January Transfer Window Thread - rumours and signings here
- Thread starter Gilly
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So Giggs and Scholes should be on £200k a week then? That's not how it works.
Tevez gives his all, literally leaves it all out on the pitch like Rooney. Call me old fashioned, but they should be rewarded the most.
For the record, I thought it was reported he was getting £60k a week whilst on this 2 month loan. Half what Rooney was on.
Yes, I believe it was ~£8m upfront and the rest over months etc...
I would guess £90k[ASSE]Hinchy;13233979 said:
Gutting? He's awesome. We've paid for potential and he delivered already for us last season. You get what you pay for.£19 million for Anderson?
Didn't realise he cost that much, gutting.
You mean 100% if reports are to be believed.
No because those two are pretty unique and dont ask the earth - unfortunately the world has changed significantly since they started in the game - Im glad they havent changed though
In general though - most clubs seem to pay for loyalty, the longer you stay the more you are paid - and as a by product of that, as you rightly mentioned, people who leave their soul on the pitch are more likely to be wanted to be kept by the club!!!
edit - did you mean above - just completed the £19m payment? Way I read it sounded like you thought Utd had just paid all of the £19m
I was working the 50% + on "under £80k a week" - if it is as low as £60k then yes , doubling of his wage would be correct (IF the press are to be believed of course lol)
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Considering he'd either be on a free or costing us next to nothing and that he'd be a bit part player, i see no problem bringing Heskey back.
With Kuyt being our first choice right sided player atm, we're short of a striker and we don't really have anybody who can play as a target man. Imo Heskey could do a decent job for us as a squad player.
I wouldn't go as far as Pigeon but he's hardly awesome nor has he done anything (yet) to justify a £19m transfer fee. Imo he really needs to add some end product to his game.
Managers and teams simply don't win things as consistently as you seem to think without some serious financial backing.
It was only a short time ago that Liverpool didn't qualify for the CL and haven't won the title for something like 18 years. It happens.
Football goes in phases and we have been going through a phase where because we can't compete financially, we have struggled for honours. Aston Villa are beginning what could be a great period for them, who knows though.
Some top teams go without silverware for longer than 4 years. We used to all the time. It seems natural to me. You can't always win, especially when you are competing with bigger boys than yourself.
To say we didn't improve is nonsense. This season has been average in comparison but we steadily improved up until this season.
05/06 - 67 points
06/07 - 68 points
07/08 - 83 points
These numbers say you are completely wrong, as usual. The football got better as well (nearly everyone would agree we were great for most of last season). Really, its the same old story with you. Nonsense comments, little in the way of fact to back them up. We lost a player in the summer that unbalanced the team and Wenger thought he could cover the position. He is struggling to do that, big deal, he is only human. Lots of injuries haven't helped either, although you probably think the medical professionals at the club are also at fault.
Also, what other PL teams have better young players coming through than us? Maybe one?
I'd also be interested to know your contact at the club as you seem to know the ins and outs of the feelings and psycological state of all the players.
The club has a great business model and is not currently being propped up by a sugar daddy. Long may it continue. If people can't face supporting a team that doesn't win something every few years, support Chelsea or ManU.
Caporegime
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No, those numbers say the premiership has been getting more average and up till this year the top 4 were finding it easier to nab points with the very bottom teams being worse each year. With teams like Derby being the worst team ever to grace the premiership points wise, likewise the top of the table will find it easier to pick up points. That in no way whatsoever means they are better. WE've been playing much worse football each year, less attacking, less smooth, less creativity. I mean last year if it didn't come from a throughball and a tap in from Ade, what was it, we don't have the range we had in the Pires/Henry years, pires scoring from 40 yards out with a chip, lobbing a player and lobbing the keeper, Henry running from inside our half and scoring, we aren't the same team. We might be grinding out results and getting points against worse teams, but we aren't playing as good football. Bolton eke out results, that doesn't mean their football is fantastic, you are mixing the two things up. I'm after good football and couldn't give a monkeys about cups tbh, but its hard to justify winning nothing and playing worse football isn't it?
Pires, Vieira(ish), Freddie, Reyes, Henry, Wiltord, Bergkamp, Parlour, Edu, even Gilberto, goals would come from anywhere at any time, great attacking football. Now, Theo, Diaby, Denilson, Song, Fabregas, Vela, Eboue, Ramsey, Wilshire etc, are they the same class offensively or defensively, where are the goals. Fabregas is the only "high" scorer among them when in midfield the rest are barely scoring or completely unproven and barely getting games. To say we are as good now as then.........
You also didn't read ANYTHING i said in my previous post which was so blindingly clear I couldn't tell you.
