4870 1GB vs. GTX280 First Impressions

[Fire Wizard]

I can't see the logic behind that tbh. The 4870x2 is a card on its own until NV release another dual GPU card. The 200 series are NVidia's latest cores, the 4000 series are ATI's and hence should be compared as such. 260 vs 4850 (both cut down versions of the high end cards), 280 vs 4870 (both premier single GPU cards) and 4870x2 vs 260/280GX2 (both dual GPU cards should NV ever release it). Compare any other way and you are comparing apples to oranges.

Price vs performance ATI win
Raw performance NV win

Hello w3bbo, I honestly can't see your reasoning behind what you have just said to be honest. Care to elaborate a bit more please?

 

[w3bbo]

Hello w3bbo, I honestly can't see your reasoning behind what you have just said to be honest. Care to elaborate a bit more please?

Sorry but I've had a long day, is that sarcasm?

I think that people get the notion about NV drivers being better than ATI is that NV release the virtually the same card and just use a different name for them.

I will agree that NV do release new cards with very little difference between them but having a driver that is cross compatible without the need for monthly updates is surely a good thing. Why fix what isn't broken (unless it is in ATI's case).

 

[Fire Wizard]

Sorry but I've had a long day, is that sarcasm?

Hello w3bbo, not at all. I honestly don't really understand your reasoning behind what you just said. When you are looking at purchasing a graphics card, the very first thing you have to take into account is how much you are willing to spend. You then compare all of the graphics cards within that price range and choose the better card. So really, I fail to see why you would compare a £190 graphics card to a £300 one in the first place just because those particular units are the "premium" range of both companies.

 

[Boogle]

Fact that we are comparing a 4870 to a gtx280 says it all really as the 4870 was meant to be matched against the 260 with the X2 taking on the 280. Personally while maybe nvidia are consistent i have had so much trouble with them in the past as have many others. Ati is the choice for me and an X2 i don't think is going to disppoint me.

You're reading too much into this - I just don't have a GTX260. I do have a GTX280 though. As for the rest - excellent! Its crazy, but some people just get on better with certain brands. I can certainly see why people prefer ATI, but I can also see why people prefer NV. There is no shame in having a preference (mine is to NV).

You mean like the 8800GT then 8800GTS then the 9800GT then the 9800GTX + then the GTX 260 then the GTX 216....

I think that people get the notion about NV drivers being better than ATI is that NV release the virtually the same card and just use a different name for them.

New cards have nothing to do with drivers. Unless you're implying they're all the same architecture wise. In which case both sets of drivers should be equally mature since the 4870 is just a 2900XT with more shaders and a antialiasing unit. The GTX280 is just an 8800GTX with more shader units. Both architectures beafed up the performance of each shader too, but ATI certainly have the crown for the biggest increase in shader units and TUs - the 48xx series have dramatically increased the counts.

As for the GTX260 and GTX216 - they almost differ more than the 4850 and 4870 do The 4870 is exactly the same card as the 4850, except with different memory chips, and better power regulation. If you downclock a 4870, you have, for all intents and purposes, a 4850. The 216 if you downclock - will still outperform the 260 since it has 1 extra block of shader units.

 

[w3bbo]

Hello w3bbo, not at all. I honestly don't really understand your reasoning behind what you just said. When you are looking at purchasing a graphics card, the very first thing you have to take into account is how much you are willing to spend. You then compare all of the graphics cards within that price range and choose the better card. So really, I fail to see why you would compare a £190 graphics card to a £300 one in the first place just because those particular units are the "premium" range of both companies.

When I compare GPU's I prefer to compare like for like not simply cost for cost. Obviously there are going to be comparisons between the GTX280 and the 4870x2 as both cards are the top cards for each respective company AT THE MOMENT but that does not make it truly 'comparable' unless cost is your major comparitive point in which case you wouldn't be buying top end anyway.

If/when NV release a 260/280GX2 that will (and rightly so) be compared to the 4870x2 as they are both the same tech. At this moment in time the 280 and 4870 are the same tech (single GPU) and as such I compare performance on that basis.

