Who will be back first? - Frustrated Gunner's fans here...

Greenlizard0 said:
Just reading about it now and it truely is saddening. Henry liked him on the left, and I remember the Frenchman saying he could eventually fill Pires' boots. If you recall his heydays, then that's quite a complement. I think he did play last season, and it was Rosicky, Fabregas, Flamini and Hleb. That's an awesome midfield and it's a pity we never really saw much more of it.

I have got to say if he doesn't play before this calender year is out then he's got to go. For all the talk that Wenger has given us about wage structure, I really think it's nonsense to keep somebody on the books who's given so little back.
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I mean I know it's fairly well acknowledged that sports journalists tend to be a bit jealous of the careers they routinely write about, but I mean come on. Choose a better picture of the young lad!
 
Green, most likely his wages are paid out by the insurance company, or a large amount of it, though for every long term player out injured premiums go up massively.

Remember how when Owen got injured Newcastle fought to have Englands insurance pay his wages rather than their own insurance as its really not their fault and shouldn't really have to pay higher premium's.

The amount insurance companies must get out of football clubs has to be insane though, but either way, we're probably not shelling out full whack for Rosicky's wages right now.


Now for the happy news, rather than stick with the fantastic, highly mobile, dangerous anywhere Vela this weekend WEnger is rating Adebayor at 50/50 to play against Villa, so we can get straight back to crappy attacking footie again woo.

Wenger just doesn't use his head, he's talking about risking one of his favourite players instead of just playing Bendtner, Vela, Jay, or anyone else, how much do you think thats going to hurt Vela's and Bendtner's confidence, you played well but you're dropped instantly as I'd prefer to play an injured player and risk hurting him further rather than play your sorry ass.

Thats bad enough to completely crap on your young players, but yet again he's risking rushing someone back in when theres really no need and at the expense of hurting other players confidence, theres just no logic in it.

Especially as Cuellar isn't the fastest defender even though he isn't very good, Adebayor isn't great in the air and Laursen is one of the best in the league so a very fast Vela would most likely work sooo much better than Adebayor. What is his problem with risking injured players constantly, has it ever worked, ever?
 
Tunney said:
Is Vela ready for the Premiership? Surely he'll just get kicked all game?
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He's not 17, he's played against Wigan and Sheffield Utd, the former most certainly being more of a physical side, whose going to be worse in the premiership?

the very brief bits he's been given so much he's been very good, well one performance he got 10mins or so and was very good, I think he came on in a champs league game, Fenerbache maybe and was very good, one other prem performance was at the end of a dead game we sucked in IIRC and he didn't do much.

He played for years in mexico, he's been in Spain for 3 years playing lots of first team football, I can't think of a single reason he wouldn't be ready.

Quite frankly Ramsey especially looks strong enough to play in the prem also and Wilshire has showed in every one of his games that despite his size he's very strong, fights hard, wins tackles and retains the ball under heavy pressure from established top league players and internationals, even he seems ready for the premiership, Vela i would worry about the least of the 3.
 
I dont think Vela will start just because he's not that type of striker, I would imagine however fit Ade is this weekend he will play Bendtner and Van Persie with Vela on the bench. As for Wilshere I think he could play in the premiership also, he's a real bulldog in the tackles and shows no fear, Ramsey still needs a while longer for me as sometimes he can lose possession a lot and sometimes he's a master, anyway I am enjoying Denilson get a run, looks 10x the player he was when flamini was here.
 
Frankly Sagna was a demi god last year till his injury, he hasn't looked the same since, you guessed it, he was rushed back for a bunch of completely unimportant games when we were basically safe in our place and no way going to win.

he just hasn't looked the same, doesn't get down the wing as much and has missed a few games from injury, his latest injury he was, you guess it, rushed back in again. Now this time we are incredibly short at the back. But was it worth losing Sagna for another month, than waiting one extra game and maybe going Clichy right back and Gibbs left back. Or hell, I can't stand Song but he's been perfectly happy to play him all over till he has the chance to push someone who is still coming back from injury at that point its all about making the wrong choice.

