Virgin Media throttleing...

ojrules

ojrules

ojrules

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So after being told something like last year that 10mb was imminent i've waited a helluva long time, today i speed check and wheeyyy ive got 10mb broadband.....

I test it bbc hd out onthe tv downstairs, and whats this, i get a message saying i need over 3.5 mb ...... checked again , ive now got 2.5mb....

- Just had a look at their throttleing policy.. between 4pm and 9m the max useage is 750mb... http://www.virginmedia.com/help/traffic-management.php

- Am i right in thinking this wont even get you through a whole 1 hour episode on bbc hd?...
 
I think the issue lies with the BBC iplayer!

Do you use the iplayer desktop downloader? as I believe you can only have so much stored content from them at any one time.

If not then yup it sucks, although I've not encounted it yet so I'm happy for time being.
 
No, the issue lies with low bandwidth caps on an unlimited service that NTL/Virgin have oversold despite raking it in from all angles.

We fund the BBC with the TV license.
The BBC pays their internet bill to the service provider.
We pay the service provider again for our connection.

Who's getting the shaft here? It's certainly not Virgin and these caps are, quite plainly, ridiculous.
 
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yashiro said:
No, the issue lies with low bandwidth caps on an unlimited service that NTL/Virgin have oversold despite raking it in from all angles.

We fund the BBC with the TV license.
The BBC pays their internet bill to the service provider.
We pay the service provider again for our connection.

Who's getting the shaft here? It's certainly not Virgin and these caps are, quite plainly, ridiculous.
Click to expand...

The caps stop heavy downloaders negatively effecting the connection of others. You have said it yourself they have oversold in some areas, so to manage the problem they implemented the caps. If you dont like these caps that have been in place for MANY months, perhaps even a year now, then either upgrade to a higher tier so the bandwidth caps are in line with your needs, or move to a different ISP.

There are many ISPs out there that will simply kick you off their service or increase the price if you download too much, with VM you can download as much as you want, 24/7, but you will take a speed penalty if you do, which IMO is by far better then getting disconected or being charged extra. If you download smart the caps will not even be noticed.
 
I never used to notice the caps (I'm on 20mb) but I'm sure they have lowered the threshold as there is no way i download as much as that site says before i get capped down to 500kbs......
 
Elfmeister. said:
I think the issue lies with the BBC iplayer!

Do you use the iplayer desktop downloader? as I believe you can only have so much stored content from them at any one time.

If not then yup it sucks, although I've not encounted it yet so I'm happy for time being.
Click to expand...

BBC have moved away from P2P technology and now just stream directly. 30min HD show on BBC is about 670MB
 
yashiro said:
No, the issue lies with low bandwidth caps on an unlimited service that NTL/Virgin have oversold despite raking it in from all angles.

We fund the BBC with the TV license.
The BBC pays their internet bill to the service provider.
We pay the service provider again for our connection.

Who's getting the shaft here? It's certainly not Virgin and these caps are, quite plainly, ridiculous.
Click to expand...

I fail to understand why internet users think they should be given whatever they want for free.

Virgin offer a service, it's clear how much service you're given for the price you pay. If you don't like it, pay more and get more, or pay nothing and get nothing.

Let's look at this in perspective:

You go to McDonalds and order a Quarter Pounder with Cheese Extra Value Meal. You hand over your £3 and you get a meal that's X in size. So what happens when you eat it and you're still hungry? Do you whinge and whine about it that the portions are not big enough? No? Why not? Because they offer Large meals and Extra Large meals. Just buy a bigger meal if you want to eat more food.

Or

You go to a car dealership and you spend £10,000 on a new Fiesta. That Fiesta has a top speed of 110mph. Hang on a minute, that £17,000 Focus ST has a top speed of 135mph. How is that fair? Oh the humanity! You paid for a product and you're only getting the 110mph you were told about when you paid for it! It's not fair that you have to pay more money to get a faster car!
 
It's about today's acceptable uses or more clearly the changing use of services.
The bandwidth caps don't seem to accommodate the changing demands of users any more. Watching a show or two from the BBC is hardly heavy use. Certainly not in the realms of people who hammer usenet or torrent 24/7.

You're right about you get what you pay for to an extent. But with such low caps, using the internet for today's content delivery is terrible unless you pay top whack. The ISPs don't help themselves by calling their services unlimited, when it does indeed have limits. Limits that for non technical users are quite confusing.

But in the end, yeah, if you want more pay more. It's OK for companies to make profit hand over fist at our expense.
 
The bandwidth caps do however reflect the usage that the packages are aimed at...

The likes of the M package are meant as a basic package for light users, not those who want to watch streaming HD video (effectively a dial up alternative/alternative to the basic ADSL packages).

