Soldato
- Joined
- 26 Apr 2004
- Posts
- 9,853
- Location
- Milton Keynes
Well, to start off with I'm using a 42PZ80. I paid £699 for the set from John Lewis buy pricematching John Lewis Glasgow. Where you can still get them, the price for this model varies between £699-900.
I bought a full 1080p model, as I have approximately 40 HDDVD, some Blu-ray, and wanted to use the system primarily for the HD consoles (720p-->1080p doesn't suffer too noticeably), as a computer screen and for watching movies, and also sit relatively close to the screen.
If I wasn't I would have gone for the new (720p) X10 series, or a PX model, and saved myself some money.
As far as I'm concerned Panasonic are the best mass-affordable Plasma screens, Pioneer were exceptional but are pulling out by 2010. Buy a screen from either new and you will in most cases get an exceptional screen. Samsung and LG also make some nice Plasmas, however neither produce sets quite as good as Panasonic or Pioneer; and tend to suffer more niggles such as being more susceptible to Image Retention, but it pays to do some reasearch model to model.
I'm writing this, as having looked around when I considering, and then when I was looking to buy, similar questions seem to get asked almost every single time; so I wanted to perhaps give my own feedback based on my own experiences.
For reference, at the moment I'm using the recommended burn in settings for this set; and by and large I find them fine. Colours are very natural and whites are pretty white. I could probably tweak further but at the moment Im sticking with what I know!
1) Burn In/Image Retention
Panasonic are know for being reasonably developed when it comes to thwarting screen burn and image retention; however given this is one of the biggest horror stories you'll ever hear about a Plasma, it was still one of the things I have feared the most.
My experience with it would be that, providing you are on the settings, especially in the 200 hours that is recommended, a good plasma will look after you. The reason 200/500/1000 hours are commonly mentioned as burn in periods, is that the initial stages of a plasma's life are when the Phosphors are newest, and are most susceptible to Image Retention or damage due to effectively being most sensitive, and brightest.
I *have* noticed image retention; however this is my own fault, and it wasn't easy! Over a few drinks, with a few friends I ended up playing World of Warcraft (with obvious occasional alt tabbing and 5-10 min breaks) for approximately 8 or so hours on one of my days off.
As I sobered up, I realised what I was doing, and ended my session (I should be looking after this set in its early life!). No obvious retention from standard viewing differences, however being the paranoid sort; I wacked on a bright background (the blue screen you get when you rest on the PS3 home beta icon; I actually couldn't see anything on a raw black or white screen), and low and behold, when close to the set (within 1-2ft) I could make out the dull vague outlines on where some of the UI had been.
Note that I saw this because I was worried and went looking (and promptly had the heart attack every owner has when he first notices IR), however after half an hour or so of other usage this had become virtually unnoticeable from 1-2ft, and the only way it could be noticed was by standing within 6 inches of the screen.
Now after having used it for several hours since, even at 6 inches, whatever is left is so minimal, that I'm of half a mind I'm now seeing things because I'm trying to see them, not because they're there.
Since I got the screen, hour or two long session of Warcraft 3 custom maps and other games (HL2 Fakefactory) have absolutely no ill-effects (and trust me I've looked). Nor can I see any elements of my windows desktop.
So, as you can see, if you use the tv with sensible settings; and dont have the same thing on screen for absolutely hours, you will likely be fine, every plasma owner may experience occasional image retention, but you are very unlikely under standard usage, as long as you take care not to have logos emblazoned day in day out, to experience any major problems!
It does of course pay to do your reasearch though, as some brands are better than others.
2) Are blacks/colours really that much better?
Compared to the LCDs I used to work with and have seen, at its best, this Plasma (and better ones will be coming out later this year) walks all over any but the best led backlit LCD when it comes to blacks, and the same goes for colour.
*Good* Plasmas (its as possible to get lousy plasmas as lousy LCDs and, well just about anything else you can buy) are very much capable of producing a richer, more life like picture.
This plasma leaves my old, cheap samsung-based LCD, and my old PVA based monitor in the dust.
Stuff like Planet Earth and Dark Knight look absolutely stunning.
3) Is 1080p worth it?
Only if the processing is there to back it up, and you either want to 'future-proof' or intend to view a lot of Full HD material; 720p screens at the same price as a cheap 1080p set may well have better quality screens and electronics, resulting in improvements to things like the scaler.
