Tories spell out benefit cut plan

Dugganator

Dugganator

Dugganator

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Sorry if this is a repost i'm to lazy to seach :D

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8289798.stm

So what do you all think about what the tories are planning.

Personally I think it would be a good idea but wont have the impact that the tories hope. This of course is a step in the right direction but could just could be a stunt to get more votes and not happen once their in power.
 
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It is something that needs considering, but I feel there are better ways to reform state support and make it much fairer than kicking a load of people off it.

The real key will be how the assessments are done, what the work expectations are, and indeed whether there are actually jobs available (this part is very important). Until more details are available of exactly how this is going to be done, and how they are going to make it work so to speak, I'm withholding judgement.
 
It looks, to me, simply like a policy engineered for headlines. Admittedly most are but this doesn't make me think anything will get done. The reasons for that are largely as stated by Dolph, it seems to me that it will be pretty hard to work in the long run.

Something needs to be done, especially about the increasing culture of families where no one works, quite what that something is I'm not sure. Lets hope its at the very least a step in the right direction.
 
simulatorman said:
All 2.6 million people on incapacity benefit? ;)
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Why not, stick them in comms. or something office based.

Hell they might even be good for bomb disposal/IED detection.

meghatronic said:
Er... no!
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Why not? The ones who are able to work after assesment should be given the option to find employment with-in a set time period, and if not, off to boot camp.
 
anticonscience said:
Why not? The ones who are able to work after assesment should be given the option to find employment with-in a set time period, and if not, off to boot camp.
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I can't believe you can't see the flaw in this plan mate!

Giving bums that can't be bothered working a rifle and expecting them to follow orders and have a sense of duty?

A MUCH better option, which I discussed with my mother this morning, would be for the council to draw up a list of jobs that they would like doing, and have an army of workers that are paid minimum wage and they receive no benefits. Like a chain gang picking litter, without the chain. That was it isn't punishment, but it isn't luxury. If it encourages them to get a better job, great! If they're happy or cba, great! We get cheap labour.
 
lets say for example that one in three people on incapacity, are deemed able to work, and put onto the jobless list, that's an extra million people, taking the british total to almost 4 million, and instantly making the conservatives increase the jobless total by 25% that will make the headlines for them for sure.

as said before, the biggest issue is to make sure that the jobs are there in the firstplace, not only that, but also to ensure that the jobs are in the right place. "I for one an going to create a million jobs, but I am going to do it, in the home counties.." does that mean that a million people have to move to the home counties? or that most of my jobs would go unfilled?
 
meghatronic said:
I can't believe you can't see the flaw in this plan mate!

Giving bums that can't be bothered working a rifle and expecting them to follow orders and have a sense of duty?
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Whilst I agree they can't go straight to the front lines, they could go off to some sort of army camp like National Service bck in the day.
 
meghatronic said:
A MUCH better option, which I discussed with my mother this morning, would be for the council to draw up a list of jobs that they would like doing, and have an army of workers that are paid minimum wage and they receive no benefits. Like a chain gang picking litter, without the chain. That was it isn't punishment, but it isn't luxury. If it encourages them to get a better job, great! If they're happy or cba, great! We get cheap labour.
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This + the ability to whip them with a mechanical device that applies equal pressure to each lash so there is no unfairness, because to be honest some chavs will take the money and mess about and not do the job properly.
 
I think the main problem is all the people that say I have a bad back or stress. From what I hear and I'm not sure on this but stress and back pain are two things that cant be proven rightly or wrongly so they take the persons word. Now if this is the case and we have loads of free loads saying this then how will the tories change assessed.
 
I've said for ages that paying people benefits while there is litter picking to be done is crazy, if people have to work maybe 4 hours a day picking up litter to get benefits it may actually encourage them to get a job.

Another thing is if your on benefits you have to report to the job centre everyday at 9am and randomly you have to sit there all day doing some basic tests/learning/menial office tasks. You could then give them 20 days holiday a year that they could book off, all other times they would have to get their backsides out of bed and not be able to plan days out wasting time :)
 
Sukh said:
This + the ability to whip them with a mechanical device that applies equal pressure to each lash so there is no unfairness, because to be honest some chavs will take the money and mess about and not do the job properly.
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Then they dont get paid.

The gov needs to do something about the current situation, I am all for the bootcamp.

If they do make it past basic training we have some cannon fodder, send them to the front line.

Yes, I really dont like chavs and leeching dole types who dont want to work.
 
The couple of idea's of things to be done with these people, all include still paying them with tax, so frankly, bad idea's.

Labour has already saddled us with millions of completely unnecessary jobs in a bid to "hide" unemployment and keep the country going.

