Concentrated solar power

EnergyRevolutio said:
I don't care about a username I care about my kids future, ...

When the money already spent on the IRAQ war or in Bank Bail-Out packages would have been spent into DESERTEC, then we would be almost there already ...
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and then we'd be screwed when any state decided to sabotage/hold hostage/up the fees for using their land the cables from Africa.

what if one of the countries turns around after you've set it all up and says nahh we've decided we're not going to sell you the power unless you triple our cut.
 
It's like those youtube chain letter things:

I DONT REALLY BELIEVE THIS BUT IM NOT TAKING ANY CHANCES GET YOUR MP TO SIGN THIS OR YOUR FAMILY WILL DIE SEND THIS TO EVERYONE
 
EnergyRevolutio said:
That's why you build many of them in various countries, SPAIN, ITALY, GREECE, TURKY, MORROCO, EGYPT, ALGERIA, TUNISIA, etc ... so that there is a market and competition.
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still got to route all the cables through small areas.


BTW. Oil you don't sell today you can sell tomorrow, however the Sun you don't collect today is gone, you loose money on not delivering ... with OIL and gas you can wait until your partners resevers dry up and deliver later refilling the Oil and Gas storages
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but with this you say give us triple our cut or tomorrow you have no lights.

AS you said we can stockpile our oil and coal, but we can;t stockpile this so we have to keep buying it everyday or we lose all our power grid.


I dunno about you but i prefer not to have all my power generating capabilities outside of the borders where they are easily abused by others.
 
D D Danneh said:
It's like those youtube chain letter things:

I DONT REALLY BELIEVE THIS BUT IM NOT TAKING ANY CHANCES GET YOUR MP TO SIGN THIS OR YOUR FAMILY WILL DIE SEND THIS TO EVERYONE
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OMFG I thought it was ****** but I love my family. :( pls not hurt my mummy energyrevolutio. :(
 
EnergyRevolutio said:
Seawater Desalination

... and most importantly you give them fresh water, by using waste heat from the steam cycle, increasing the efficiency of the plant ...

http://www.solarthermalworld.org/node/507
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what do they need you for in that example?

the plant's in their country, so is all the power. they just have to take it over and cut the lines to you.

Only way you're not going to have complete black outs the next day is to either pay up or invade and retake your plant, and then hope to god it doesn;t get damaged.

this idea relies far to heavily on people all being kind and good.
 
EnergyRevolutio said:
Only true for photovoltaics, not for solar thermal ... especially when combined with sea water desalination it's very efficient, comparable to a coal fired plant ... only you do not have to buy coal ...
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Very interesting! I didn't know that. So, what's the efficiency percentage of solar thermal?

Right, this is why many solar thermal power palnts need to be built that the costs for components goes down through the economies of scale ...

... and after the palnt is paid off after like 15-25 years it basically prints money ...
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Well, I don't think it's quite as simple as "printing money". It certainly saves a lot. But you do need equipment that's capable of running for 15-25 years with minimum maintenance. Breakages are expensive to replace.

Don't get me wrong; I love solar and I wish there was more of it. I just want to see it improved to the point of economic viability. At the moment it still can't compete with fossil fuels.
 
fusion really is getting along nicely. They have built a small reactor in the UK and are now building a full size one in France.

Also the Americans are having a go using lasers instead of gas.

But still 30 years +

We easily have enough Nuclear fuel to use Fusion until then but it just annoys me we are relying on the French.

I mean yeah the free market sounds good but in reality they all just pretend to do it and when it comes down to it buy from their own country.

France use French companies, America mainly American and so fourth.

And tbh for things that are very important and everyone needs nationalisation isn't a bad idea. Would be very happy if gas/electric/water were public.

Private companies raise prices at the worst times and generally hold us to ransom imo.



As for renewables. I am all for them assuming they can be made more efficient. but I don't think they cut it at the moment, however energy security might be worth the extra cost.

No going to war for oil or worry of what russia does etc etc.
 
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I've been following the progress of fusion for a lot longer than many posters here have been alive... and I've reluctantly come to the conclusion that those involved are chasing rainbows.

Fission was a piece of cake... nature does all the work for you. But fusion is a *totally* different problem. When they say '30-50 years' what they mean is: we haven't a clue how to get from where we are now to something which actually generates more energy than you put into it, but we think someone in the next two generations might!

I want to be wrong, but I suspect that even if they solve the problems involved in sustained generation the costs will be absolutely astronomical, limiting its use.

In the mean time we should be taxing energy like mad to reduce consumption, and building fission reactors like there's no tomorrow. Forget planning laws, force them through on existing sites, and a new generation can be built in five years (and that's according to someone who works in the field). It's the paperwork and consultation that takes forever.

Once that new generation is built we can ponce about with windmills, tidal, solar, human treadmills for convicts, and anything else we fancy. But first we need that position of generating strength. That strength will never ever come from renewables. And I speak as a huge fan of renewables. It's just that people routinely underestimate just how incredibly energy-dense coal/gas/nuclear generation is.

The government should have used this credit crunch spending spree to work on *this* problem, not propping up people and businesses which economic evolution was trying to cull. It's a huge wasted opportunity.

Andrew McP
 
How is fusion these days? Have all containment wrinkles been ironed out?

Tefal said:
and then we'd be screwed when any state decided to sabotage/hold hostage/up the fees for using their land the cables from Africa.

what if one of the countries turns around after you've set it all up and says nahh we've decided we're not going to sell you the power unless you triple our cut.
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I was thinking the very same thing.

Most of the oil reserves are in unstable regions. Most of the sunniest deserts are in unstable regions.

Fate, it seems, is not without a sense of irony. :p
 
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