On the other hand Plasma's have only recently become affordable in 1080p due to the technology, so a larger proportion of 1080p Plasmas are of generally high quality.
4) What are phosphor trails/motion blur really like?
Not bad at all; the videos you have seen are heavily processed to exaggerate the problem. I have looked for the issue, and it is marginally viewable if you move something quickly accross the screen, or turn quickly in a very colourful game. It manifests its self as a very slight blue tinge to the edge of moving items, in thier wake.
Unless you have exceptional eyesite, and look for it, this is very unlikely to bother you much, and is far less noticable in my opinion than the motion blur and smearing which goes with a lot of LCD panels.
Another thing I noticed is at native resolution, the plasma produces a much 'smoother', CRT-esque image than the oft processed look of an LCD, and 'jaggies' and other resolution issues seem less of an issue/softer.
Motion Blur and noticeable phosphor trails are set to be reduced even further with newer sets coming out this year!
5)Do Plasmas need refilled/regassing?
No. This is a modern myth of Plasma. Panasonic and the other manufacturers all rate thier products for a half-life (the time it takes to reach half brightness) of 30,000 hours or more. Panasonic rated thier 2008 range at 100, 000 hours. At 24 hours per day, you're looking at roughly 4000 days of usage, or well over 10 years. In the same time, an LCDs backlight will go; and if we're honest most equipment has gone faulty or been replaced.
6)Plasma - old technology compared to LCD?
Nope, both technologies have been about since the 1960/70's, however like all technologies it takes a long time til they filter down to home owner and consumer price levels.
Plasma and LCD are both looking set to be replaced in the future by OLED and other technologies, however it will be quite a few years before they are as affordable as the technology we appreciate at the moment.
In other words don't let ignorant salespeople confuse you telling you Plasma is outdated and LCD is newer tech.
(I used to be a salesperson in a large chain, and some of the staff knew little about many of the things they sell, although don't tar everyone with the same brush; some will give you genuine assistance as far as they can)
7) Would I still have bought it having lived with it for a few days, or would I have gone for a higher end LCD?
I'd keep the plasma
I'm pretty sure I've missed out some questions I wanted to answer; but hopefully that helps some of you umm-ing and ahh-ing over whether to go Plasma, or stick to LCD as its what you hear more about. Feel free to ask any questions you want!
I bought a full 1080p model, as I have approximately 40 HDDVD, some Blu-ray, and wanted to use the system primarily for the HD consoles (720p-->1080p doesn't suffer too noticeably), as a computer screen and for watching movies, and also sit relatively close to the screen.
If I wasn't I would have gone for the new (720p) X10 series, or a PX model, and saved myself some money.
As far as I'm concerned Panasonic are the best mass-affordable Plasma screens, Pioneer were exceptional but are pulling out by 2010. Buy a screen from either new and you will in most cases get an exceptional screen. Samsung and LG also make some nice Plasmas, however neither produce sets quite as good as Panasonic or Pioneer; and tend to suffer more niggles such as being more susceptible to Image Retention, but it pays to do some reasearch model to model.
I'm writing this, as having looked around when I considering, and then when I was looking to buy, similar questions seem to get asked almost every single time; so I wanted to perhaps give my own feedback based on my own experiences.
For reference, at the moment I'm using the recommended burn in settings for this set; and by and large I find them fine. Colours are very natural and whites are pretty white. I could probably tweak further but at the moment Im sticking with what I know!
1) Burn In/Image Retention
Panasonic are know for being reasonably developed when it comes to thwarting screen burn and image retention; however given this is one of the biggest horror stories you'll ever hear about a Plasma, it was still one of the things I have feared the most.
My experience with it would be that, providing you are on the settings, especially in the 200 hours that is recommended, a good plasma will look after you. The reason 200/500/1000 hours are commonly mentioned as burn in periods, is that the initial stages of a plasma's life are when the Phosphors are newest, and are most susceptible to Image Retention or damage due to effectively being most sensitive, and brightest.
I *have* noticed image retention; however this is my own fault, and it wasn't easy! Over a few drinks, with a few friends I ended up playing World of Warcraft (with obvious occasional alt tabbing and 5-10 min breaks) for approximately 8 or so hours on one of my days off.