The single thing I haven't seen mentioned by any party, shockingly and rather disgustingly, is no plans at all to encourage business, manufacturing and jobs back into the uk.

I'll bring it up again, America knew they were losing jobs, so they offered AMD tax breaks to make the 6 billion plant a viable profitable idea in the states. They could have made more cash and probably built a lot cheaper building in, Israel, the middle east anywhere, asia. New York State offered massive tax breaks to offset the increased taxes and loss of profits. as a result in 2 years they'll have an extra 20k or so jobs, they'll have a plant with a turnover of hundreds of millions a year of which quite a bit is taxed, just not all, for the next 2 years, there are thousands of construction workers with jobs building it, the sewage works AMD are paying for.

The houses for the new workers to live in, the cars the new workers will buy, the shops, cinema's, pubs, clubs, roads, supermarkets, bookstores, coffee shops all the new workers will use daily. They've basically allowed a decent sized town to be built with all the jobs that entails, of which everyone in it will pay tax and bring cash into the USA.

Our government should be killing themselves working hard to encourage companies to continue manufacturing here and encourage other companies to bring new business here, raising the tax to a higher bracket, so the best companies won't dare do business here as they can't get the best people in, is retarded.

This country needs a single thing to get better long term, REAL jobs that AREN'T PAID FOR BY DAMN TAXES.
 
Doesn't this already happen? Didn't I see a documentary about some poor kid from Oldham with a broken back who was deemed fit to work and then a job agency spent ages telling him which jobs weren't suitable for him?
 
The system is just too easy to cheat. People grow up to think that benefits are the norm and abuse the system because they are too lazy to work. The issue is building respect and belief in the system and our country.

I personally think that people that work should have benefits over people that don’t work. My suggestion for this would be different queues at the Nhs for minor operations. I'm not saying that if someone that is out of work got run over that they shouldn’t get treatment straight away. But people that are waiting months to have operations that pay into the system should have priority over others that don’t.

And all benefits should be given in the form of food, travel, bill vouchers. And the reason I'm saying this is because I’m fed up with seeing people get there benefits at the job centre cash there money and then walk straight into the pub. This happens down the road from me each Tuesday and Thursday like clock work and is really shocking.

My example may be a bad one but that’s because I’m bitter about my personally experience with the nhs and the free loading chav’s that love nothing but a punch up on a Friday and Saturday night. Wasting time and money and taking space up that could be used to see sick people or hurt people instead of people that don’t want to work and can’t control themselves.

The main point I’m trying to get at really is that most people that work have pride that they work and don’t take benefits. A good way for the government to reform the system is to provide a way of instilling pride and some sort of benefits for work that would don’t get if your getting benefits. This may sound harsh to the people that are really unlucky and lost there jobs but lets face it in most cases those people will be back to work quickly anyway.
 
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drunkenmaster said:
The couple of idea's of things to be done with these people, all include still paying them with tax, so frankly, bad idea's.

Labour has already saddled us with millions of completely unnecessary jobs in a bid to "hide" unemployment and keep the country going.

The single thing I haven't seen mentioned by any party, shockingly and rather disgustingly, is no plans at all to encourage business, manufacturing and jobs back into the uk.

I'll bring it up again, America knew they were losing jobs, so they offered AMD tax breaks to make the 6 billion plant a viable profitable idea in the states. They could have made more cash and probably built a lot cheaper building in, Israel, the middle east anywhere, asia. New York State offered massive tax breaks to offset the increased taxes and loss of profits. as a result in 2 years they'll have an extra 20k or so jobs, they'll have a plant with a turnover of hundreds of millions a year of which quite a bit is taxed, just not all, for the next 2 years, there are thousands of construction workers with jobs building it, the sewage works AMD are paying for.

The houses for the new workers to live in, the cars the new workers will buy, the shops, cinema's, pubs, clubs, roads, supermarkets, bookstores, coffee shops all the new workers will use daily. They've basically allowed a decent sized town to be built with all the jobs that entails, of which everyone in it will pay tax and bring cash into the USA.

Our government should be killing themselves working hard to encourage companies to continue manufacturing here and encourage other companies to bring new business here, raising the tax to a higher bracket, so the best companies won't dare do business here as they can't get the best people in, is retarded.

This country needs a single thing to get better long term, REAL jobs that AREN'T PAID FOR BY DAMN TAXES.
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We are already significant in the high value manufacturing market, it's the low value stuff that we can't compete on.

I agree with what you are saying to a point, but it's the red tape, rules and pointless restrictions that need to go before the tax breaks and subsidies start. That and ensuring that union power is again curtailed, as the bolshy attitude is really starting to come back and make Britain an unpleasant place to employ people in some industries.
 
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