'Classic' games you just can't get into

Deus Ex is the best game ever and I won't hear anyone trying to convince me otherwise.

I too cannot BELIEVE the amount of people on here saying Deus Ex! I can only assume that most have missed out on it when it was initially released and I can forgive them for that because the AI and graphics have really not stood the test of time. The story/characters are fabulous though. For people who have had it since release and couldn't play it - shame on you.

Personally speaking, I could never get into WoW, I've tried on several occasions and I get to about level 25-30 where the levelling speed starts to slow and the grind becomes more obvious and I just lose interest.
 
I could say the same thing about Oblivion, but i'm not screaming about it. (althrough the gfx continues to be amazing and updated all the time with new mods)
 
Starcraft. I'm not a big fan of RTS games. There's too much going on on screen at once. Stresses me out.
 
L4D versus mode..cannot get into this after spending an eternity on BF2...i dont see the point in VS mode on L4D
 
I just cannot stand left for dead. Tried so much to like it, but just can't. The gameplay is just so, so simple. There is no depth to anything. I get that it's the point, it's meant to be silly and arcadey. But that just isn't my thing. I want powerful feeling wepons, down the sights aiming and more realistic accuracy.

Deus ex, as has been said. But now after people saying it's about the story I think I missed the point. So I'am gonna try that again.

Oblivion. I started of thinking it was great. Well I say great. The combat was aweful, leveling was pointless, and the wepon upgrades were useless. But there was indeed somthing intriguing about it. But after about 10 hours all of it's faults just seemed all the more prominant. And I just could not help but hating it. Fallout 3 I managed 3-ish hours. Just more of the same. Almost the exact same. So probable makes sense I didn't like that either.
 
Diablo 2 bored me half to death, and I tried to enjoy it several times.

Final Fantasy VII was worse than Diablo 2.

Warcraft 3, pffft.
 
I just cannot stand left for dead. Tried so much to like it, but just can't. The gameplay is just so, so simple. There is no depth to anything. I get that it's the point, it's meant to be silly and arcadey. But that just isn't my thing. I want powerful feeling wepons, down the sights aiming and more realistic accuracy.

Deus ex, as has been said. But now after people saying it's about the story I think I missed the point. So I'am gonna try that again.

Oblivion. I started of thinking it was great. Well I say great. The combat was aweful, leveling was pointless, and the wepon upgrades were useless. But there was indeed somthing intriguing about it. But after about 10 hours all of it's faults just seemed all the more prominant. And I just could not help but hating it. Fallout 3 I managed 3-ish hours. Just more of the same. Almost the exact same. So probable makes sense I didn't like that either.

L4D is all about teamplay. I've played hundreds of hours of it. Versus mode is shocking when you don't have mates to play with and single player is horrendously boring. I think the worst thing about the game was that it's far too easy, even on Expert.

I couldn't (and still can't) get into Oblivion. I tried Fallout 3 and found the exact same problem for the first 3-4 hours mate. A lot of people did. After that point though, things start to open up for you and it's just such an awesome game. My saved game ended at about 99 hours. 96 of them were brilliant. Lol.
 
Another vote for Deus Ex, to be honest I'm suprised by the amount of people who though the same. Judging by the amount of love it gets on here, I thought I was a bit of a freak:p

It just never grabbed me, right from the start.
 
Another reason many people didn't get into Deus Ex was they didn't know that they could play it how they wanted to.

Kieron Gillen's review gives a glimpse of what is possible:

Deus Ex

From issue 87 of PC Gamer, this is the review which people tend to get misty-eyed over. At the time, I was relatively bitter about it, since it was chopped to pieces under the hands of a freelance production assistant who’d never worked on Gamer before, but I’ve loosened up.

John Romero was right. Full stop. Ion Storm, formed as a reaction to the - c’mon everyone, let’s be honest here for a few seconds - programmer lead Id, crystallised around a single molecule of thought: Design is law. Games are more about the artist than the artisan, the painting than the paintbrush, the taste of a meal rather than its look. Game design people. That’s where it’s at. The rest is just ephemera to distract us. At the only level that counts, the ancient ASCII based nethack is superior to the slickly vacuous Vampire. Repeat after me: Design. Is. Law.

