Repairing someone elses windows install

[JonJ678]

Hey guys. Situation I'm faced with is the stepmothers computer. Its running windows xp, with four user accounts, one for each member of the family. 2.4ghz pentium 4, 1gb ddr1. I'm not trying to upgrade that again, it's a dell and shredded my fingers putting more ram in. I'm trying to persuade her to spot £500 on replacing it already, but in the meantime it would be good to get the current machine running nicely.

So far its running spybot and avg, passes scans of either cleanly. Zone alarm free. However the system is a state, hideous mix of uninstalled and part uninstalled programs. Really silly numbers of shortcuts that don't go anywhere. The solution I'd use myself is reformat and install from scratch, but I *really* don't want to kill any bookmarks, document settings, files etc.

First option. Back up everything and reinstall. I like this one, but don't know where to find application settings. All files are probably in my documents, but where does office 2003 save settings to? Similarly firefox, and possibly some other programs. Any analogue of /home in windows? Wonderfully Ive got the missus saving everything to a second partition, with the desktop and so forth invisibly linked to it. No such luck with the mother.

Second option. Clean the current install as best I can. Something tells me this will be more time consuming and leave a worse end result, but its only current option if I can't back up everything.

So what should I do? Its been a while since I used windows all the time, but I'm competant. I never learnt to back up settings, as I just save data to a different drive and reinstall at will, normally from a slipstreamed nlite. Even now I don't have /home on a seperate partition.

Advice welcomed.

p.s. Its windows xp, and staying that way. I could retrain her to use openoffice and ubuntu swifter than I could change her to using windows 7, but this doesn't mean either option is a practical one. I do wonder if she'd notice me changing it to kde without telling her, but better safe than sorry

 

[theheyes]

The Windows version of /home is in C:\Documents & Settings\%username%. Enable view hidden folders and you should be able to see whatever application settings that live there.

Personally, I would just do a file backup and export the bookmarks from within Firefox then reinstall. Consider giving them all standard accounts when you've finished also.

 

[Mik3]

Whist your formatting you should consider partitioning the HDD and install your software on a separate partition, that way it keeps your windows partition cleaner and much easy to manage, faster to defrag also.

 

[daztrouk]

personally, i'd wipe everything and start from scratch. as mentioned before, you can export your firefox menu's/bookmarks. The majority of teh other rograms will have their settings within C:\Documents & Settings\%username%. if you can, backup to an external drive first, that way you'll be able to restore teh data from the image incase you miss anything first time round.

 

[ChrisD.]

Whist your formatting you should consider partitioning the HDD and install your software on a separate partition, that way it keeps your windows partition cleaner and much easy to manage, faster to defrag also.

What a load of nonsense, partitioning is a complete waste of time. You might as well create D, E and F folders on the root of the C drive.

 

[theheyes]

Partitioning is not a waste of time for keeping data files seperate from the OS, but I wouldn't install software to anything other than the primary partition unless I ran out of disk space.

 

[ChrisD.]

Partitioning is not a waste of time for keeping data files seperate from the OS, but I wouldn't install software to anything other than the primary partition unless I ran out of disk space.

How are they separate? They are still on the same disk, sperated by nothing other than a drive letter (which might as well be a folder on the root).

Partitioning the drive will offer no advantages. If the drive decides to spit out a dummy and have a catastrophic fail you'll lose all data stored on it whether it is one whole partition of split into x amount of partitions.

Partition it if you have the OS and want to make things easier should you want a fresh OS install, although one thing to remember when doing this is that all programs should be installed onto the C drive, as if they are on another partition when the OS is reinstalled, they won't work anymore. Since the PC will probably not be rebuilt in a hurry, I would personally keep the drive as one partition and regularly use something like CCleaner or Tune Up etc to clean it out now and again. Having partitions will not stop OS clutter.

 

[Mik3]

What a load of nonsense, partitioning is a complete waste of time. You might as well create D, E and F folders on the root of the C drive.

And when your Windows screws up and you have to format, you have to backup all that data or lose it.

a lot of programs/games don't need reinstalling after a format, if you set your environment variables to seperate partitions. Its also easier to find and manage all your files IMO.

 

[ChrisD.]

