Arsene Wenger

So your saying that a player at 4 years old will never get better as a good player is a good player? Same when he's 57?

Song has gotten better, do you even watch the games?

Can I ask you an honest question. Are you a troll? You seem to want to wind people up, but it's not even funny?
 
drunkenmaster said:
Age has nothing, absolutely NOTHING to do with anything. Fabregas was very very very close to as good as he is now, when he was 18, he was still pretty damn good at 16.

Experience and age are massively overplayed, as is money spent and who you spend it on.

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i havent read the rest of your post YET. however i massively disagree with this. Fabregas at 18 was still learning the game, learning how to play his position, how to position himself, how to pick the right pass out, and mentally asses his own position. he was still learning everything from passing, to taking touches, to taking shots. he was learning. Fabregas at 22 is still learning, when he's 27/28 if he hasn't had an injury plauged career is when u will see the BEST out of him, it will be his prime years.
so i disagre with that statement massively.
 
drunkenmaster said:
AGe does have nothing to do with it, a good player is a good player, its as simple as that.

if it was ALL about age and experience Song would be better than he was 3 years ago and would have the potential to be world class in another decade. However he hasn't improved, he will never improve and he'll always be crap.

We don't need experienced players, we need GOOD players. Sorry but Song could play for another 25 years, have more experience than any other player, ever, but he'd still be a terrible football player.

The experience, or lack thereof is NOT our problem, its simply bad players. You replace the bad players and we'll play better. You know how I know, because the few times we've put out a team without so many bad players, WE PLAY BETTER.

Look at the teams we've put out when we've WON recently. Vela, Ramsey, Gibbs, Bendtner, Song and Djourou, Fabianski. They were unquestionably and undeniably less experienced sides, missing our players who've been around for ages like RVP, older players like RVP, Gallas, Toure. Yet we still won, and played better football.

it has NOTHING to do with age, it has NOTHING to do with spending money.

These arguments Wenger makes about spending cash and being responsible are null and void. The board make public statements every year that he's allowed to spend what he wants. We make a pretty huge profit, if you spend £15 mil of a 30mil profit, you still have a £15mil profit, it doesn't suddenly collapse you into losing £100mil a year.

But again one day Wenger will be saying we have no money, another day he says its irresponsible to spend and doesn't know if we have any money, the next day he's telling us how much money the club made and the board are telling us what we can spend. Another day he's saying we don't need to buy, yet again another statement will call Diaby Denilson and SOng the next SCholes, Giggs and Beckham. Yet another day he'll go on about how spending is irresponsible so he won't be replacing the entire defence......... blaming the defence in a round about way.

if Wenger took any of the blame himself, and didn't change his reason for not spending every single press conference, in direct disagreement with what his boss's are telling people he might have a leg to stand on.

Whatever the question he essentially chooses one of 6 random excuses why he won't change his ways.

Fabregas is better at 18 that he was at 16, he's better at 21 than he was at 18 and he'll likely be better at 25 than he is now, but not hugely, he was fully capable of winning games for us at 16, as he is now.

Vela has won games for us already, he's a very very good player, he'll get better, but he's damn good now. THe problem is they are both leagues above for instance, Song, and no amount of experience will EVER make him good.

Its NOT experience you need in a team for success, its simply good players, young, old, cheap or expensive, none of that matters, a good player, is a good player, is a good player.

i
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BRO Your seriously asking for a bitch slap u dumb ****. sorry for my outburst but this guy frustrates the HECK out of me. EXPERIENCE HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH IT. Let me explain to you, as one of the above posters said, lets take Keirin Gibbs for example, the little slips, the accidental passes that lead to the opposition, its all to do with him just starting to play EPL THIS SEASON + being 19 Years old. I GUARANTEE you, in years to come you won't see him doing this, thus the mental attributes have increased, the physical aspects have matured and his whole round game will contribute him and compliment him. at the moment the kid proberbly doesn't know twiddle from twaddle.
this quote ****ed me off: Look at the teams we've put out when we've WON recently. Vela, Ramsey, Gibbs, Bendtner, Song and Djourou, Fabianski. They were unquestionably and undeniably less experienced sides, missing our players who've been around for ages like RVP, older players like RVP, Gallas, Toure. Yet we still won, and played better football.
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you win a few games with less experiened players and all of a sudden experience has nothing to do with it, are u stupid? how many times ahve u seen Gallas pop up with a header in extra time to win, will u see Ramsey doing that, Vela, Gibs? song or Djourou? no u won't. of course even with less experienced but very talented individuals u still have the power to win games but I GUARANTEE u wouldn't be able to do it with that squad for 5-6 games unbeaten as the experience will kick in sooner rather than later.