I didn't remotely say clubs can't have a bad spell, and can't win things again, I didn't bring money or points into it, what I asked, which you completely failed to answer and driveled on about other crap is this. Which clubs go on a long term streak of winning nothing get back to winning ways WITH THE SAME MANAGER. Obviously clubs will go years without winning anything, most clubs will win very little ever. My point was, in general managers that go from winning things, to not winning anything for a longer period of time rarely if ever go back to winning form with the same club. Managers get stale, their tactics become known, people know how to play against certain teams, Ronaldo is slightly less effective this year as people are more scared of him now than Rooney and Berb, so they put more effort into double man marking him than before. Its this simple, its rare(if its ever happened) that a club can go from winning and dropping down the table to becoming great again without a change in manager, so maybe thats something we should be looking at sooner than later. We are also a high spending club that Arsenal fans pretend isn't true. Reyes, Eduardo, Rosicky, Hleb, etc, etc, etc, they aren't widely cheap some are quite expensive, but you're forgetting we have within a hairs breath of the 3rd highest wage bill in the league, which was some 30mil ahead of liverpool spending on wages, and some 45 ahead of Villa, we might be spending less in bringing in players, but that money IS going out on wages. When You take into account wages + transfers we are still miles ahead of Villa's spending and maybe Pool aswell, only Chelsea and Man U outspend us, Man City by the end of the year also.
People adapt and at a certain point you need a fundamental change at the club to get back to competing.
We used to play a team that could score from anywhere, at any time in any way, we are not that team anymore and to claim we are is beyond a joke.
Maybe I'll ask another question you'll refuse to answer, why is Toure saying he's being dropped, when Wenger is saying he's injured, while the second anyone else in defense is injured Toure magically becomes fit, the second someone comes back Toure is magically injured again yet never once shows sign of injury in the games he played?
You also seem to be missing the fact that spending less than we do now we DID win things CONSISTANTLY up till 4 years ago. SO whats changed and who changed it.
Pires, Vieira(ish), Freddie, Reyes, Henry, Wiltord, Bergkamp, Parlour, Edu, even Gilberto, goals would come from anywhere at any time, great attacking football. Now, Theo, Diaby, Denilson, Song, Fabregas, Vela, Eboue, Ramsey, Wilshire etc, are they the same class offensively or defensively, where are the goals. Fabregas is the only "high" scorer among them when in midfield the rest are barely scoring or completely unproven and barely getting games. To say we are as good now as then.........
You also didn't read ANYTHING i said in my previous post which was so blindingly clear I couldn't tell you.
I didn't remotely say clubs can't have a bad spell, and can't win things again, I didn't bring money or points into it, what I asked, which you completely failed to answer and driveled on about other crap is this. Which clubs go on a long term streak of winning nothing get back to winning ways WITH THE SAME MANAGER. Obviously clubs will go years without winning anything, most clubs will win very little ever. My point was, in general managers that go from winning things, to not winning anything for a longer period of time rarely if ever go back to winning form with the same club. Managers get stale, their tactics become known, people know how to play against certain teams, Ronaldo is slightly less effective this year as people are more scared of him now than Rooney and Berb, so they put more effort into double man marking him than before. Its this simple, its rare(if its ever happened) that a club can go from winning and dropping down the table to becoming great again without a change in manager, so maybe thats something we should be looking at sooner than later. We are also a high spending club that Arsenal fans pretend isn't true. Reyes, Eduardo, Rosicky, Hleb, etc, etc, etc, they aren't widely cheap some are quite expensive, but you're forgetting we have within a hairs breath of the 3rd highest wage bill in the league, which was some 30mil ahead of liverpool spending on wages, and some 45 ahead of Villa, we might be spending less in bringing in players, but that money IS going out on wages. When You take into account wages + transfers we are still miles ahead of Villa's spending and maybe Pool aswell, only Chelsea and Man U outspend us, Man City by the end of the year also.
People adapt and at a certain point you need a fundamental change at the club to get back to competing.
We used to play a team that could score from anywhere, at any time in any way, we are not that team anymore and to claim we are is beyond a joke.
Maybe I'll ask another question you'll refuse to answer, why is Toure saying he's being dropped, when Wenger is saying he's injured, while the second anyone else in defense is injured Toure magically becomes fit, the second someone comes back Toure is magically injured again yet never once shows sign of injury in the games he played?
You also seem to be missing the fact that spending less than we do now we DID win things CONSISTANTLY up till 4 years ago. SO whats changed and who changed it.