And when your Windows screws up and you have to format, you have to backup all that data or lose it.

a lot of programs/games don't need reinstalling after a format, if you set your environment variables to seperate partitions. Its also easier to find and manage all your files IMO.

Windows doesn't simply "screw up" on a PC unless you're doing something drastically wrong.

Most programs that I know have to be reinstalled after an OS reinstall due to registry settings etc. User profiles of course can be saved.

 

[theheyes]

How are they separate? They are still on the same disk, sperated by nothing other than a drive letter (which might as well be a folder on the root).

Partitioning the drive will offer no advantages. If the drive decides to spit out a dummy and have a catastrophic fail you'll lose all data stored on it whether it is one whole partition of split into x amount of partitions.

Partition it if you have the OS and want to make things easier should you want a fresh OS install, although one thing to remember when doing this is that all programs should be installed onto the C drive, as if they are on another partition when the OS is reinstalled, they won't work anymore. Since the PC will probably not be rebuilt in a hurry, I would personally keep the drive as one partition and regularly use something like CCleaner or Tune Up etc to clean it out now and again. Having partitions will not stop OS clutter.

They are separate because they are on a separate logical partition, and you can have a completely different filesystem on each - so they really are separate. You've answered your own question really (highlighted) as the main reason I and many others do this is to make reinstalls easier without having to move my files. I don't think anyone is saying this is a safer option; it's obvious you obviously wouldn't back up to the same physical disk.

The short answer is if you keep data separate from the OS and applications you can easily (and quickly) re-image the primary partition should anything go wrong.

 

[JonJ678]

re partitions, two partitions are in physically seperate parts of the drive. So you can contrain windows to the faster bit at the start if you're so inclined. It's not the same as having another folder under c:\

C:\Documents & Settings\%username% is exciting. Am i right in thinking that copying this folder, formatting and reinstalling windows then the programs previously used, then copying this back will replace the start menu, application data, desktop and indeed everything else?

What does windows do with permissions? Id be saving this data for one user and discarding the others, as I'll leave it with 'mother' and 'other' as the only users. Concerned that it will reject the back up of this folder. It would be convenient to do this through ubuntu, which is likely to recklessly ignore windows permissions system.

If this looks good, I'll back the system up, wipe all the crap off it then start again. With regards to partitions, it'll have 3. C:\, data:\ which will have folders called desktop and so forth (can I just set C:\Documents & Settings\%username% to a folder on this, and have settings survive any future reinstalls?), and a hidden one with a working copy of linux and an image of the completed windows installation.

Is this the 'environment variables' mentioned above? I've got as far as Desktop and My documents on a different drive, if I can move more this would probably be useful. The ideal would be all data and settings, bookmarks and so forth saving to a seperate partition so when it all goes terribly wrong all that has to be done is to copy the image back over the C:\ drive, leaving windows none the wiser. Very like a seperate /home partition.

Thanks for all the replies guys

 

[drunkenmaster]

AS said, diff partitions most certainly are different. There plenty of reasons(not for everyone) to reinstall windows, but a corrupt windows install is most certainly possible, from virus's, to power cuts at the wrong time, a fan breaks, causes a crash at the wrong time and you can't reboot easily as something wasn't saved, etc, etc. A dodgey new driver, a rare windows update that screws up certain hardware. Putting the majority of your documents on a different partition makes it infinately easier to do a fresh install of windows on a clean formatted partition.

As others have said lots and lots of software will work without reinstalling, its hardly an issue though, if you delete everything on one single partition, all the software needs reinstalling anyway, any programs that still work, won't do at worst you'll save no reinstalling, at best everything works, in reality, some will, some won't, more so if certain programs which like installing required or hidden files on the main drive with no option to change location.

From my experience, most games work, though some needed updates to directx, .net and other things might be required that you'd normally have installed as you install the game(Lotro is one of those, but instead of reinstalling and patching 12gb of data, I can reinstall about 50mb of .net and be on my way.

Over the years i've saved loads of files by having documents, work and other things on alternate partitions when something went wrong. ALso upgrades that need a fresh windows install but using same hard drive are easier as again, just format the one partition.

THats excluding keeping things like movies/mp3's on other partitions so you can use the same drive across 3 diff windows versions over 5 years and never have to copy your video's/mp3's anywhere.