A perfect example of this was chelsea, the inexperience showed and u got owned. 4-1 was the score:P? experience is everything, im sure your drunk when your posting this babble.

Fabregas is better at 18 that he was at 16, he's better at 21 than he was at 18 and he'll likely be better at 25 than he is now, but not hugely, he was fully capable of winning games for us at 16, as he is now.
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No, Fabregas will be IMMENSILY better at 27/28 than he is now. He wasnt the match winner at 16/18, tbh he isnt a MATCH WINNER now. how often do u see him popping up with that extra time goal, hardly. thats not his game. hes a great passer off the ball, he can move it around like not many others. what a stupid thing to say, fabregas now is tnnes better than he was at 16, and fabregas at 27/28 will **** over fabregas at 16. idiot.

Its NOT experience you need in a team for success, its simply good players, young, old, cheap or expensive, none of that matters, a good player, is a good player, is a good player.
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so fabregas at 11/12 would be a player to bring u success or even be able to hack the EPL. sorry jsut a long shot but another point which proves u are a babbling bafoon and Henry at 45 will be a match winner and goal scorer for you in the EPL. NO IM JUST SAYING AS AGE DOSENT MATTER DOES IT DRUNKETMASTER YOU MUPPET.
 
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drunkenmaster said:
AGe does have nothing to do with it...

...Fabregas is better at 18 that he was at 16, he's better at 21 than he was at 18 and he'll likely be better at 25 than he is now
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Contradict much? :confused:

AGE has EVERYTHING to do with it! As demonstrated by your own comments, Fabregas is better now than he was at 16 because of EXPERIENCE. And, as Nabz rightly points out, he'll be better still at 27/28 because of, wait for it... MORE EXPERIENCE!
 
drunkenmaster said:
AGe does have nothing to do with it, a good player is a good player, its as simple as that.

if it was ALL about age and experience Song would be better than he was 3 years ago and would have the potential to be world class in another decade. However he hasn't improved, he will never improve and he'll always be crap.

.........babble, carp, tripe, babble babble
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:confused:

Thought he was playing alright, ok maybe not a starting XI DM for where Arsenal want to be but definately a rotation player.

Nabz said:
No, Fabregas will be IMMENSILY better at 27/28 than he is now. He wasnt the match winner at 16/18, tbh he isnt a MATCH WINNER now.
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Yeh, he was totally lost in the games against Man U. To be fair i dont think Wenger helped by playing a 4-5-1. Are they not a 4-4-2 team?
 
Thermaltake said:
Yeh, he was totally lost in the games against Man U. To be fair i dont think Wenger helped by playing a 4-5-1. Are they not a 4-4-2 team?
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If only AW took that into account tbh.

He knows we are weak in midfield so he plays the extra man there to cover up everyones **** ups!

It seems to me nobody here watched the Chelsea game.

Did you not see Arsenal closing down on every ball and winning most of the tackles. That is what made it awesome because for the first 25 minutes we looked like a world class team, untill it got to the penalty area then everything just crumbles.

The midfield were superb they were closing down and winning tackles and frustrating Chelsea and it was brilliant.

Then the goal came and all of the players had their heads down. Nobody to pick them up, nobody to try and rally everyone together and get them moving.

The team is fine! Just look at what we did against Chelsea, it's just the lack of motivation, no leader in the team.

I just think we need a good finisher, like Henry, that can just tap balls in.

We always look for a final pass...

SOMEONE SHOOT FFS!
 
drunkenmaster said:
Vela has won games for us already, he's a very very good player, he'll get better, but he's damn good now. THe problem is they are both leagues above for instance, Song, and no amount of experience will EVER make him good.
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Why do you consistently keep banging on about Vela, sure we all know he has talent but he's still very much work in progress.....the longer the season has gone on the worse he has got which is why he has been warming the bench.

In the home game against Sunderland which i was at Vela was probably the worst player on the pitch, w/out exaggeration btw.

And Song is getting better and better the more he plays, he is never going to be a Vieira but a very useful squad player he will become i am sure.

If Arsenal really dissapoint you this much maybe you should find another team, you're soooooo depressing mate.
 
Meeko said:
AGE has EVERYTHING to do with it! As demonstrated by your own comments, Fabregas is better now than he was at 16 because of EXPERIENCE. And, as Nabz rightly points out, he'll be better still at 27/28 because of, wait for it... MORE EXPERIENCE!
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Experience is a somewhat blessing when for certain positions natural pace has declined. It's very important, but it doesn't meant players don't and can't reach their peak sooner if they're that good.

Cesc will be better later on, however something that can help this process is being surrounded by more experienced pros.

If kids aren't working or are clearly lost, then its in those situations where experience can be a real god send.
 
