Petition for an official apology to Alan Turing

The Mad Rapper said:
Because an apology is going to help him how exactly? This fits into the same category as posthumous pardons - absolutely pointless.
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I disagree. There may be little practical reason for posthumously pardoning or apologising to someone (there may be some legal implications for surviving family members with the former), but what it signifies is the state's willingness to accept it does make mistakes, and downright terrible ones at that. For this reason I feel that it, as a body, should apologise like the rest of us do when we get things wrong.

Drunkenmaster:

I don't think there is such a relevance for which government or which people were in government at the time. The "government" as a body has been continuous since the civil war, and as such the "government" is responsible for it's own actions. That responsibility, in my opinion, does transcend any particular party or persons being in power.

I disagree with not remembering past atrocities. One of the best ways to prevent them happening again is to very well remember them. To remember the 75 million people killed in the first and second world wars is a very stark reminder of why we should do whatever we can to avoid those kinds of situations again. Not that it's always possible, but humans are empathetic, yet simple creatures.

Asking me to apologise to the American Indians is completely different. This petition is not asking for anyone to apologise, but instead the government. A continuous body that has been around for hundreds of years, that has a huge power to effect change in society. It doesn't eat, sleep or breathe, but it can judge and persecute the people it rules. When it does that unfairly, I think it is right that it apologises, no matter whether it realises it's mistake 5, 10, 50 or 100 years after the fact.

Alan Turing's achievements have been somewhat recognised. He was awarded an OBE in 1945, prior to his outing. No doubt he would not have received this afterwards.

If I were Alan Turing looking down, I would prefer that both aspects of my life be remembered. I would feel honoured to be remembered for my contributions to science and society, but I would not want the tragedy to be forgotten. Obviously I cannot make that decision on Turing's behalf, and that is just my opinion.

However, I'm happy for you to believe that a better approach is to not apologise, but to remember the positive aspects of the man's life (and I do not mean that condescendingly).

I am glad of the attention and feeling that this issue is generating.
 
Thing is, an apology from the current government is just words. EVERYONE is sorry for what happened - which was atrocious. It's like apologising for the slave trade. Sins of the fathers. Better to commemorate than apologise.

EDIT - But I'll sign.

EDIT - No, I'm not doing.
 
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I think some people are missing the point of the apology. It isn't supposed to be a personal gesture for an individual mistake, but merely a public acknowledgement that an unacceptable decision was made in times past.

Perhaps the word apology should be replace by some other phrase.
 
drunkenmaster said:
Not only does it not achieve anything, you're asking the current government installed to apologise for something done over 50 years ago, as in, it wasn't actually them. So they could officially apologise, yet not remotely mean it, how could they, they themselves(who would make the apology) would have done nothing wrong.

If theres anything the world could do with, its not remember past attrocities and forcing everyone to associate them with the current regime. Israel and Palestine won't stop fighting over something that started when most of the current soldiers weren't close to being born, but they won't forget, they blame the current governments for something other people did decades ago. We need to start acting and treating people as individuals capable of new idea's and thoughts, rather than acting like they are the same people who can't change at all.

The guy helped us, his treatment was rotten, absolutely horrible, and its sad he took his own life at that point. But no one in government now had a single thing to do with it. Should I start a petition asking the OP to apologise for the attrocities commited on american indians over the past several hundred years, no? Because he had nothing to do with it, exactly.


If people weren't to busy acting without thinking, a far more appropriate petition would be to have the current government recognise the mans achievements and help and not apologise but posthumously award him a medal, or a OBE or whatever, so his name can be recognised and remembered for what he achieved in life.

Not that he can want to be remembered now, but think ahead in your future, would you prefer people remember you for your achievements helping win a war, or that you were chemically castrated for being gay, I'd take the former, as he most likely would have.

Considering the current government can genuinely appreciate his help in the war and a medal would be fitting and sincere, an apology from people that had nothing to do with his mistreatment would mean nothing, be insincere and its all people would remember him for.
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dmpoole said:
Great post Drunkenmaster

We should not apologise for things that 'we' did in the past before we were born or while we were children.
I have total respect for the guy and must have watched the film about him 5 times.
I also respect that he was gay in a world where he knew he'd be mistreated, so it goes to show that being gay is not a lifestyle choice.
Give the guy a medal but don't go apologising or else we will have to apologise for every misdoing our forefathers did.
Move on.
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This.

Also, (I don't agree with his mistreatment before I say this) it was a law, he broke it. He knew it was a law. I'm not saying whether the law was right or wrong, but it was law.... are we going to start apologizing to all people who have been prosecuted under laws that have now been abolished?
 
I signed this, but my reasoning for such is that, by apologising publicly it may spread awareness of this great man and what he did. I feel he has been to easily forgotten by some and that is sad. The apology itself however is pretty meaningless imo.
 
Am afraid I agree with Drunken - I feel bad for the guy, but you can't issue a "sorry" (in my opinion) for something you did not do, it is meaningless. Give the guy more recognition for his actions, I think that is far better for a tribute.
 
I have showed My Respect for the Dude by signing the petition & I am ignoring the usual downers.
Cheers for bringing my attention to it, PMK.
 
malc30 said:
I am ignoring the usual downers.
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How can people be "downers" for preferring a positive tribute rather than attatching his name to something so negative? :p

I have respect for the guy and what happened to him was excusable but at the same time, society moved on from that stance a long time ago - a recognition in itself that what happened was wrong.

EDIT: Personally, I have no problem with others wanting an apology, just voicing an opinion.
 
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Westyfield2 said:
it was a law, he broke it. He knew it was a law. I'm not saying whether the law was right or wrong, but it was law.... are we going to start apologizing to all people who have been prosecuted under laws that have now been abolished?
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I am in vehement opposition to that set of thoughts.

The law should exist for the benefit of society, not to the detriment of it. The laws governing the concept of homosexuality and in particular, the "treatment" for the "mental disorder" that it was, were barbaric, even for those times. Now we can see the error of those ways, acceptance of those mistakes and the tragedies those laws brought about is important. I do not feel it is simply OK to say "well, it was a law and he broke it". The fact remains that the law was immoral and people lost their lives because of it. It's not as if, in this case, there was even any potential for good to come of it. It was a completely destructive and evil law that punished the innocent for simply existing as they were made. It was oppressive and draconian in every sense of the word.

LostPhil said:
EDIT: Personally, I have no problem with others wanting an apology, just voicing an opinion.
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And nor do I. Though, please people, keep this thread to hugs, kisses, handshakes or tolerance for others' opinions only! :p
 
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LostPhil said:
No high-fives? That's a disappointment :D
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Hmm, I'll allow it under "handshakes"... just a kind of.. funny one :p

On another note, the number of petition signers has increased by around 2,000 (12%) since this morning!

I think we can all say it's the efforts of OcUK that have made the biggest impact ;)
 
PMKeates said:
The laws governing the concept of homosexuality and in particular, the "treatment" for the "mental disorder" that it was, were barbaric, even for those times.
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Hence why I put "I don't agree with his mistreatment before I say this" in! :)

I have huge respect for the guy, been round Bletchley Park and seen where he did the life saving work.

Just voicing the opinion that perhaps the Prime Minister should concentrate on more pressing matters than apologizing for the law/actions of a group of democratically elected politicians that he had nothing to do with.
 
vonhelmet said:
Nope, married with 2 kids. Are you gay?
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