For streaming HD on a regular basis a higher level package would be more appropriat, but people aren't willing to pay for that (and oddly enough most ISP's aren't making huge profits becuase the users aren't willing to pay much more than cost if that...).
 
- the whole thing was that i wasnn't heavily downloading- and the cap is 750mb ... hardly excessive useage over the period of 5 hours...
The capage system also seems to be quite strange.. my friend lives in the same area, and he's on the smae package, and downloaded over 2gb's of content last night, with no throttleing....
 
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DampCat said:
I fail to understand why internet users think they should be given whatever they want for free.

Virgin offer a service, it's clear how much service you're given for the price you pay. If you don't like it, pay more and get more, or pay nothing and get nothing.

Let's look at this in perspective:

You go to McDonalds and order a Quarter Pounder with Cheese Extra Value Meal. You hand over your £3 and you get a meal that's X in size. So what happens when you eat it and you're still hungry? Do you whinge and whine about it that the portions are not big enough? No? Why not? Because they offer Large meals and Extra Large meals. Just buy a bigger meal if you want to eat more food.

Or

You go to a car dealership and you spend £10,000 on a new Fiesta. That Fiesta has a top speed of 110mph. Hang on a minute, that £17,000 Focus ST has a top speed of 135mph. How is that fair? Oh the humanity! You paid for a product and you're only getting the 110mph you were told about when you paid for it! It's not fair that you have to pay more money to get a faster car!
Click to expand...

the whole point is, is that the threshold is so low.. you can only get through 45 mins of hd conetnt on iplayer before being throttled by 75% ...
 
As Werewolf rightly pointed out, M package is a basic package designed for people who aren't downloading high amounts of data on a daily basis. 750mb in one day is more than enough for it's target market, people who check their emails, order some bits from ebay and maybe check out some flight information for their summer holidays.

If you want to do more than that, you have to expect to require a higher service, which ultimately comes at a price.
 
ojrules said:
- the whole thing was that i wasnn't heavily downloading- and the cap is 750mb ... hardly excessive useage over the period of 5 hours...
The capage system also seems to be quite strange.. my friend lives in the same area, and he's on the smae package, and downloaded over 2gb's of content last night, with no throttleing....
Click to expand...

But you also need to keep in mind you are on the lowest tier of broadband. You was previously a 2mb customer and was upgraded to 10mb (As is the entire country).

If you want to steam HD content and stuff then you really should be upgrading from the lowest tier. Even to the L Broadband tier or even the 20mb, these packages offer bigger STM limits and will suit you better.

Also about your friend downloading 2GB over night, it's totally STM free. After 9pm you can do what you want.
 
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There are two fair arguments in here. One is that Virgin Media confuses customers with promises of "unlimited" without directly telling the customer or informing them of the limits short of printing them in small print.

Someone used the Mcdonalds analogy before, I'd like to expand on that with a different analogy. You go out and buy a car. You can't afford something big or fast, but you see a bog standard looking Clio. The dealer tells you that it can do 110mph topped out, and you are happy with that. You buy the car and go on your merry way down the motorway. You top it out at (70mph don't want the PC busy bodies coming down on me like a lead balloon at a childs birthday party) and all of a sudden you find the car splutters and then reduces to 30mph. You quickly root out your agreement and see in size 4 font on the text nobody reads that this is by design.

The real question is, what qualifies as "excessive usage"? With todays "Digital Britain" constantly growing and changing to accomodate the growing need for digital services, surely a "rewrite" of what qualifies as excessive is necessary. Personally I think if you are paying for a "low" package you really should not be complaining about not being able to stream HD services. In that respect I agree with the bandwidth throttling.
 
Point is, people who know all about the throttling, understand what it means, have a vague idea of how much data 750mb is and are regularly using more should be on a higher tiered package. They're also aware of the 750mb threshold. It's not a surprise, a sordid secret they spring on you when you least expect it, it's stated when you sign up and maintaining ignorance won't wash, especially if you have the technical knowledge to do all the things we're talking about doing.

And, there ARE unlimited data plans available on VM. 2 in fact. Y'all just don't want to pay for them.
 
DampCat said:
Point is, people who know all about the throttling, understand what it means, have a vague idea of how much data 750mb is and are regularly using more should be on a higher tiered package. They're also aware of the 750mb threshold. It's not a surprise, a sordid secret they spring on you when you least expect it, it's stated when you sign up and maintaining ignorance won't wash, especially if you have the technical knowledge to do all the things we're talking about doing.

And, there ARE unlimited data plans available on VM. 2 in fact. Y'all just don't want to pay for them.
Click to expand...

That's a bad argument to be honest. Just because those of us who understand the technicals see it as a rip off, that doesn't mean that people who aren't aware at home aren't being ripped off also; it simply means they don't understand why there internet is on a go slow.

No, there aren't ANY truly unlimited data plans available. You get capped on them all.
 
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