Next season we will win everything. I will promise you. Here is the team:
Defence
Almunia
Clichy
Gallas
Toure
Silvestre

Midfield

Nasri - left wing
Fabregas in an attacking midfielder role
Sagna playing in front the defence
Walcott on the wing

Attack

Van Persie
Arshavin

That team can and will win trophies. We also have strong players if there is injuries, Eduardo, Diaby, Song, Gibbs, Bendtner etc

We will rule next season and Wenger will shut everyone up.

Arshavin will score 35 goals next season. He was sorely missed in the CL Semi.
 
You really think the defence will look like that next year and that Wenger will put one of the best RB's in the world in DM when he could just buy one? Why?
 
Sagna works well in Midfield. Hes fast and is good at feeding Walcott, Walcott will then cross them in to Arshavin/VP for a tap in. Walcott will also need to improve his finishing as he can be good at finding space and getting a shot on goal as a solo attempt. Arshavin can blast them in from 20/30/40 yards. Fabregas can also finish very well.
 
Gooner14 said:
Why does everyone in the game always say Strikers are better at 28-30, keepers 30+ etc etc etc.
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really, who do most people concider the best player in the world today exactly?

lets see, the majority would go with Ronaldo, Messi, or Rooney would they not?

Of which none are noticeably better than last year, infact Ronaldo is widely regarded as no where near his form of last year.

Thats 3 incredibly young players, surely if it was all about the experience, world player of the year, euro player of the year, PFA, premier league player of the year etc, surely, by all of you saying its ALL about experience, surely those lists would all for sure be all older players right. Infact because its all about experience, if you guys were right, the list would HAVE TO be full of 30year old's and up, because its all about experience.

The fact that the list is of a bunch of young players, who have been as good as they are for a couple years. Gerrard, whose been as good as he is now for 4-5 years, Lampard, who has scored 20 a year for almost his 5th year in a row is it. Giggs, whose actually laughably much much worse now than 7-8 years ago who got it by , well, pity vote.

Laughably the people who won/were closest to winning the young player of the year award, were almost the same age as the main contenders for the normal player of the year award.


Why do people say strikers are best at 30 and keepers at 35, you want the patronising or the simple answer. Lets go with simple, VDS started in a different country at a club that couldn't compete or do anything decent, he shockingly aged as he played. He got older, he then moved to other teams and got older, eventually got to Fulham for a few years and was great, and eventually got to Man U. He was as good at Man U , and today, as he was WAY before he got to Fulham, he was just not at a champions league winning club, he hasn't gotten better, just better results as he moves as he gets older so the appearance is he's improved, he hasn't.

Lets not forget who the "best keeper in the world" was regarded as for, almost a decade, who was maybe the most expensive player, let alone keeper, when he moved for around £30million. I can't remember exactly but I think Buffon was a full 22 when he moved for that money.

Lets look at the other "best keepers" Casillas, young as anything when people thought he was amongst the best. Clamity james has always been a calamity, he hasn't improved or gotten worse in 10 years either.


Great players are great from a very young age, look at the Utd team, the great players, VDS, Rio, Rooney, Ronaldo, Scholes, Giggs, Neville, Evra, etc, these are not players who came into form late in their careers, they were very very very good from day one. if you want things you need players who are great, but all those same players were great a decade earlier aswell.


The complete fallacy that is older players is better is something people blurt out without remotely thinking. The general reason for it is simple, people move to several clubs and eventually move up to being at the best clubs the older they get, and their percieved quality improves with the better players around them.

Rooney hasn't really scored more than he was at 17/18 despite being in a much better team. His temperament might have changed, slightly, but he's as dangerous now as he was years ago. he was good then and good now, likewise, o'shea was completely and utterly average years ago, he's still not remotely a better player. nani sucked completely 3 years ago and is still a completely useless tit, Fletcher is exactly the same player as he was several years ago.


Henry was as good if not better, years ago than he is now. RVN was better years ago, Raul was better as a kid, Vieira isn't half the player he was 8 years ago, Overmars and Petit turned to crap as they got older, Beckham isn't as good as he was 5 years ago.



Sorry but, name me a player who was awful at 20 and world class at 30, you can't. You can name a player who was great in a small team at 20, who moved to a huge team and was scoring 20 goals a season at 30 but I can't name a single player who i'd regard as world class at 30 who was anything less than world class at 20.
 
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Messi is tonnes better this year than last, what are you talking about? Why do you fight these losing battles? Why do you have no sense?

And Rooney? The best player in the world? He's not even nearly one of the best strikers in the world!?!?

EDIT - The league now is so, so much harder than it has ever been before, it's silly to compare Lampard's goal tally of 5 years ago to now, the Premiership now is so much harder than it was 5 years ago so he's done amazing to maintain that level of scoring.
 
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