UK Gives Aid to Gaza

dangerstat · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:25

Gilbretto said:
I have picked it up from every day examples of people in this country and sadly on these forums.

Example here;

The BBC are probably the most reliable source of news in the uk.

No no no no that's completely different, if you want to compare like for like, I want a videol of British people in the street burning an Iraqi flag praising soliers that have killed innocent people. Show me that, and perhaps I'll see your point, pointing to a few 12 year olds writting carp on a forum will not do.

Pilky01 · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:26

If I want to give my money to charity then I will do, I do not want the government doing it on my behalf.

Gilbretto · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:28

etom said:
thats your opinion. imho we had good reasons and still have good reasons to have soldiers in iraq and afghanastan.

soldiers are dying and fighting a war for our goverment which the people elected regardless of your own opinion on the war. so understandably a lot of people even some of those anti-war peace hippies, praise soldiers for doing what is a heroic and noble act.

There is absolutely no reason for us to stay in Iraq.

Afghanistan however is a different matter. Rather than pulling out of Afghanistan and pouring soldiers into Iraq, we should have given more troops to our efforts in Afghanistan and maybe we could have avoided the current mess.

We should be concentrating on Afghanistan and the surrounding Pakistan borders. This is where the extremist groups are. Not in Iraq.

etom · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:31

Gilbretto said:
Oh, i'm sorry. I forgot about those Iraqi women and children that have been terrorising me for years

The Iraqi people are not terrorists. Nor have they ever done anything to harm us.

Our govenment went in to remove **WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION** which subsiquently didn't exsist. Meaning there was no threat at all.

Yet all the Iraqi's are terrorists?

Wow, you are seriously ignorant.

How about we are the ones causing terror? Barging our way in all guns blazing. Killing thousands of innocent people?

But noooooooo, us Brits are perfect of course. When we kill its fine.

Well they had Sudam Hussain killing thousands of innocent people, its a shame these countries cant seem to revolt themselves and establish order but as usual western countries have to step in and remove power and try to establish stability.

A number of thousand iraq lifes for the long term goal of democracy is a very good deal for them as a whole. I wonder how many would have died if sudam continued his reign of terror or another islamic country invaded Iraq or countless possible outcomes happened.

This country litterally pours help into that area and have done so in the past.

pitaylor · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:32

etom said:
thats your opinion. imho we had good reasons and still have good reasons to have soldiers in iraq and afghanastan.

soldiers are dying and fighting a war for our goverment which the people elected regardless of your own opinion on the war. so understandably a lot of people even some of those anti-war peace hippies, praise soldiers for doing what is a heroic and noble act.

What good reasons were there for going to Iraq??

stude1983 · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:32

Ben M said:
Who else read the title as "UK gives AIDS to Gaza"?

i did lol

dangerstat · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:33

pitaylor said:
What good reasons were there for going to Iraq??

Didn't he use chemical weapons against his own people, didn't he invade Kuwait, didn't he execute people in stadiums,...

pitaylor · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:34

etom said:
Well they had Sudam Hussain killing thousands of innocent people, its a shame these countries cant seem to revolt themselves and establish order but as usual western countries have to step in and remove power and try to establish stability.

A number of thousand iraq lifes for the long term goal of democracy is a very good deal for them as a whole. I wonder how many would have died if sudam continued his reign of terror or another islamic country invaded Iraq or countless possible outcomes happened.

This country litterally pours help into that area and have done so in the past.

A number of thousand iraqi lifes is a good deal, are you that cold hearted :mad:

Some polls put the amount of deaths near to a million, how is that a good deal.

^TANK^ · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:35

Gilbretto said:
£7 million is peanuts mate, it wouldn't make any difference to our economy.

If we can help out a few innocent, starving children then great. Well done the UK govenment for once.

+1.

Ben M said:
Who else read the title as "UK gives AIDS to Gaza"?

Yes, I did

.

Gilbretto · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:42

dangerstat said:
Didn't he use chemical weapons against his own people, didn't he invade Kuwait, didn't he execute people in stadiums,...

yes he did, and at the time we dealt with it.

At the time of the second invasion Iraq has severe sanctions put in place and were not capable of doing such a thing again. No weapons were found when we searched. And no, the weapons weren't just really well hidden.

You can prosecute dictators for war crimes without invading the country.

Many many many countries in this world execute people, torture people and do hiddeous things. Our country, and the USA included.