As I sobered up, I realised what I was doing, and ended my session (I should be looking after this set in its early life!). No obvious retention from standard viewing differences, however being the paranoid sort; I wacked on a bright background (the blue screen you get when you rest on the PS3 home beta icon; I actually couldn't see anything on a raw black or white screen), and low and behold, when close to the set (within 1-2ft) I could make out the dull vague outlines on where some of the UI had been.
Note that I saw this because I was worried and went looking (and promptly had the heart attack every owner has when he first notices IR), however after half an hour or so of other usage this had become virtually unnoticeable from 1-2ft, and the only way it could be noticed was by standing within 6 inches of the screen.
Now after having used it for several hours since, even at 6 inches, whatever is left is so minimal, that I'm of half a mind I'm now seeing things because I'm trying to see them, not because they're there.
Since I got the screen, hour or two long session of Warcraft 3 custom maps and other games (HL2 Fakefactory) have absolutely no ill-effects (and trust me I've looked). Nor can I see any elements of my windows desktop.
So, as you can see, if you use the tv with sensible settings; and dont have the same thing on screen for absolutely hours, you will likely be fine, every plasma owner may experience occasional image retention, but you are very unlikely under standard usage, as long as you take care not to have logos emblazoned day in day out, to experience any major problems!
It does of course pay to do your reasearch though, as some brands are better than others.
2) Are blacks/colours really that much better?
Compared to the LCDs I used to work with and have seen, at its best, this Plasma (and better ones will be coming out later this year) walks all over any but the best led backlit LCD when it comes to blacks, and the same goes for colour.
*Good* Plasmas (its as possible to get lousy plasmas as lousy LCDs and, well just about anything else you can buy) are very much capable of producing a richer, more life like picture.
This plasma leaves my old, cheap samsung-based LCD, and my old PVA based monitor in the dust.
Stuff like Planet Earth and Dark Knight look absolutely stunning.
3) Is 1080p worth it?
Only if the processing is there to back it up, and you either want to 'future-proof' or intend to view a lot of Full HD material; 720p screens at the same price as a cheap 1080p set may well have better quality screens and electronics, resulting in improvements to things like the scaler.
On the other hand Plasma's have only recently become affordable in 1080p due to the technology, so a larger proportion of 1080p Plasmas are of generally high quality.
4) What are phosphor trails/motion blur really like?
Not bad at all; the videos you have seen are heavily processed to exaggerate the problem. I have looked for the issue, and it is marginally viewable if you move something quickly accross the screen, or turn quickly in a very colourful game. It manifests its self as a very slight blue tinge to the edge of moving items, in thier wake.
Unless you have exceptional eyesite, and look for it, this is very unlikely to bother you much, and is far less noticable in my opinion than the motion blur and smearing which goes with a lot of LCD panels.
Another thing I noticed is at native resolution, the plasma produces a much 'smoother', CRT-esque image than the oft processed look of an LCD, and 'jaggies' and other resolution issues seem less of an issue/softer.
Motion Blur and noticeable phosphor trails are set to be reduced even further with newer sets coming out this year!
5)Do Plasmas need refilled/regassing?
No. This is a modern myth of Plasma. Panasonic and the other manufacturers all rate thier products for a half-life (the time it takes to reach half brightness) of 30,000 hours or more. Panasonic rated thier 2008 range at 100, 000 hours. At 24 hours per day, you're looking at roughly 4000 days of usage, or well over 10 years. In the same time, an LCDs backlight will go; and if we're honest most equipment has gone faulty or been replaced.
6)Plasma - old technology compared to LCD?
Nope, both technologies have been about since the 1960/70's, however like all technologies it takes a long time til they filter down to home owner and consumer price levels.
Plasma and LCD are both looking set to be replaced in the future by OLED and other technologies, however it will be quite a few years before they are as affordable as the technology we appreciate at the moment.
In other words don't let ignorant salespeople confuse you telling you Plasma is outdated and LCD is newer tech.
(I used to be a salesperson in a large chain, and some of the staff knew little about many of the things they sell, although don't tar everyone with the same brush; some will give you genuine assistance as far as they can)
7) Would I still have bought it having lived with it for a few days, or would I have gone for a higher end LCD?
I'd keep the plasma
I'm pretty sure I've missed out some questions I wanted to answer; but hopefully that helps some of you umm-ing and ahh-ing over whether to go Plasma, or stick to LCD as its what you hear more about. Feel free to ask any questions you want!
Last edited:
i think panny are quoting nearer 60k hours for their new displays.