Yes, Daikatana stank, stinks and will smell of decomposed half-ideas forever. But, as you all better realise by now, the best first person game ever was based on this principle. Except that’s no longer true. Now the top two first person games ever were created using an engine licensed from an external source. With Half-life, it was Id’s Quake. With Deus Ex, the basis is Epic’s Unreal technology.

The advantages of this method is pretty evident. Even with a lesser team - Early Raven creating Hexen 2, for example - games move from conception to completion with greater speed. When the whole of a full development cycle can be devoted to the central game mechanics, the extra time to savour, consider and let a game breathe, a team can hone the edge of their blade infinitesimally. You want a random prediction? In ten years time the amount of 3D graphics engine creation in a team will be next to nothing. With Deus Ex as an example of the strengths of this progress, it’d be a hard man who’ll grumble.

So. Why is Deus Ex so important?

Let’s examine its intellectual family tree. It goes a little something. Ultima Underworld begat System Shock which begat Thief and Shock 2. Then Shock 2 met Half-life in a bar, shared a few drinks and begat Deus Ex. Then let Thief and Floor 13 (ancient black-and-white you-are-a-Government-Black-Agency game) be God-parents. Then the child grew up and put pictures of Syndicate on its wall, fancied Diablo at School and hung-out with Exile. And read Voltaire, Guy Debord, The Illuminatus, Grant Morrison, Machievelli and pretty much the whole content of a decently covered bookshelf. And wore a trenchcoat and shades.

Or, in more prosaic terms, it’s the apotheosis of the whole action-RPG thing that gets us critical types all excited. Actually that wasn’t prosaic at all. Let’s start again.

Deus Ex is a first-person action RPG. You play J.C. Denton, an special agent for UNATCO, an extended branch of the police force. The world is a day-after-tomorrow affair with the current trends (Globalisation, Corporate power increasing, Democratic power falling, Terrorist direct action on the rise, Fade to Socialist Worker opinion columns) extrapolated to extremes. A modern plague, named the Grey Death, haunts the streets, with the vaccine - Ambrosia - in fatally sort supply, with its access limited to those with power, wealth or both. The locations in the game are either based on real-world areas, or thematically authentic enough to make everything hit close on the emotional level.

And in these levels you go on missions. In these missions you… No. I’m lost again.

Right. Perhaps, before I descend into the inevitable verbiage-onslaught (Expect quotes from Voltaire and references to existentialism. Ladies, take a seat. Gentlemen, pour yourself a stiffening brandy), if I better take your hand and lead you through what’s a pretty standard hypothetical mission we can side-step the vagaries of language.

You find yourself standing on a rooftop, overlooking a tower. You have to blow up a generator inside. Guards patrol outside, dogs yapping with their probably rabid mouths. You shrug, reloading the assault rifle. Noticing a ladder on the side of the building, you climb up to the roof. You hear the barking of the mutts, realising your cover has been blown. At this point you give up all pretence at subtlety, charging down a ramp into the building proper. Alarms go off as troopers start to locate you. Ducking between crates, you return fire. Realising you’re outnumbered, you pull out a LAM grenade, attaching it to a wall, before retreating. As the pursuing pack approach the motion sensors activate the grenade. Taking advantage of the confusion you charge, bullets firing. Downstairs you locate the generator, lobbing another couple of LAMs through the door to turn reduce hi-tech to a wreck. A sprint to the roof, leaping into your escape helicopter, and out. Chaos. Death. You’re an ultra-bad-ass mother****er raining annihilation on the second summer of love.

Rewind.

