Amature track car project - Advice needed

[The_Dark_Side]

Wimp, my rack is 2.4 turns

In such a short and light car that's an advantage, but in the e30 I don't think it is. I've driven a few with the Z3 rack and they've been too skittish for my liking. Note, no difference in precision, just over-sensitivity.

 

[The_Dark_Side]

^^^
And I STILL think that someone like you should've chosen a 309 as a base vehicle over the 205.
IMHO you of all people would "get it".

 

[SKILL]

From what I've read the E36 M3 rack is 3.2 or 3.4 turns lock to lock, so somewhere inbetween the Z3 and the stock,

But not driven anything other than a stock (and as you say, tired E30), but then the mr2 is just as stock and just as tired (had it 4 years, no history before that, only bits changed in the front suspension is the drop links, fairly sure it could do with a nice refresh after ~150k miles and 22 years )

I would like to try a nicely maintained/modified E30, I still think the mr2 would be nicer feeling, but I would be interested to see what the E30 can actually be like

 

[RoboCod]

Bargain track car... http://www.migweb.co.uk/forums/projects-restorations/375985-prelude-track-car-build.html

Plenty of spare cash for uprated suspension and gubbins

 

[Dr Who]

^^^
And I STILL think that someone like you should've chosen a 309 as a base vehicle over the 205.
IMHO you of all people would "get it".

Oh mate, I get it, 309 is the more stable car, however, you can get the 205 as stable, its just more of a hassle. I am gonna stick with the hooligan stock handling

Biggest problem is finding a 309 sans cornflakes, one guy on the forum has just got one, and its absolutely mint, dread to think how much he paid!

I have got some mint 309gti seats for mine tho best cloth seats in the range

 

[NVP]

I feel embaressed that I had to look up what you guys meant by "turns lock to lock", it was so obivous that it alluded me. Is there an optimum amount which is sort after? Because I'm thinking too little turns would get too twitchy and then too many would cause it to not be sensitive enough... Would it vary from car to car or is it just down to personal preference?

 

[Dr Who]

A lot is preference, but also its down to how tiring a car can be to drive. A fast nicely weighted power assisted rack is less tiring to work hard = more time on track.

You would be amazed how much energy you spend driving a car hard for repeated fast laps.

You can usually get used to increased twitchiness, however, after my 205, my wifes A3 feels like driving a dead bus.

 

[The_Dark_Side]

From what I've read the E36 M3 rack is 3.2 or 3.4 turns lock to lock, so somewhere inbetween the Z3 and the stock

One of the racks is 3.0 turns (E36 M3 evo I think, but I could be wrong)
The e36 or better the e46 racks are weighted better as well as having quicker racks...and fitting either of them isn't too difficult.

I would like to try a nicely maintained/modified E30, I still think the mr2 would be nicer feeling, but I would be interested to see what the E30 can actually be like

Replace all of the rubber and you're halfway there.
Fit dealer bushes, and suspension parts from the usual suspects such as Eibach or Bilstein and they sharpen up in no time.

 

[The_Dark_Side]

Oh mate, I get it, 309 is the more stable car, however, you can get the 205 as stable, its just more of a hassle. I am gonna stick with the hooligan stock handling

I hoped this day would never come, my friend, but I'm going to have to disagree strongly with you on this one.
The 205, due to the very nature of its shorter wheelbase (and track to a lesser degree) is always going to be less forgiving, more twitchy and far more of a balancing act when approaching its limits. Now you could argue that this is exactly what you like about the car ( ) but if it were my money I'd go 309 everytime. Paging Mr. Lopez.....I kinda hope he chimes in on this one as he knows his onions too.

FWIW, I know exactly what you mean about trying to find a clean 309 though. For some reason they suffer from the tin worm far worse than the 205 does.

 

[NVP]

OK, on the top end of my list at the moment is:
(In no particular order )


Porsche 944 S (2.5ltr 190bhp)

eg: Porsche 944 S
And here's a already modded, tidy example of a Turbo I found: Porsche 944 Turbo



Volkswagen Golf Mk II 16v GTi (1.8ltr 139bhp)

eg: VW Golf Mk II 16v GTi
A very tidy example: Restored VW Golf Mk II 16v GTi



Toyota MR2 Mk1 (1.6ltr 127bhp)

eg: Toyota MR2 Mk1



BMW 325i Sport (2.5ltr 171bhp)

A very nice example: BMW 325i Sport


But this is just what's on the top of my list, I'm sure my friend has his favourites and I will speak to him again tonight to see what he has to say...