So why are we not busy invading Sudan, Rowanda, Congo, Zimbabwe, China, UAE...the list goes on...

Gilbretto · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:44

pitaylor said:
A number of thousand iraqi lifes is a good deal, are you that cold hearted Some polls put the amount of deaths near to a million, how is that a good deal.

Well said.

Because sadly many western people see themselves as being superior to the rest of the world. Our lifes have somehow become more important than those in the middle east (muslims).

Its sickening that people think that way. If people actually travelled and saw these places for themselves they would see that these people are no different from you or I.

The west is extremely arrogant, especially the govenments, and untill that changes, the problems will continue.

Its a shame that people allow themselves to be spoonfed propoganda by the govenment and not think for themselves.

etom · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:45

Gilbretto said:
yes he did, and at the time we dealt with it.

At the time of the second invasion Iraq has severe sanctions put in place and were not capable of doing such a thing again. No weapons were found when we searched. And no, the weapons weren't just really well hidden.

You can prosecute dictators for war crimes without invading the country.

Many many many countries in this world execute people, torture people and do hiddeous things. Our country, and the USA included.

So why are we not busy invading Sudan, Rowanda, Congo, Zimbabwe, China, UAE...the list goes on...

Ok when has this country tortured people on a goverment basis?

a lot of people would agree democracy is worth any cost. Its not like we have massacred 90% of the population

dangerstat · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:49

Gilbretto said:
yes he did, and at the time we dealt with it.

At the time of the second invasion Iraq has severe sanctions put in place and were not capable of doing such a thing again. No weapons were found when we searched. And no, the weapons weren't just really well hidden.

You can prosecute dictators for war crimes without invading the country.

Many many many countries in this world execute people, torture people and do hiddeous things. Our country, and the USA included.

So why are we not busy invading Sudan, Rowanda, Congo, Zimbabwe, China, UAE...the list goes on...

What! Hussain was still in power, and you think we could have got to the Hague! hahahhahahahahahahahhahahahahaha awesome, he'd have had to have agreed to have sent himself to the Hague. Loving that arguement.

And no we didn't deal with it, we should have, in fact if anything that is the mistake that is costing the Iraqi people now, we didn't finish what we started last time. We should have removed Hussian from power. Many of the lives being lost now are down to this mistake.

I don't really know why we're talking about Iraq anyhow as this is about Palestine.

Gilbretto · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:50

etom said:
Ok when has this country tortured people on a goverment basis?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2004/may/08/iraq.iraq

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2006/apr/03/germany.topstories3

http://www.hrw.org/legacy/backgrounder/eca/uk1106/4.htm#_Toc149127473

a lot of people would agree democracy is worth any cost. Its not like we have massacred 90% of the population

It is your opinion that a capitalist democracy is the best way to go. Many would disagree.

So killing 1% of a population IS acceptable?

pitaylor · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:51

etom said:
Ok when has this country tortured people on a goverment basis?

a lot of people would agree democracy is worth any cost. Its not like we have massacred 90% of the population

Have you even seen what is happening in Darfur, I dont see the americans in a rush to invade sudan. Hmmm maybe because there are not any massive oil reserves there...

Gilbretto · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:54

dangerstat said:
What! Hussain was still in power, and you think we could have got to the Hague! hahahhahahahahahahahhahahahahaha awesome, he'd have had to have agreed to have sent himself to the Hague. Loving that arguement.

Slobodan Milošević. Research it and you have just rubbished your imature response.

dangerstat · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:55

Gilbretto said:
Slobodan Milošević. Research it and you have just rubbished your imature response.

Oh I know all about it fella!

Gilbretto · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:55

But you are correct in saying that this thread has gone off on a tangent.

Back to the Palestinian crisis....

Tefal · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:55

pitaylor said:
Have you even seen what is happening in Darfur, I dont see the americans in a rush to invade sudan. Hmmm maybe because there are not any massive oil reserves there...

it has quite a bit of oil, along with lots of untapped mineral wealth.

etom · 31 Dec 2008 at 14:56

checked the first guardian link. are you really suggesting "lesbian jibes" are in the same league as torture. Irritating, possibly....in the same league as what eastern countries would consider torture...not in the slightest.

Also the military is stretched at the moment, at least the problems in Africa don't spread world wide unlike Isalmic countries has a tendacy to spread west. aka should be higher priority although agree its horrible what happens in Zimbabwe etc.