I give up, we were utter crap. You only have to look at easily, i mean easily our two best performances of the season, Wigan, and Sheffield, frankly we've played worse teams than both Wigan and Sheffield in the prem this year and sucked, or been soundly beaten.

Theo was yet again, nowhere, easily lost the ball rarely made the right choice, frequently crap crosses or poor passes or simply not using his pace. bendtner, time and time again looks great, with Theo, Eduardo or Vela INFRONT OF HIM> he's set up great goals for all of them, he's even scored lots of goals, but he's a late run into the box guy, not the guy up front, he never has been, never will be and constantly gets played in the wrong position. Diaby's so far had realistically, half a good game against Fenerbache and looked less than match fit and, dangerously close to getting ared card for awful tackles in all the games he's played.

Its getting boring, and points wise, we're only two wins off midtable and the team Wenger constantly plays is just crap, no balance, its just no good. Toure again didn't start, not sure why yet, in favour of Silvestre/gallas, which does infact leave a player who is defensive, fast, able to pass, a freaking machine in terms of running all game and likes to get forward, so we've got someone far more suited to def midfield than Denilson but again, Denilson gets played.

I can't make head nor tails of it but this team since the very very first preseason game had the exact same problems it has now and he's fixed none of them.

Villa are about to take our 4th place and Everton, if they can sort their defence which seems to be on the way to happening are gaining strength. Villa also look consistantly good with a couple of completely out of character poor performances, we on the other hand look consistantly bad and have only had a few good games aswell as the fact we've had a damn easy start to the season while Villa haven't, we're on our way down the table and Villa are on the way up, as our games get harder and theirs get easier, I can't see how thats going to change right now.


In that game, Laursen was simply outstanding as he is 9/10 games, he's the best in the air in the league, bar none. So having Bendtner up front not in his favoured position whose better with the ball at his feet, then bringing on Adebayor was always, always the wrong choice. Laursen is good but he hasn't got that much pace, Davies is very easy to force into having a bad game and Cuellar, again good but without a huge amount of pace, LUke Young, very little pace, so we play our two slowest strikers and don't remotely consider Vela, who has been outstanding every second I've seen, or Theo, who is a damn striker and all but useless on the wing.

These are really simple decisions, simple tactical things to do, slowish defence fantastic in the air, play the slow tall guys who aren't great in the air, or the fast small guys who are good with their feet? is it really that hard, so how does Wenger get it wrong every single damn game now.

Vela, Ramsey, Wilshire are all playing much better than their counterparts right now so why the hell aren't they in the team? Why is it players can do well in the cup but will be constantly overlooked for the first team then sold without a real run in the team except 10 mins in a game we've lost already. I said it 4, 3 ,2years ago , i've been saying it this year and I'm saying it now, Wengers completely lost it, we've no chance of winning anything under him, he won't get better again, he's actually incredibly reluctant to give players a chance unless forced to through injury.

I just give up, how can most arsenal fans identify a problem in the first preseason game, its still not remotely close to being fixed and Wenger completely denies theres any problem at all?

I honestly don't care if we lose, I do care about relegation but we aren't remotely close to that at all. I care about watching my team play good football. If we lose to villa, play great football and get unlucky, thats life. But we were just utter crap, we didn't look good defensively, or offensively, we were dominated, at home by another team. We were pushed around all game and every single weakness in the side was completely apparent, yet the subs made little/no sense at all.

Its all well and good, and literally fine by me to watch a year of great football and win nothing, at the end of the day the jubliation of winning the league lasts a couple hours or, till you sober up. Watching the 90mins every week needs to be enjoyable and is far more important to me. But we won't win anything and we're playing crappy football doing that. We're not playing what we seem to know is "wenger" football, all out attack? all out panicking defense would be a more appropriate description of most of our games.
 
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Weebull said:
holy cow thats bigger than my screen
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Moreso, I was bored enough to do a word count of drunkenmasters posts in this thread.

11,100 words. That's more than my uni disertation.

Kudos, drunkenmaster, you are either dedicated or obsessed with Arsenal. I'm not quite there but I hope they sort themselves out, the last run of form has been diabolical.