 

[ashmanuk67]

I had a 2900xt which i thought was ok but now i have just bought the 4870 1gig WOW i think it is very fast, I have never had an NV card but I am sure they are very good.

for me i could not afford the extra money so the 4870 is amazing.

Just one more thing, V sync is something that you should not do, well so i have been told, but i tryed this on my new card and i could not belive what i was seeing.

Yes the FPS went down to 60 because thats what my monitor is as standard, but how smooth was that image and felt as though everything was in focus absolute dream.

I have tried this on other cards i have had in the past and all i ever got was very bad mouse lag but not this time.

IF YOU HAVE A 4870 PLEASE TRY THIS AND TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK...

 

[TNA]

IF YOU HAVE A 4870 PLEASE TRY THIS AND TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK...

v-sync is awesome in most games. I like it coz it stop tearing by locking the frames to say 60. Like for example, in Half Life 2 - Episode 2 I get like between 150-200fps everything maxed out, including AA and AF. But if you move from left to right quickly you see tearing. So I set V-Sync on and it drop to 60 constant and this stop the tearing and I end up with buttery smooth gameplay

But in Crysis for example I get more smooth gameplay with it off. So best try with it on and off in all games to see which you prefer

 

[ashmanuk67]

Thanks TNA,

I will re load half life 2 and lost coast and give V sync a go........

 

[sarge78]

Snip

Thanks for the best explanation of the different architectures Boogle

The 216 if you downclock - will still outperform the 260 since it has 1 extra block of shader units.

This is isn't quite true for gaming as they still have the same number of ROPs on the chip (The final step of rendering the data into pixels) So 216 owners won't see a large increase in fps (as reported in reviews) but it should perform more consistently (something that's been overlooked).
________
Harley-davidson flstf

 

[easyrider]

New cards have nothing to do with drivers. Unless you're implying they're all the same architecture wise. In which case both sets of drivers should be equally mature since the 4870 is just a 2900XT with more shaders and a antialiasing unit. The GTX280 is just an 8800GTX with more shader units. Both architectures beafed up the performance of each shader too, but ATI certainly have the crown for the biggest increase in shader units and TUs - the 48xx series have dramatically increased the counts.

As for the GTX260 and GTX216 - they almost differ more than the 4850 and 4870 do The 4870 is exactly the same card as the 4850, except with different memory chips, and better power regulation. If you downclock a 4870, you have, for all intents and purposes, a 4850. The 216 if you downclock - will still outperform the 260 since it has 1 extra block of shader units.

Its not quite as simple as that.

And a GTX280 is not just an 8800GTX with more shader units.

Thats like saying the 8800GTS 640MB is just the same as a 8800GT 512mb when in fact they have different cores.

 

[easyrider]

Obviously there are going to be comparisons between the GTX280 and the 4870x2 as both cards are the top cards for each respective company AT THE MOMENT but that does not make it truly 'comparable' unless cost is your major comparitive point in which case you wouldn't be buying top end anyway.
.

Yes, but I buy top end and have done for years but it still comes into the notion of how much faster...

I'm not stupid and the extra cost of a 280GTX is not worth the extra over the 4870.

This is exactly the same saying I have a 4ghz Q6600 ...why would I bother going to a 4ghz Q9550?

Reason being the 200mhz gain and the instruction sets of the 45nm part does not warrant the extra 100 or so if you already have a 4ghz Q6600.

Same can be said for GFX.

Fact is 280 is not top end...but it commands a top end price.

If price wasn't a factor then all of us "Top end users" would not be running 280's but X2's.

 

[queamin]

Ati and nvidia are comparing 9800/+ to the 4850 and the 260 to the 4870 because of price and speed, the trouble is the 280 it is between the 4870 and the x2 in price and a lot of times with speed aswell.

 

[easyrider]

Ati and nvidia are comparing 9800/+ to the 4850 and the 260 to the 4870 because of price and speed, the trouble is the 280 it is between the 4870 and the x2 in price and a lot of times with speed aswell.

The 280 is overpriced for what it is.

4870 beats it in some games.