 

[Amnesia]

just run crap cleaner...its probably the best u can do for them

 

[CaptainCrash]

Second option. Clean the current install as best I can. Something tells me this will be more time consuming and leave a worse end result, but its only current option if I can't back up everything.

In theory I'd agree with everyone else that the "format/reinstall" option is best/quickest when a PC is in a complete mess, but I've had my fingers burnt in a similar situation before - unless you're very, very careful, you *will* lose at least some user data that's been squirrelled away in some ridiculous location (and not backed up, needless to say). Furthermore, it will inevitably be something of fundamental importance to the survival of humanity (or you'd think so, from the wailing that transpires when they realise it's gone for good).

If a brand-new PC is on the agenda in the short-to-medium term future anyway, I'd be inclined to simply clean up the present installation as best I could, and call it good.

 

[Guest2]

before you wipe, make sure you have all the drivers

 

[cokecan]

if you are going to format, give the file and settings wizard a look over

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/setup/expert/crawford_november12.mspx

I've not used it very often but have had success with it the few times I have. It will essentially backup their files and settings (including things like desktop wallpapers etc) and transfer them to a new system/install of windows so everything looks like it did before.

Could potentially save you a lot of headache if something isn't backed up etc

Alternatively what I usually do is as has been said, go to C:\Docs & Settings\Username, make sure hidden files are shown and just copy documents, desktop and favourites somewhere. you'll also need to export firefox bookmarks as a json file or something if any of them use firefox

The last thing that I always forgot! if any of them use outlook express of office outlook for email with an ISP email (i.e. @tiscali or @ntlworld etc), make sure you backup the pst/data files for these.

The office outlook one is easy, it should be located in C:\Docs & Settings\Username\Application Data\Microsoft\Outlook. you'll probably see 2 files called outlook.pst and archive.pst, you'll want to back both of these up and drop them back in the same place after the format (and after office has been setup)

The Outlook Express one is in a different place, usually C:\Docs & Settings\Username\Application Data\Identities\{random hex number}\Microsoft\Outlook Express. In there you'll see 6 or so .dbx files, you'll want to back all of these up and again, drop them back here after a format. With Outlook Express I always find its good to make a copy of the address book too as it's stored seperatly from the main data files unlike Office Outlook (the addy's are stored in the .pst file witht he emails). This is found in C:\Docs & Settings\Username\Application Data\Microsoft\Address Book. there should be a .wab file in there, if you open this you'll see their contacts/emails. again as before, just make a copy etc

I hope this is of some help?

 

[Mattus]

What a load of nonsense, partitioning is a complete waste of time. You might as well create D, E and F folders on the root of the C drive.

For a waste of time, it's certainly saved a lot of my time. Reinstalling Windows is so awkward with all your data on the same partition. Since having a 40GB partition for my OS, reinstalling is a breeze. You can even use Acronis to create an image of the OS partition and save it elsewhere. It won't help you if the HD dies, but you're looking at it too narrowly.

 

[eXor]

What a load of nonsense, partitioning is a complete waste of time. You might as well create D, E and F folders on the root of the C drive.

LOL!

My C:\ partition is 20 GB. 1:1 OS backup images are compact and created / restored quickly.

If I were to back up a 500 GB C:\ partition, it would be a different story.

 

[peige]

Putting stuff in separate partitions is good, but it rarely works out, every piece of software installed afterwords will be stuffed on the C drive anyway... it only really comes into its own if its your PC and you change the default install paths on everything you put on new proggys

Personally I'd make her spend out on a new hard drive (moderatly sized ones are very cheep really) and wack a fresh install there, copy all the stuff you need afterwords, that way if they come up with something that they have remembered weeks later you still have the drive intact and can find it.

 

[Amnesia]

Putting stuff in separate partitions is good, but it rarely works out

why does it not work out for you ?
family photos/videos
music
anything important stays away from the windows partiton

if you get a virus and need to reinstall or your windows plays up and you need to reinstall or even if its feeling sluggish after a couple of years of use.....would you really want to try and remember everything of importance on C: ? where it is and in what folder.

i could quite safely wipe my C: and reinstall windows knowing the only real loss would be anything that i downloaded or created in the last couple of days.