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ATI Radeon 5870 and 5870X2 specs revealed?

Not really the same thing Goonden. A lot of people (including me) would be happy if ATI just did a die shrink of current tech and re-released it.

The reason nVidia got a heap of bad press is that they didn't even bother to do that. It was simply a case of shifting huge stocks of poorly selling chips by giving them a new name. No changes, nothing. Just a BIOS flash, a new box, and off they went.

And sadly, your rant about "fanboys" just makes you look like one, sorry. :)
 
Yeah sorry Goon but it is totally different situation Ati are refining an existing architecture that they always intended to be refined and improved and developed. What Nvidia did was simply rebadge the same old stuff with absolute minimum alterations. Personally all i care about if what performs best for the money i have who makes it is not really something i care about i want the best for my cash though in terms of gfx card i don't buy them. All i want is at least two strong companys competing and keeping the cost down and the returns for that money up as thats what is best for all of us no matter who you prefer.
 
I think that they will always be competing with eachother, they both seem to release new high range cards about the same time as eachother, almost like they talk to eachother as a sort of combined effort, to make sure that nobody has a new card months ahead before the other one, wouldnt surprise me if they did this to keep the market high and expensive. The only thing to make them both stop and look is when Intel steps into the ring with there new GPU & CPU combination effort, which will hopefully make the market even more competitive
 
I doubt they will be releasing until around October time as that will be the time when Nvidia are due for releasing, so its still a bit of a wait for everyone
 
thegoonden said:
Well I dunno about Loadsa, but for myself, all I keep thinking as I read the "so what if it's the old Arch" comments, is "what if this were the green team doing this?" there would be wailing and gnashing of teeth and calls for crucifixion.
But when it comes to daft "kit-pocracy" OCUK's fora are old hands........look at all the people who will warn you off NV, and rave of their love of ATI, who will cite "bang for buck" and "sharp business practise" as their main reasons.........and every flaming one of them uses and Intel chip and will tell you to avoid the nasty AMD cos it's 3% slower for 1/2 the price. I mean it's not like the noble, heroic ATI are the same company as that horrid AMD, or as if Intel have EVER been questioned/investigated/convicted/hit with a record fine, in relation to their dodgy dealings. It amuses me something rotten ( all the more so, since personally, for me, speaking for myself, personally, I find the ultimate in a "peace and quiet" PC to be an AMD machine with an NV card, and Intel/ATI is not a combination I enjoy building when doing so for other people....though I still reccommend such combinations when appropriate......I find ATI's drivers to be flakier than NV's and always feel a huge lag when using Intel machines that's just not there on AMD).
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do you feel better now? Seriously a tweaked, to DX11, smaller process, substantially faster version of the same Arch is not a problem is it?

By same Arch, I mean shader to ROP ratios, ALU's etc all being substantially the same.

No one here meant the very same chip that has been renamed again and again to confuse punters. Its is not even close to the same thing.
 
thegoonden said:
Well I dunno about Loadsa, but for myself, all I keep thinking as I read the "so what if it's the old Arch" comments, is "what if this were the green team doing this?" there would be wailing and gnashing of teeth and calls for crucifixion.

- There's a difference between keeping the same architecture and raising clocks, and keeping the same architecture and clocks, but raising the price.

But when it comes to daft "kit-pocracy" OCUK's fora are old hands........look at all the people who will warn you off NV, and rave of their love of ATI, who will cite "bang for buck" and "sharp business practise" as their main reasons

- I for one use an nvidia card. Nothing wrong with them. ATI definitely do have the bang for buck in most of the market, but since 4870's and GTX260's are the same price, I chose nvidia.

and every flaming one of them uses and Intel chip and will tell you to avoid the nasty AMD cos it's 3% slower for 1/2 the price. I mean it's not like the noble, heroic ATI are the same company as that horrid AMD, or as if Intel have EVER been questioned/investigated/convicted/hit with a record fine, in relation to their dodgy dealings.

- Wut? I see a lot of specs for AMD deals in GH, and most often, they're better value. It's up to the buyer to choose what they want, and they usually go for intel due to preference. It's nothing to do with people warning them off AMD. The fine means nothing. I'm not gonna boycott a company because they undertook in some "dodgy dealings". If I like their product, and it works for me, I'll go for it. I went for i7 because it's the very best right now.

It amuses me something rotten ( all the more so, since personally, for me, speaking for myself, personally, I find the ultimate in a "peace and quiet" PC to be an AMD machine with an NV card, and Intel/ATI is not a combination I enjoy building when doing so for other people....though I still reccommend such combinations when appropriate......

- Can't personally comment on that, never had an ATI card or AMD PC. "Peace and quiet" CPU's are a load of rubbish though. That depends on the heatsinks, and many heatsinks are compatible between different sockets, on both sides. Granted, AMD may run cooler or have better energy management features, but a better heatsink will make a lot more difference than a different CPU.

I find ATI's drivers to be flakier than NV's and always feel a huge lag when using Intel machines that's just not there on AMD).

- While it's not totally relevant (comparing laptop and PC), I can actually vouch for ATI's drivers. On my ATI laptop, the drivers worked flawlessly update after update. Granted, I couldn't play a lot of games, simply because it wasn't that powerful, but in every game I did play, there was no driver problems or graphical glitches. With my new PC though, I have had some trouble with NV drivers. That may be due to Windows 7 (although ATI drivers work fine on my laptop with W7), but that doesn't change my experiences with them.
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im still confused will it be this concept or just simple single core concept as we have now ?

ATi5870Concept.png


ATi5000Series.png


?
 
I read somewhere that ATi don't need a new arc for Dx11, as they have it already, or near enough it, and the only reason Nvidia need a new arc, is because they got Microsoft to change the Dx10 spec (they had to get it dumbed down for them or something).

EDIT :- ahh it was the Inkwell, so salt required i guess :- http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1137331/a-look-nvidia-gt300-architecture

DX11 is a much funnier story. The DX10 feature list was quite long when it was first proposed. ATI dutifully worked with Microsoft to get it implemented, and did so with the HD2900. Nvidia stomped around like a petulant child and refused to support most of those features, and Microsoft stupidly capitulated and removed large tracts of DX10 functionality.

This had several effects, the most notable being that the now castrated DX10 was a pretty sad API, barely moving anything forward. It also meant that ATI spent a lot of silicon area implementing things that would never be used. DX10.1 put some of those back, but not the big ones.

DX11 is basically what DX10 was meant to be with a few minor additions. That means ATI has had a mostly DX11 compliant part since the HD2900. The R870/HD5870 effectively will be the fourth generation DX11 GPU from the red team. Remember the tessellator? Been there, done that since 80nm parts.
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Well in fairness to him you only have to look at how nvidia reacted to any company who implemented 10.1 to see that analogy may not be far off the mark.
 
well nvidia did "stomp around like a petulant child" when games like Assassins Creed were released to get dx10.1 features removed so I wouldnt be surprised if it was true
 
They also try very hard to push PhysX and CUDA as features to try and influence a buyer's decision.

Whilst they're nice to have, nVidia need to learn that performance is first and foremost, and that either of the two listed above are nice to have, but not really essential.
 
PhysX can be nice to have if a game uses this feature, but CUDA most gaming people dont really care about, as it doesnt improve any aspect of a game
 
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