You find yourself standing on a rooftop, overlooking a tower. You have to blow up a generator inside. Guards patrol outside, dogs yapping with their probably rabid mouths. You shrug. You’ve broke into worse places. Waiting until the patrol routes move away, you crawl silently to the ladder, ascending to the roof. Looking through the skylight you notice two guards chatting, spouting conspiracy theories about the government. You listen for a while, then lob a gas grenade down, reducing them to choking heaps, wiping their eyes. You leap down, applying knock-out blows to the back of their heads. All’s silent. You head down, noticing a couple more guards walking long patrol routes. When one turns his back an electric prod to the back of the neck brings him crashing to the floor. His yelp attracts the attention of his partner, who turns the corner only to get a face full of pepper spray. A truncheon blow and he collapses. From then on it was easy. Down a floor, crawling into the computer room. By hacking the computer system you’re able to program an auto-destruct of your target. You retreat back to the roof and escape. No-one will know you were ever there. Death count? Zero. No more tears on the face of the mother of the world thanks to you.

Rewind.

You find yourself standing on a rooftop, overlooking a tower. You have to blow up a generator inside. Guards patrol outside, dogs yapping with their probably rabid mouths. You shrug, shoulder your sniper’s rifle and put a 30:06 round through each of their heads. You hate patrolmen and - hey - you aren’t too fond of dogs either.

Rewind.

You find yourself standing on a rooftop, overlooking a tower. You have to blow up a generator inside. But by doing a few favours to your street-friends and throwing around a little cash, you’ve managed to gain every single security code, key and password for the facility. The second you find a security console, those gun-turrets on the first floor are going to be turned against their makers.

Rewind.

You find yourself standing on a rooftop, overlooking a tower. You have to blow up a generator inside. For you, that’s not enough. You shoulder you LAW missile launcher and fire a blast at the main doors, demolishing them. And setting off the fuel-drums you had dragged there earlier, wiping out anyone who had the misfortune to be on the ground floor.

Rewind.

You find yourself standing on a rooftop overlooking a tower. You have to… oh bugger this. You head back to the alleyways and entertain yourself by throwing that basketball you found at the cats. Perhaps you’ll go play pool in a bar later and have a few drinks. The mission can wait. Governmental Agents just wanna have fun.

Definitely rewind.

By now, people will be describing Deus Ex as a hybrid of several genres. A mistake in logic. Deus Ex doesn’t merge the play-mechanics of singular genres. It just includes them as options. The primary character of a hybrid game is the demands you to perform tasks that were previously separate, while Deus Ex is about personal inclination and - this is the important one - freedom. The traditional relationship between gamer and game is one where the latter dictates to the former what it will do to have fun, a dictatorial axis that, more than anything in the history of our artform, Deus Ex destroys. Look everyone! Genuine Interactive Entertainment.

This also implies that lots of games which we though impossible to complete actually are feasible. For example, since Deus Ex has shown that one level can be played in diametrically opposed ways with equivalent enjoyment, things like - say - Superhero games where you can play radically different characters become possible. Previously, received wisdom would have stated that no level would be equally satisfying to a steroid-powered Hulk-clone or a shadow-clad Batman analogue, hence meaning such a game could never exist. Deus Ex annihilates that defeatist thought in a burst of near-future cool. Put simply, it has raised the stakes and all that remains to be seen is if the industry is willing to follow.

(After all, after two years a fraction of the ideas which ran wild through the heart of Half-life have still yet to be assimilated into its peers. Most FPSs are still pretending its maintained genius never happened, hoping everyone will forget how sublime the genre can be.)

Despite all the ultraviolence (or lack of it, depending on your inclination) at its centre, Deus Ex is a role-playing game, featuring a strong level of character development in various areas. Firstly, you have the skill system. There are eleven of them, varying from the expected weapons (Pistol, Rifle, Heavy Weapons, Melee and so on), survival (Swimming) and intrusion (Lockpicking, Computer Hacking), with you only having a bare minimum points to spend on advancing them. While each only has four levels, the price rises almost exponentially, with the highest master abilities being incredibly illusive- but oh-so-desirable.

This extreme price means that, unlike the superficially similar System Shock 2, by the end of the game your character won’t be extremely competent in all of the abilities. You’re forced into hard decisions in which you’ll spend your hard-earned experience points into enhancing. To reach master in one - let alone multiple - categories will mean sorely neglecting others, leading to a truly unique character. And thus a truly unique experience.