P.S I am quite aware how sad I am.
 
thats ok, i don't have to point out that counting them was as sad as me. meh, i just c&p'd all my posts anyway.

I think the biggest problem is far, far, far too many Arsenal fans simply trust Wenger, won't say a word against him and that support makes him untouchable. We need to not be quiet at home but let him know its not acceptable by being loud and I don't know, letting him know he needs to do better, letting the board know getting rid of him is acceptable , etc, etc.

Silence, and lack of critism in press/from fans of Wenger is doing no one any good, least of all Wengers, he's ruining his reputation. He's completey lost his way and he will only become known as the guy that had a good run but went 8 years without winning anything and made Arsenal a poor, midtable club which doesn't sell out anymore, doesn't play good football, doesn't win and can't attract big players. hardly good for us or him. He needs to go, while he still has not a bad record, and while we still can get in someone good who could keep us in the champs league, every game this year simply seems to confirm we won't be good enough to stay in the top 4 under him.

The irony is, one of a very few select managers you could hopefully count on for old style Wenger all attack football is, Scolari :( I'm not really remotely sure who else I'd go for. Phil Brown is brilliant at what he does as a manager, he's fantastic at getting a good squad of budget players together, but that doesn't always translate to running a big club with more need for rotation with full cup runs in 3 cups over the league including Euro travel and spending and buying big.

He's very very brave with his attacking approach at any club away or home, very very few managers, Wenger included now, have the balls to go hard attacking away at the Emirates or Old Trafford.
 
We're you at the game on Saturday? Believe me the fans are not quiet. Those who were actually trying to support the team and get something from them were negated by the typical plastic joes who only started supporting the team in 99.

You had fans screaming at Bendtner for example everytime he got the ball. The fella had a bad game (and tbh I personally don't think he is good enough) but he didn't get the chance and he wasn't the only one. There is no doubt that Arsene is aware that fans weren't happy. Why would you think he wouldn't know? He looked pretty unhappy himself at the press conference afterwards.

I'm also not sure what footballing world you live in but the press have absolutely hammered him recently (even Roy Keane came to his defence in the Guardian I believe it was) and the big one's like Sky constantly harp on about the failings of the club and manager (interspersed with some compliments from the odd pundit who knows what he is talking about). Its things like the two comments you have made there where you haven't researched much first that make me think you are just a troll.

The problem on Saturday had nothing to do with anything you have mentioned and everything to do with desire. Is this something for Wenger to sort out? Yes. Regardless, you are wrong. Even never say die players like Fabregas seemed to be walking about in a dream (and he has been similar all season tbh). His heart just didn't seem in it at all and he wasn't the only one. This was exactly the same team who gave ManU a great game a week earlier and so a lot of your reasoning is flawed. The 11 that were put out were good enough to win the game but for whatever the reason, we didn't have the same desire that we had just 7 days before. Attitude, not ability, formations or tactics, was the problem. You could see it in the players faces.

You mention that you have been more knowledgeable about whats going on at the club and how to play football than Wenger for 4 years now. Does that include last season? We were quite simply amazing last season and only missed out on the PL because of a dip in energy and some bad luck.

Not forcing Vela, Wilshere, Ramsey etc into a pressure situation where everyone is expecting them to turn our season around is the right thing to do. Believe me some of the numpty's up at the Grove would turn on Vela in an instant if god forbid he didn't perform.

The kids beat very poor Sheff Utd and Wigan teams. Wigan couldn't be arsed in all fairness. You mentioned about them being a more physical side but surely you saw the game? They never got physical with our boys at all and Wilshere was pushing guys twice his size around for fun. The Vela run for Simpsons second said it all. That same commited Wigan player in a league game on Saturday would have put Vela and the ball into row Z no question. The lads did play well but there is no way that those players, week in and week out, could compete in the Premiership at the moment (and neither should they have to).

Come on about Phil Brown. Of course he is brave. He has just come up and is expected to go back down. What does he have to lose going to places like OT and having a go, especially with the momentum some promoted teams come up with? Look at Reading. The comparison is nonsense. The top 4 are under pressure every game to remain top 4.

