A day out ratting

vincent1989 · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:17

don't condone this at all, i think it's just pointless barbarism and not because you're performing your land owners duties of 'pest control' but because you find some sick glee in the butchery of something largely unable to defend itself.

the way you've behaved and the way you justify it makes you no better than those people who hunt foxes, baited bears and held **** fights among other blood 'sports', pleasure from pain, which is just wrong.

i'll say it again, just for clarification; i can see why you do it, but not why you enjoy it.

Rainmaker · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:20

vincent1989 said:
don't condone this at all, i think it's just pointless barbarism and not because you're performing your land owners duties of 'pest control' but because you find some sick glee in the butchery of something largely unable to defend itself.

the way you've behaved and the way you justify it makes you no better than those people who hunt foxes, baited bears and held **** fights among other blood 'sports', pleasure from pain, which is just wrong.

i'll say it again, just for clarification; i can see why you do it, but not why you enjoy it.

Good for you. Just for the record there's nothing wrong with hunting foxes either. You say I'm not better than "those people who hunt foxes..."", but I've already stated several times that I do that also. Not on horseback either.

Cue another 10 pages of "ZOMGWTFBBQ".

Topper · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:21

Has anyone eaten rat btw? Ok rainmaker, in that case don't reply to this

Rainmaker · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:23

Topper said:
Has anyone eaten rat btw? Ok rainmaker, in that case don't reply to this

In what case? You've asked an interesting question! I haven't eaten rat but I know people who have in Asia. Personally, I wouldn't. One man's meat, etc etc.

Pilky01 · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:24

Rainmaker said:
Just for the record there's nothing wrong with hunting foxes either.

Please explain how killing anything for pleasure is anything other than wrong?

There is something very wrong with people who enjoy killing things.

Rainmaker · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:25

Pilky01 said:
Please explain how killing anything for pleasure is anything other than wrong?

There is something very wrong with people who enjoy killing things.

Yawn. Please explain how enjoying hunting things when it needs to be done is wrong. Or just go back a few pages and re-read. Saves on typing.

DampCat · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:25

Hunting is the single oldest profession in human history. Wether for food or recreation, it's been done for thousands of years.

Rainmaker · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:26

DampCat said:
Hunting is the single oldest profession in human history. Wether for food or recreation, it's been done for thousands of years.

In before the "OMG so has baiting, fighting, child rape and murder" posts.

vincent1989 · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:26

Rainmaker said:
Yawn. Please explain how enjoying hunting things when it needs to be done is wrong. Or just go back a few pages and re-read. Saves on typing.

there is, by and large, very little 'need' to hunt foxes (bar the sick pleasure derived from idiots who find hunting fun)

DampCat said:
Hunting is the single oldest profession in human history. recreation, it's been done for thousands of years.

just because something has been done for thousands of years doesn't make it right for a supposedly enlightened people to continue things which cause great pain for some small degree of pleasure is actually quite ridiculous.

i'd have nothing to say in this thread if it were just about pest control or if it were about food, but it's not, it's about deriving pleasure from something else's suffering, and like many i find it immoral.

DampCat · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:27

Well yes that's true

Scuzi · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:27

vincent1989 said:
there is, by and large, very little 'need' to hunt foxes (bar the sick pleasure derived from idiots who find hunting fun)

Foxes are also very destructive vermin and need to be killed on occasion to protect livestock.

Rainmaker · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:28

vincent1989 said:
there is, by and large, very little 'need' to hunt foxes (bar the sick pleasure derived from idiots who find hunting fun)

OK, fine. I'll tell that to the farmer next time he loses a hundred chickens, or a lamb, or whatever. Foxes kill for fun, not just for food. Oh the ironing. As a predatory animal I have no objections to hunting something, and enjoying doing so.

DampCat · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:28

vincent1989 said:
there is, by and large, very little 'need' to hunt foxes (bar the sick pleasure derived from idiots who find hunting fun)

Careful. Just because you don't enjoy something, doesnt make the participants idiots.

i dont enjoy fly fishing, but i wouldnt say fly fishermen are idiots.

You need to be a bit more rational if you expect a sensible discussion. If you just want to throw insults, then get on with it and toddle off elsewhere.

Pilky01 · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:30

Rainmaker said:
Yawn. Please explain how enjoying hunting things when it needs to be done is wrong. Or just go back a few pages and re-read. Saves on typing.