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He's been out since November injured and is due back any time now. He's struggled so far and hasn't managed to score yet, but theres a good player in there somewhere, we just need to play to his strengths more. The rumoured signing of Etherington and also the return to fitness of Liam Lawrence should help that
Thats a cop out. Things aren't easier, its just an easy excuse that fits in with your opinion. The top 10 have, quite clearly, been improving in recent seasons. The PL always has teams like Derby in it every year. Its not an exact scienece which seems to be how you see it. We can't even judge this season yet, its only half way through. I'd be suprised if a poll across a diverse range of fans about the quality of our football last season was anything other than glowing
How often are they given the chance? How often are managers sacked only for the new manager to make little difference? How often do managers who were successful at a club actually ever return to that club again? Not often enough to be able to judge is the answer to those questions. Can you name any managers who have been given a real chance after a trophyless few seasons to turn a club around?
Thats rich as you are the king of avoiding questions and statements with facts. I didn't specifically mean Toure. Some of your posts recently have stated that the whole team is unhappy and everyone is fighting with each other and its all a disaster. Let me ask you a question. How do you now Toure said that he is being dropped? Was it a close friend from a newspaper report? Have you heard him say it yourself? If not who told you. I'm guessing its from Sky, a newspaper or some other unreliable source.
Let face harsh facts. You are a poor supporter who spouts tabloid level knee-jerk nonsense that belongs in the Sun.
Also, I've never ever said the team now is as good as the team from past Wenger years.
Caporegime
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Thats a bit like saying we beat you 1-0, you beat them 1-0, so we should beat them 2-0.
Its not an exact science like that. In this instance though, the players we spent the most on in recent seasons didn't stick around long enough to fulfill what they could have done. Reye's went home, Hleb left for the glamour and Rosi and Eduardo have been mostly injured. Maybe if the players who we spend the money on had stayed or we didn't have such poor injuries, we could judge better.
As it is, its impossible to stay.
Certainly true - he gets in the right positions, and a few shots have been unlucky (ie just hitting the bar/post) but most are pretty wayward.
Caporegime
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Hang on a minute ago you said we did well last season because the PL has gotten easier. So now its because its gotten easier and because we had a good central defensive pairing? Maybe also because we had Fab and Flim? How about Ade's 30 odd goals.
I've seen Denilson have abysmal games this season in his position (and some good).
Look at the figures man. Season on season for years we have spent less than teams behind us in the league.
Apart from the Bendtner v Ade thing (which I think even non Arsenal fans would agree involves ego's like Ade and Bendy) and the thing with Toure, I've seen no more unrest on or off the pitch than at any other club. Its all invented by the Xenophobic press.
Caporegime
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Gallas speaking out and telling us of all the fighting in the dressing rooms, him being dropped by Wenger, Toure apparently being dropped by Wenger , or really getting about 10 separate injuries in the past 2 months alone.
The figures man, the figures, add wages + transfers, thats how clubs run, no really, it is.
A year or two ago chelsea were on like 98million wages, man up on 82.x and us on 79.x, liverpool were at like 5x.x and Spurs and Villa were the mid 40's if I remember correctly. You can't, just because you want to, ignore that we are spending 30/40million more on wages than Villa because it suits your argument. if you have 100mill budget and you spend 50mil on wages you have 50mil for transfers, if you spend 80mil on wages unsurprisingly you'll only have 20mil for transfers. Sol Campbell, for that particular time was on INSANE wages and a massive signing on bonus, instead of spending the same money on the transfer fee and less wages/smaller signing on bonus.
The figures man, the figures, add wages + transfers, thats how clubs run, no really, it is.
A year or two ago chelsea were on like 98million wages, man up on 82.x and us on 79.x, liverpool were at like 5x.x and Spurs and Villa were the mid 40's if I remember correctly. You can't, just because you want to, ignore that we are spending 30/40million more on wages than Villa because it suits your argument. if you have 100mill budget and you spend 50mil on wages you have 50mil for transfers, if you spend 80mil on wages unsurprisingly you'll only have 20mil for transfers. Sol Campbell, for that particular time was on INSANE wages and a massive signing on bonus, instead of spending the same money on the transfer fee and less wages/smaller signing on bonus.
Exactly, he's just missing that all important goal factor at the moment.
Aaaanderson-son-son,
He's better than Kleberson,
Anderson-son-son,
He's our midfield magician,
Toooo the left,
To the right,
To the samba beat tonight,
He is class with the brass
And he ***** on Fabregas.
Anderson was worth every bit of whatever we paid for him. He should be playing every week alongside Carrick and it annoys me when he doesn't. Take this weekend for example, we NEED Anderson in there but you just know it'll be either Fletcher or Scholes alongside Carrick :/