However, dissimilarly to Shock2, being unskilled in an area doesn’t usually bar you from having a layperson’s crack - you’ll just be less impressive. Untrained swimmers doggy-paddle slower than the Duncan Goodhew’s in our midst, as well as having a lower lung-capacity. This differential is most clearly seen in the use of weapons, using a targeting reticule method similar to Rogue Spear. The longer you stay still, preparing your shot, the tighter the cross-hairs get, thus the more specific a shot results. Unskilled? They start with a massive expanse between, then narrow slowly. You’re a master? Almost instant unnerving accuracy.

The implications of this is devastatingly important. While there are some narrowing of your options depending on choices - without any hacking training you’ll be unable to break into security systems without their codes - generally you can still try. This contrasts neatly with Planescape Torment, a game which featured a similar amount of freedom of approach. In the more traditional RPG, the thrill was seeing your choices being limited by how you’ve wandered its moral maze. Deus Ex takes a radically existentialist approach, claiming that nothing is written in stone. You can always try something else, re-making your own game-image as many times you choose. In the intricate sprawl of the level, there’s always some other approach to try. Never has being condemned to being free been so heavenly.

The primary exception the approach is the second way you can personalise your character. You’re a nano-tech augmented being, capable of being upgraded when you find a suitable canister. When this is installed, with the help of a handy medical bot, you have the choice of one of two special abilities. Do you want to hypercharge your muscle neurones for hand to hand bonus or strengthen myocin fibrils for lifting strength? A spy-drone or an ECM based missile-detonator? Speed boost or silent running? And, like skills, once they’ve been plugged in you can upgrade them to four power levels with increasing power.

But leaving aside the specialisation inherent in choosing what to carry in your limited inventory space and the much-appreciated option to choose the racial group of your character (originally a sex choice was planned, but re-recording the immense amount of vocal information proved impractical. Forgive them), the most interesting way: your moral choices.

With the exception of Planescape Torment, I’ve never seen a game which judges and rates your moral performance then integrates it into the story - yet not preaching. This isn’t the superior Daily-Mail-readership judgements that the Ultima series occasionally enforced. This is simply giving your choices an effect. From major actions – such as whether you choose to follow your orders or your conscience – to minor ones – such as whether to investigate the ladies toilets in your base, the results are clearly laid out.

Oh yes: the story. Its narrative is as deep as you choose. For adventure fans, this is probably the only game since undersung semi-classic The Longest Journey to sate your conversational desires. Equally, the world drips in details. Books to read, e-mail logs to study, newspapers and data terminals to peek at. Of course, the important ones are noted in your log book – as are all the conversatios, leaving only those who enjoy to sink up information to read them. You can savour Deus Ex. Like a fine wine, it can be drank by anyone - but those who take their time and let it breathe will notice the depth of flavour.

And it’s true cutting-edge interactive storytelling. While the broad sweeps of the tale are pre-determined, the minutiae are determined by the player, leaving a distinct and beautiful lasting memory. Deus Ex joins Half-life and System Shock 2 as the leading practioners of this alchemy. We’re reaching an age when the traditional storytelling devices in games (Pure cut Scenes, ala Vampire) are beginning to look as shoddy as a flick-book in an age of widescreen plasma-screens TVs. Several years ago it was stated that, by definition, gameplay and story were opposing forces. Bits of a game that are story are noninteractive, hence decorative. The bits where you actually do something are game, with only a causal link to the flow of the narrative, with no genuine interaction. That’s just not true anymore.

But just how good is it? To take the two polar extremes of influence, while it’s not quite as good as Half-life as a shooter or Thief as a sneaker, the – and here comes that word again – freedom to try both makes it the former’s only peer. After two years we’ve finally got a genuine battle for the number one PC game of all time spot.

And hopefully it should sell millions. To the bloke in the street, they’ll recall the X-files and the Matrix and be satisfied. The pretentious posers will be rewarded with nods towards everything from the Illumianti and French Situationalists. Clearly, Deus Ex has influences outside the normal world of games; it reaches higher and drags you with it.