Hunting foxes in the numbers that they are hunted is not necessary, and anyone who gets please from killing things is a very sick individual.

vincent1989 · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:33

Scuzi said:
Foxes are also very destructive vermin and need to be killed on occasion to protect livestock.

again, i'm not disputing that, what i am disputing is the pleasure derived from the hunt, and that it seems, more often than not, the hunt is quite unnecessary and on a far larger scale than necessary (and just for the pleasure of a few individuals).

Rainmaker · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:34

vincent1989 said:
there is, by and large, very little 'need' to hunt foxes (bar the sick pleasure derived from idiots who find hunting fun)

Again, tell that to the farmer. Whether you perceive a 'need' or not, it's there. So we'll carry on regardless, thanks.

just because something has been done for thousands of years doesn't make it right...

Told you someone would come out with that

i'd have nothing to say in this thread if it were just about pest control or if it were about food, but it's not, it's about deriving pleasure from something else's suffering, and like many i find it immoral.

Once again this IS a pest control thread. The Puritans just seem to find it outrageous that one should find it an enjoyable activity rather than crying over each little ratty grave and holding a service.

<Sideshow Mel>That individual is experiencing pleasure in his day-to-day activities! Burn him! </Sideshow Mel>

Pilky01 said:
Hunting foxes in the numbers that they are hunted is not necessary, and anyone who gets please from killing things is a very sick individual.

So you've told us, about six times. Anything new to add?

MookJong · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:35

I have refrained entering this debate so far, as for me it falls into the same catagory as fox hunting, an issue for which I am still pretty undecided.

I've resigned myself now to the fact that unless I actually go foxhunting or ratting I really don't think I'll ever be able to decide which side of the fence I am on.

I possibly urr on the side of the hunters but like other people on this board I am a little concerned by the disrespect they seem to have for the animals they are killing.

vincent1989 · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:36

DampCat said:
Careful. Just because you don't enjoy something, doesnt make the participants idiots.

i dont enjoy fly fishing, but i wouldnt say fly fishermen are idiots.

You need to be a bit more rational if you expect a sensible discussion. If you just want to throw insults, then get on with it and toddle off elsewhere.

the difference is that, whilst fly fishermen might derive pleasure from their activity they will be doing it for food, and in a much more environmentally manageable way. those who do it just for fun are idiots (imo).

i'm being perfectly rational, you'll find i'm being one of the more rational protesters against the hunting here.

Rainmaker · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:38

MookJong said:
...

I urr on the side of the hunters but like other people on this board I am a little concerned by the disrespect they seem to have for the animals they are killing.

Thank you for the balanced contribution.

As for respect though, any genuine hunter has that for his quarry. I don't see how it's disrespectful just because the animal dies. Ensuring it's as quick and humane as possible = respect. Pouring petrol down the holes and then lighting a match on the other hand... You see where I'm going. I see no lack of respect in my OP, just a sense of achievement.

pioneer2000 · 4 Feb 2009 at 13:38

Rainmaker said:
Careful, that borders on a direct personal attack. Wouldn't want to see you on your holidays. But then I don't really care what you think of me. You think it's "childish, vicious and disrespectful" to hunt rats. I think it's hunting and pest control, and as natural an activity as breathing. I am a predator and a carnivore, because I am a human animal. But I'm also an 'evolved' animal capable of understanding that wildlife needs managing, especially when it's in plague proportions. Oh well.

1) I'm sorry but if you feel the need to glorify the needless savage killing of small animals then I am entitled to call you whatever I please <- Wrong. If you break the forum rules again your account will be suspended.

2) Humans are omnivores- hence why there is actually no requirement to eat meat.

3) Hand in hand with evolution comes an increased sense of sophistication and compassion (aka being more civilised). You're actions are of someone less civilised.

Rainmaker said:
You're entitled to your opinion. I think if you're this worried about some rats dying at the hands of a dog rather than by poison there's something wrong with you. Oh well.

Stop trying to make out you are doing the rat population a favour. You're having them eaten alive! There are more humane methods that can be implemented than either poison or hunting. You are right in that they can cause problems for farmers etc, but it's not something they do on purpose- humans have the ability to understand that and treat them with enough respect to find an alternative to hunting.

Rainmaker said:
What a capital idea! What would you like? Venison? Hare? Rabbit? Pheasant? Pigeon?

Dog please.

You're posts make it plainly obvious that you do not like people to disagree with your "fun" - perhaps you should not post such material and keep this barbaric past-time to yourself. Oh but then you could not gloat over a tiny little rat you've not even actually managed to kill yourself.