What do you guys think?

 

[The_Dark_Side]

What do you guys think?

Personally, I think you're looking for cars that are far too clean.
For example, If you're going to track the car then you don't want one with an immaculate interior as you're only going to rip most of it out.
If I were you, I'd decide what car I was looking for and find one with as little rust as possible. A clean shell is more important than anything else, as you'll be replacing/uprating everything on the car anyway.

 

[Lopéz]

I hoped this day would never come, my friend, but I'm going to have to disagree strongly with you on this one.
The 205, due to the very nature of its shorter wheelbase (and track to a lesser degree) is always going to be less forgiving, more twitchy and far more of a balancing act when approaching its limits. Now you could argue that this is exactly what you like about the car ( ) but if it were my money I'd go 309 everytime. Paging Mr. Lopez.....I kinda hope he chimes in on this one as he knows his onions too.

FWIW, I know exactly what you mean about trying to find a clean 309 though. For some reason they suffer from the tin worm far worse than the 205 does.

309 is a sod to find (compared to the 205) but I have to say I'm with T_D_S on this one, it's the more rewarding to drive.
I do find the 205 catchable but the longer wheelbase of the 309 makes it more rewarding on the limit, you have a margin. And margins are just space which to take liberties

 

[ZG002]

Personally, I think you're looking for cars that are far too clean.
For example, If you're going to track the car then you don't want one with an immaculate interior as you're only going to rip most of it out.
If I were you, I'd decide what car I was looking for and find one with as little rust as possible. A clean shell is more important than anything else, as you'll be replacing/uprating everything on the car anyway.

Couldn't of said it better.

Nuvpal. Get your mate in here asap. I'm eagerly awaiting his opinions on the subject

 

[Lopéz]

O
What do you guys think?

I think it's obvious from your posts you either want an E30 325 or a Mk2 Golf GTI. So get one of those.

Don't bother trawling through restored cars and so on, it's for driving not polishing.

This was £350 (the Golf that is, not the Manta) + £180 for the coilovers and £150 for the wheels (neither of which it needed, she just wanted them)

Ideal base IMO

 

[NVP]

Personally, I think you're looking for cars that are far too clean.
For example, If you're going to track the car then you don't want one with an immaculate interior as you're only going to rip most of it out.
If I were you, I'd decide what car I was looking for and find one with as little rust as possible. A clean shell is more important than anything else, as you'll be replacing/uprating everything on the car anyway.

Couldn't of said it better.

Nuvpal. Get your mate in here asap. I'm eagerly awaiting his opinions on the subject

Oh no, those examples weren't to purchase, they were just links to some nice ones I had seen about, we aren't buying until feb/march next year so I've got plenty of time to look for a suitable one. Sorry for the confusion, they were just there to add pictures to the story...

And my mate is on his way, he's reading the thread and said he is going to join in...

 

[ZG002]

Good man. Quite enjoying the thread tbh.

 

[NVP]

Me too, and I'm learning a hell of a lot as well. Out of my list, which do you think would suit a "wanna be" mechanic?

EDIT:

I think it's obvious from your posts you either want an E30 325 or a Mk2 Golf GTI. So get one of those.

Is it that obvious? lol, this thread has shown me good examples and thrown some good ideas my way so I'm still debating, but I am also still leaning towards these two.

 

[ZG002]

Easiest to work on from your list id say the Mk2 golf would be easiest to work on. Got to remember the MR2 is mid engined and trust me the japs over engineer things (I had two celica's with same engine)

The porka id forget about myself.

 

[Lopéz]

Yeah you can tell, you keep coming back to them. Sometimes it's more rewarding to buy something you just want even though you know there are "better" alternatives. That's why I bought the Manta and I haven't regretted it for a minute.

 

[The_Dark_Side]

Golf or e30 are very good choices.
Simple, easy to repair, TOUGH and there's a plentiful supply of both standard and uprated parts for them. PLUS they both have huge fanbases so an incredible amount of vehicle specific advice will be available to you, should you need it.

Oh, and for the love of all things holy don't even consider the Porsche. Some of the potential repair costs on them are mahoosive.