Because games - like most other entertainment - have a terrible habit of making you less than you are normally, simplifying you into a stripped down cartoon. There’s a direct line in the almost-autistic reduction-of-self required to succeed in the first arcade games (Robotron 2084, Defender) to the similarly emotionally grounded Diablo (Get sword, kill baddy, get stronger sword, Repeat, Repeat). Deus Ex is one of the few games that make you more than you’re normally. Because in Deus Ex’s reduced universe you feel as if you have more real freedom than you do in normal existence. Which like, say, Fight Club, reminds you of your own freedom in reality. After a session with Deus Ex you feel more alive. It’s a slap in the face, a reminder how good art can be.

And this is art. It’s beautiful. And I’m going to stop now before I start to cry.
- http://gillen.cream.org/wordpress_html/?page_id=16
 
It is a good review (and I liked Deus Ex) but I don't think people should push the game down the throats of the people on this thread who said they couldn't get into it.
'What? You don't like deus ex? You're WRONG, you have to like it, look, look at it again!!!!'

It's just people's opinions, if they don't like it they don't like it, leave them alone :p
 
It is a good review (and I liked Deus Ex) but I don't think people should push the game down the throats of the people on this thread who said they couldn't get into it.
'What? You don't like deus ex? You're WRONG, you have to like it, look, look at it again!!!!'

It's just people's opinions, if they don't like it they don't like it, leave them alone :p

I dunno man. If people don't like half life 2 I get pretty violent. It's like someone saying my kid is ugly. I can understand if people feel the same way about deus ex.

Gonna give it another go, that review opened my eyes a little.
 
Dunno - Deus Ex is a little different from most of the games that are getting mentioned. It's entirely possible that people just didn't get it when they could have done with a different approach.

Having said that - a lot of people playing games don't do so for narrative or to allow them to be creative. If they wanted narrative they'd read a novel or watch a film. If they wanted to be creative they might take up sculpture or something. It's a game that's so markedly different in emphasis from most other games that it's just not to the taste of some gamers.
 
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I don't think anybody was pushing. I certainly wasn't. It's just hard to fathom that such an absolute gem has had it's point missed lol.

That review was brilliant. On a site note, PCZONE recently did a top 100 games of all time feature, guess what was number one? It wasn't Half-Life, I'll tell you that much =)
 
I dunno man. If people don't like half life 2 I get pretty violent..

Yea see.. about that.. I found HL2 was alright, but there were times i felt like i was having to make an effort just to keep crawling through the tedium. Don't get me wrong, it certainly had an immersive, interesting start and a fantastic ending (not to mention ravenholm). The problem I found was the unnecessary length and boredom suffered in between.

I wasnt immersed there, I was just going through the motions that the game expected of me, holding on to the game's promise of a climax to remember.

But then people do seem to hold HL2 up high as one of the best games ever, so I suppose I'm in the minority..

I'll just go back to deus ex and system shock 2 :p
 
Yea see.. about that.. I found HL2 was alright, but there were times i felt like i was having to make an effort just to keep crawling through the tedium. Don't get me wrong, it certainly had an immersive, interesting start and a fantastic ending (not to mention ravenholm). The problem I found was the unnecessary length and boredom suffered in between.

I wasnt immersed there, I was just going through the motions that the game expected of me, holding on to the game's promise of a climax to remember.

But then people do seem to hold HL2 up high as one of the best games ever, so I suppose I'm in the minority..

I'll just go back to deus ex and system shock 2 :p

Yeah I was only joking :p No idea why I have commented so much on this thread, must be in a funny mood.

It's just so hard for me to imagine not enjoying every minute of it. Just the adrenaline when you are on the highway, and that massive helicopter comes from nowhere and starts attacking you. Ducking behind car's and boxes. Just fantastic. Or even the sewers at the start, with the razor flying things chasing you. Just so many great moments for me.

However it's very linear and very scripted. Which in my opinion is a good thing, however I guess some people just don't get on with that.
 
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