As said before I think your expectations are too high. No one should expect their team to either play great football or win something. Its unrealistic and most teams don't even have that luxury and haven't for years. You need to appreciate what we have seen a bit more since Wenger has arrived and support the club through the difficult times (like most fans do).
 
just ignore drunkenfools rambles, unlike most people who goto to the toilet to do their business he releases it in here in text form.

to say wenger has completely lost it is laughable, we just need some reinforcements to improve the balance in the side......i do think his decision to give captaincy to Gallas was a mistake of epic proportions but that's a discussion for another time as i'm still waking up.

and as for Phil Brown, just LMAO ....a few seasons back i guess Steve Coppell would have been the messiah or more recently Sven for the first 1/3 of the season. Dollars to donuts Hull will finish the season at a more realistic place and drunkenfool will turn his attentions so someone else who is getting high praise from the idiotic press machine.
 
marscay said:
just ignore drunkenfools rambles, unlike most people who goto to the toilet to do their business he releases it in here in text form.

to say wenger has completely lost it is laughable, we just need some reinforcements to improve the balance in the side......i do think his decision to give captaincy to Gallas was a mistake of epic proportions but that's a discussion for another time as i'm still waking up.

and as for Phil Brown, just LMAO ....a few seasons back i guess Steve Coppell would have been the messiah or more recently Sven for the first 1/3 of the season. Dollars to donuts Hull will finish the season at a more realistic place and drunkenfool will turn his attentions so someone else who is getting high praise from the idiotic press machine.
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why don't you learn what you're talking about. I'm not saying Phil Brown because of his performances this year alone. He was the man behind the man at Bolton, when they were good. HE's very up to date with whose available in all leagues. It would seem, judging by Fat Sam's buys during his good years at Bolton while Brown was there, the complete change once Brown left, and his abysmal buying at Newcastle that years ago it was Phil Brown pulling the strings at Bolton. He's been around in the game for a long time and is actually a great manager with lots of potential. He knows who to get, he has a perfectly balanced team and, as you can see based on this season already he isn't afraid to go foward, or play 4-4-2 away at places that most teams in the premier league will go 4-5-1, or eve 5-4-1 sometimes.

He doesn't remotely consider playing ultra defensively, his sides attack and have perfect balance, he's got average defenders working fantastically to a good system thats working. He's got, average strikers working well in a well balanced system and doesn't retreat them to foul players like lots of "physical" sides tend to do.

THat used to be exactly what you could say about a Wenger team, of which none of it stands up. All out attack, hard with people that pass backwards and can't beat their man, 4-5-1, we see it all the time now, almost every big away game is now pathetic and has been for years now. Balance, none, defensive stability, none, morale, low, players fighting on the pitch, yup, great buying value players, no. Preventing injury with sensible rotation, no, rushing every last injured player back in to get reinjured, yes.

EDIT:- I also wasn't saying him seriously, I was very clearly suggesting a perfect person would have been Scolari to bring back all out attack, Phil Brown was someone, who we could actually get who actually would seemingly at least try the same.

But then again what should I expect, any thread I post in regarding football you every single post mis-interpret my posts, respond as If i'd said something different and consistantly pretend I said stuff I didn't. Either you completely lack any ability to comprehend basic english or you're doing it on purpose, maybe a bit of both. Stop being a troll.
 
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lololol

Phil Brown can and has played defensive football. I've seen it myself. In person. He also hasn't played 4-4-2 since about the start of the season.

Just stop posting already.
 
Okay I was going to contribute to this thread but I've noticed I disagree with quite a lot of drunkenmaster's points, that it would take too much time and effort to write up a post for anyone to care about. :p

In short: I don't know why you wrote Adebayor off on the first page. He's lethal in the air - a quality we need when our first XI aren't that tall/strong in general.
 
Peño said:
In short: I don't know why you wrote Adebayor off on the first page. He's lethal in the air - a quality we need when our first XI aren't that tall/strong in general.
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The trouble is even though he's generally terrible, he does possess that one attribute he can lend the team. Our forwards and midfielders are tiny little fellas and Diaby isn't an imposing figure.
 
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