It needs to drop in price and the arrival of the 4850x2 will see this overpriced card get put correctly into rank.

 

[w3bbo]

Yes, but I buy top end and have done for years but it still comes into the notion of how much faster...

I'm not stupid and the extra cost of a 280GTX is not worth the extra over the 4870.

This is exactly the same saying I have a 4ghz Q6600 ...why would I bother going to a 4ghz Q9550?

Reason being the 200mhz gain and the instruction sets of the 45nm part does not warrant the extra 100 or so if you already have a 4ghz Q6600.

Same can be said for GFX.

Fact is 280 is not top end...but it commands a top end price.

If price wasn't a factor then all of us "Top end users" would not be running 280's but X2's.

I had a 4Ghz Q6600 - sold it for 45nm. I also have not one but 2x GTX 280's. 'Worth' is a matter of personal opinion and personal circumstances.

Call me a fool but I couldn't be happier with my setup choice atm.

 

[easyrider]

I had a 4Ghz Q6600 - sold it for 45nm. I also have not one but 2x GTX 280's. 'Worth' is a matter of personal opinion and personal circumstances.

Call me a fool but I couldn't be happier with my setup choice atm.

I sold my Q6600 for 45nm but 1000's didn't just like 1000's won't go to Nehalem as it offers liitle gains.

Nehalem is faster,but worth the extra?

I'm not calling anyone a fool but top end is FASTEST CARD THAT EXISTS.

Thats my point.

X2 being that very card.

Until NV realease this and until that it means nothing.

 

[JediFragger]

I love the 4870 1GB, it sits between the 260 (216) and 280 performance-wise and only costs £190

Thanks for the write-up Boogle, we all appreciate it and the work you put in

 

[easyrider]

I love the 4870 1GB, it sits between the 260 (216) and 280 performance-wise and only costs £190

Thanks for the write-up Boogle, we all appreciate it and the work you put in

Indeed,

The 4870 1GB is the card to buy as paying the extra for 280 will see limited gains.


And certainly won't see your dollars go further when purchasing the 280

 

[queamin]

The 280 is overpriced for what it is.

4870 beats it in some games.


It needs to drop in price and the arrival of the 4850x2 will see this overpriced card get put correctly into rank.

Yeah it is really it was a cracking price a while ago but has crept up again as the x2 has not really dropped in price.

I am in 2 minds about the 4850x2 if it priced just under the 280 then I do think the 280 would be better buy but if it is just over the £200/220 then it should be a cracking card, we wait and see.

 

[w3bbo]

I sold my Q6600 for 45nm but 1000's didn't just like 1000's won't go to Nehalem as it offers liitle gains.

Nehalem is faster,but worth the extra?

I'm not calling anyone a fool but top end is FASTEST CARD THAT EXISTS.

Thats my point.

X2 being that very card.

Until NV realease this and until that it means nothing.

Of course it is top end. Sure, the 280 is not the fastest CARD but like I said earlier, it is different tech to the x2. Single gpu vs dual GPU. Its like comparing single core cpu's to dual cores or dual cores to quad cores - apples to oranges.

Top end is exactly that - The top end of the GPU market. Plural not singular. Is the 260GTX not a high end card then because the 4870 is 'high end'? Is the 9800GTX not a 'mid range' card because the 4850 is 'mid range'?

Until all the quirks and compatability issues have been worked out with dual GPU cards, I am happy to work with 2x TOP END single GPU cards.

 

[easyrider]

Of course it is top end. Sure, the 280 is not the fastest CARD but like I said earlier, it is different tech to the x2. Single gpu vs dual GPU. Its like comparing single core cpu's to dual cores or dual cores to quad cores - apples to oranges.

Its not,

Dual core Cpu's at 4.5 ghz are faster in 99% of games but it doesn't make it faster than my 4ghz Q9450 in everything else.

2 x 4850's at 220 quid are faster than a 280GTX

Keep things simple

The Gap over the two cards in question...(4870 and 280) is so small it doesn't warrant the extra cost.

This is a clear concept to understand.

If one wants to negate cost...then why have a 280 in the first place as its not the fastest card for the money.