" thread coming soon lol.

 

[GunRunner]

Gunrunner is trolling here I feel.

I have no problems with debating with someone, but he has done this same thing in numerous threads, and some of his replies make no sense, or he posts 1 sentence replies, doesn't explain himself, and then comes across defensive if you question him afterwards :/

*edit*

By the way, thanks for the tips easy look for my "I am a noob to watercooling" thread coming soon lol.

Kids Think outside the box boys! You try to come across as the experts..... as we have said for years in the trade...forum experts and nothing else. I see you will be a water cooling expert in 10 posts or so or when you have read a bit more on it on other forums.

 

[Dark_Angel]

Kids Think outside the box boys! You try to come across as the experts..... as we have said for years in the trade...forum experts and nothing else. I see you will be a water cooling expert in 10 posts or so or when you have read a bit more on it on other forums.

And once again you post an insult.

I gather that means you aren't going to debate any further ?

To indulge you for a moment:

As for coming across as an expert, I am quite happily in an IT job working for a company, thank you very much.

As for water cooling, I understand how the basics work, but never really bothered to look in to it. I have become more interested in it recently after seeing some of the nice kit OCUK have and a few overclocking projects on xtremeforums.

Finally, if I do not know much about a certain subject, I have no concern about asking.

As for you constant posts calling myself and others a child, I think its pretty poor show of character from you. But whatever honestly, end of the day your being wrong doesn't affect me to much

 

[GunRunner]

I gather that means you aren't going to debate any further ?

Far from it! The reason I did what I did was because all you did was rubbish what I said withour acknowledging another point of view...but there you go...that is what tends to happen with a so called single point of view poster.

As for you constant posts calling myself and others a child, I think its pretty poor show of character from you. But whatever honestly, end of the day your being wrong doesn't affect me to much

Never constant..once when you acted immature! Your singular point of view that a particular processor is better than another also gets tiring.

But I think enough is enough, you are the expert from whichever angle it is looked at. Goodbye.

 

[Dark_Angel]

Far from it! The reason I did what I did was because all you did was rubbish what I said withour acknowledging another point of view...but there you go...that is what tends to happen with a so called single point of view poster.



Never constant..once when you acted immature! Your singular point of view that a particular processor is better than another also gets tiring.

But I think enough is enough, you are the expert from whichever angle it is looked at. Goodbye.

Yes... a single point of view I share obviously :/

My view is the general one of most of people on the forum, and am telling you how I see things to do with SLI. (which I never said by the way is bad, I just said it scales badly, and stated that I think it isn't that good with mid range stuff, and best on high end "best card isn't good enough" situations.

I also stated that as long as you are happy with the performance gains, great, but in general SLI isn't as good as one fast card, unless the fastest card out simply isn't fast enough then SLI is your only choice.

My single point of view on a CPU ? How so ?

Everyone has their opinion, and in creative work the Q6600 is simply a lot better. Most games now are going to be GPU bound and so even if the games don't take advantage of multi core as well as say supreme commander, you only lose a few frames a second in most games anyway. See here http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/248327-10-overclocked-q6600-e8400-compared-benchmarks-included

If all you are doing is gaming, then the E8400 is a great chip, but if you do anything else I prefer the Q6600.

My goal is to give people who ask what should they buy options, I present them with benchmarks, and try to inform them enough to make their choice. If someone is going to spend the best part of 1000 pounds on a PC I just want them to get the best system they can for the money. Which at the end of the day, you need to offer people choices and out of all the info given to them they can then figure out what to buy for themselves.

I have given you tons of points, and rather than counter them you move on to something else, then tell me I have 1 single point of view and then start with insults. The point of these forums and the reason I come here is to share info, and learn... as well as in general relax and have a bit of fun.