Scores die in Israeli air strikes

Tefal · 27 Dec 2008 at 21:30

Richdog said:
Tefal I just wrote a response to your post and my stupid work laptop reset the connection just as I submitted, and pressing back cleared it. ****.

np

In a democracy public opinion is everything (to some extent)

YEs but when many of the public have lost loved ones, and are deliberately targeted (instead of the military) the public generally want vengeance and blood. A is shown superbly on these forums when ever there is a murder case posted here.

Public opinion is very rarely of the mind set "ok lets let that death/killing/attack slide, in hopes of peace" it's usually "beat the ****ers into the ground so attacking us again is unthinkable".

But of course the other side has the exact same idea.

both in the governments ability to actually enter REAL negotiations with the Pals

The governments hands are tied by the public in terms of negotiation until attacks against them stop. ()or they are capable of removing the attackers/ability to attack) the public will not permit the government to give concessions to people who have killed their friends.

Richdog · 27 Dec 2008 at 21:32

So what you're saying is essentially after all this conflict you believe the Jewish people are just out for revenge and would welcome a further escelation in violence as opposed to a peaceful resolution?

Tefal · 27 Dec 2008 at 21:35

Richdog said:
So what you're saying is essentially after all this conflict you believe the Jewish people are just out for revenge and would welcome a further escelation in violence as opposed to a peaceful resolution?

No, many of them want peace, but they will not let an attack slide, if they do it invites further violence. (but i nice way to try and twist it, as by that you're saying all of britain wants blood and violence)

The Palestinians started this current spat when they broke the ceasefire.

So you could say it's the pal who just want blood.

The Israelis (they're not all Jewish you know) just want to be safe and like us if we are attacked we respond with military force, ie Afghanistan/Iraq/northern Ireland.

SO far it's the pals who seem to want a war. so isreal responds heavy andedly to hopefully make them realise they can;t win.

mmj_uk · 27 Dec 2008 at 21:40

Tefal said:
What would you do if you where an Israeli citizen?

There's nothing the Israeli citizens can do except perhaps live in other more stable areas of Europe like their ancestors did.

Tefal said:
What would you do if you where the Israeli government?

The Israeli government and Israel should not exist and therein lies the problem.

Perhaps giving the Palestians some of their land back might help? certainly, bombing the Palestian civilians back 10-fold using "precision missiles" won't do anything to promote peace...

Imagine if Russia claimed to have lived in England & Scotland 5000yrs ago and wanted it back? would you sit back while a bunch of Russian's moved into your £100,000 house leaving you homeless and dumped in Wales? would 60yrs of being oppressed and bombed as "retaliation" for resistance subdue you?

Richdog · 27 Dec 2008 at 21:40

Tefal said:
No, many of them want peace, but they will not let an attack slide, if they do it invites further violence. (but i nice way to try and twist it, as by that you're saying all of britain wants blood and violence)

The Palestinians started this current spat when they broke the ceasefire.

So you could say it's the pal who just want blood.

The Israelis (they're not all Jewish you know) just want to be safe and like us if we are attacked we respond with military force, ie Afghanistan/Iraq/northern Ireland.

SO far it's the pals who seem to want a war. so isreal responds heavy andedly to hopefully make them realise they can;t win.

But the whole point is that any retaliation is futile simply because all it does is further strengthen the resolve of the Pals and convince them that the only solution to this is to keep on fighting the guerilla war until one of them is completely obliterated. They will NEVER stop as long as their belief in their religion and their goals remains.

It's up to Israel to be the bigger man in this conflict... because the whole thing is like a boxer going out to beat up a couple of 12 year olds who pelted eggs at his door. Israel have superiority in every way imagineable... yet as long as they persist on their current course all they will do is ensure more deaths.

Tefal · 27 Dec 2008 at 21:44

mmj_uk said:
The Israeli government and Israel should not exist and therein lies the problem.

So if you where the head of the Israeli government you'd just shoot yourself in the face?

Richdog · 27 Dec 2008 at 21:47

Tefal said:
So if you where the head of the Israeli government you'd just shoot yourself in the face?

No, what he means (not that I should be needing to spell this out) is that they have no real legitimacy there in the eyes of anyone but themselves...

I don't think he was quite talking about them shooting themselves in the face...

Tefal · 27 Dec 2008 at 21:49

Richdog said:
No, what he means (not that I should be needing to spell this out) is that they have no real legitimacy there in the eyes of anyone but themselves..

Well, (not that I should be needing to spell this out) that hardly answers the question of what he would do in their place does it?

fraps · 27 Dec 2008 at 21:56

mmj_uk said:
The Israeli government and Israel should not exist and therein lies the problem.

you've hit the nail on the head

Tefal · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:00

fraps said:
you've hit the nail on the head

But it does, so just saying it shouldn't isn;t really a great idea.

What would you do fraps in the Israeli's position. (remember now you're defending the Israeli people)

Azagoth · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:16

mmj_uk said:
The Israeli government and Israel should not exist and therein lies the problem.

I may be wrong, but I'm guessing you're a Muslim.

Yaser1987 · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:28

Tefal said:
Are you having a stroke?

me .. no

. how about you ?

Yaser1987 · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:30

Azagoth said:
I may be wrong, but I'm guessing you're a Muslim.

may be he just want peace like me .. :rolleyes:

BigglesPiP · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:31

Allow the terrorists to hide amongst you, die in a wedding come missile strike, end up on the back end of Muslim jokes.

Push them out, live, reach Jewish level of acceptance.

Azagoth · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:33

Yaser1987 said:
may be he just want peace like me ..

What by saying a Country shouldn't exist, how is peace going to be achieved that way? Face facts, Israel is there, it exists and it's going to continue to exist.

Tefal · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:37

Yaser1987 said:
may be he just want peace like me ..

Riddle me this.

If there where no Palestinians, there would be no fighting between Israelis and Palestinians. correct?

Ergo... I'm sure you can follow this train of thought to the end yourself.

Peace based on ones "right to exist" only ever ends one way....

You clearly do not want peace, you want a victory.

Yaser1987 · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:40

Azagoth said:
What by saying a Country shouldn't exist, how is peace going to be achieved that way? Face facts, Israel is there, it exists and it's going to continue to exist.

Probably better for them to find a solution to live in peace rather than release and exchange of fire every day
:confused:

Cryogenic · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:42

Class 04 said:
Israel should not exist. Scum.

Seconded.

Yaser1987 · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:44

Tefal said:
Riddle me this.

If there where no Palestinians, there would be no fighting between Israelis and Palestinians. correct?

Ergo... I'm sure you can follow this train of thought to the end yourself.

Peace based on ones "right to exist" only ever ends one way....

You clearly do not want peace, you want a victory.

who told you that i want " victory " ? :confused:

First: I am not a Palestinian

Second: I want to be a world in perfect peace without wars and without problems

got me now :confused:

Killa_ken · 27 Dec 2008 at 22:44

I support israel.