After a new soundcard - but...

RoachycaL

RoachycaL

RoachycaL

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Joined
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Newcastle Upon Tyne
Sup guys,

I'm in the market for a new soundcard for Christmas and I'm currently using a creative Xfi card that came with my asus maximus II - it uses PCI-E.

Problem is that I currently have a setting turned on in the audio console settings called X-Fi Crystaliser, and I don't know how I previously lived without it - as the name suggests it livens up music and makes it a lot clearer (especially OLD music). I listen to a lot of 80's metal which often sounds very flat, this setting really livens my music up.

Question is, I'm after an Asus Xonar card - do they have a similar setting in the driver options? Because even if I'm buying a better quality sound card, it wont sound as good to me without this setting!

Thanks for the help.
 
Hmm, interesting. I think the Crystalizer makes music sound worse when using headphones or connecting a stereo, but it does improve the sound when using cheap 5.1 PC speakers. Says more about cheap PC speakers inability to reproduce music well, than it does about Crystalizer's ability to improve music.

Xonar cards have plenty of EQ stuff, none of which AFAIK does what Creative claim with their Crystalizer. I do like Xonar cards hi-fi setting, meaning you can switch off all the EQ all with one click, and turn it all on again with one click.

I suppose I have to apologise to Creative, they do claim that Crystalizer improves music, which is correct as long as you use their speakers. Doesn't say a lot for the majority of their speakers. :p

As for Xonar's SQ, music sounds much better to me with my Xonar DS, than it does with my X-Fi with that Crystalizer thing on. Sounds better if the Crystalizer is off too, but not a huge amount in it.

If you find the music is improved with the Crystalizer that's fine, everyone has different likes and dislikes. :) If you are feeling adventurous, you could spend £130 on a Xonar ST/STX which will blow any X-Fi, Crystalizer or not clean out of the water. :)
 
Crystalizer is designed to enhance low-bitrate mp3s and the like from what I understand. When I had 5.1 creative speakers it sounded a bit better, but not with FLAC, and now with a proper amp/speaker setup or headphones it sounds a lot worse with it on.

What are you using to listen to stuff with?
 
Hmm odd.

I use a set of Logitech Z2300's which are fantastic (2.1), love them to bits. All music I play is at 320kbps and I generally use the Microsoft Zune software or media player (essentially the same thing).
 
There is no doubt in my mind that I want an Asus Xonar card (haven't decided which one yet) but I still don't know whether the Asus package can offer me some kind of audio crystalliser?
 
I was in the same boat for a new soundcard but im just sick of asus' support. They just gave up on my xonar d2 so I ordered a hifidiy dac/amp. Advantage is thats its usb so can be used on my laptop too!

I loved the xonar sound and may return to one if i aint happy with the dac, but i listen to my music as intended as such, with no crystaliser or dolby headphone on. Maybe im missing out, but i prefer it that way. It also moves the amp away from internal components, where in some cases like mine, with internal cards, you pick up static and crackles.
 
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RoachycaL said:
There is no doubt in my mind that I want an Asus Xonar card (haven't decided which one yet) but I still don't know whether the Asus package can offer me some kind of audio crystalliser?
Click to expand...

Creative's Crystalizer takes an MP3 file, analyses what parts were stripped out when it was converted and re-masters it. At least that's what Creative claim. Xonar cards do not have anything like that.

Why are you looking at a Xonar though, if the card you have is doing what you need it to?
 
Marsman said:
Why are you looking at a Xonar though, if the card you have is doing what you need it to?
Click to expand...

Good question, its mainly because at the moment I'm striving for audio quality and I feel that my current sound card is holding me back despite having the crystallizer feature as after all it did come with my motherboard suggesting that I could be doing a lot better!
 
That's the nail, and Guest2 hit it squarely on the head. :)

One can spend as much as they like on a sound device, but a quality card can not show it's quality if the speakers are not up to the task.
 
Here is an example. My main PC has X-Fi Xtreme Music sound card, but my Creative T6100 speakers are tbh crap for music. I have to turn all the EQ stuff on for it to sound even remotely acceptable. Admittely they are designed for gaming and movies, and this they do well. If I connect my stereo to the X-Fi though, then wow! :D

If I threw a Xonar ST/STX at my T6100 speakers, not literally of course :p, then that would not improve the sound they emit.

I know the Z-2300 are pretty good as far as PC speakers goes, and are far better than the T6100 speaker I use, but compared to a decent stereo or a good amp + good bookshelf speakers, they won't shine so much. You will get better sound by having a better speaker setup than you would by getting a better sound card.
 
Interesting. I would imagine an amp and separate speakers would be expensive though?

I use these speakers because I don't have the option to have any more than 2 speakers at my pc, I used to use my Z5500's on my pc when I lived at home but I never thought they sounded good when they were set to the volume that my room would cope with, and I'm also not in the position to listen to my music loud all the time. I would imagine this would be the case with an amp and bookshelf speakers also?

I also found it quite useless using 5.1 speakers to play music on the pc, as the sound would only ever come out of the two intended speakers - ofcourse there were ways to "simulate" 5.1 in the soundcard settings but what's the point in that?
 
If your listening to old specially scratchy or noisey or low bitrate music then you will either have to:

Get an X-Fi and use the Crystaliser - which does work well for this purpose

Manually processing every file through a wave editing package with the appropriate filters.

Get an external receiver to process the sound.

Xonar has very good sound quality but it doesn't have the ability to do what the Crystaliser does.
 
RoachycaL said:
I also found it quite useless using 5.1 speakers to play music on the pc, as the sound would only ever come out of the two intended speakers - ofcourse there were ways to "simulate" 5.1 in the soundcard settings but what's the point in that?
Click to expand...

The X-Fi can upmix stereo to play on surround sound systems with expanded soundscape, etc. also most decent 5.1 speaker systems/amps have the ability to do similiar.

Simulated 5.1 with stereo speakers or headphones is pretty useful too.
 
RoachycaL said:
Interesting. I would imagine an amp and separate speakers would be expensive though?

I use these speakers because I don't have the option to have any more than 2 speakers at my pc, I used to use my Z5500's on my pc when I lived at home but I never thought they sounded good when they were set to the volume that my room would cope with, and I'm also not in the position to listen to my music loud all the time. I would imagine this would be the case with an amp and bookshelf speakers also?

I also found it quite useless using 5.1 speakers to play music on the pc, as the sound would only ever come out of the two intended speakers - ofcourse there were ways to "simulate" 5.1 in the soundcard settings but what's the point in that?
Click to expand...

It depends. You can buy a decent amp and speakers for the same cost of the Z-2300, or there abouts. Amps though are huge slabs of metal, and are not desk friendly. I was looking at the same option, but amps being so big, put an end to that.

For the most part PC 5.1 speakers do not handle music well, at least in my experience. You would need something far more expensive for music to sound good in 5.1.

Seeing as the Xonar's do not have such a Crystalizer feature, getting one may not be the huge improvement you would be hoping for. Xonar cards seem more to be aimed at playing music with as much hi-fi as you can get using a sound card, meaning no fancy sound enhancement stuff. Creative aim their cards more toward sound enhancement, slapping as much bells and whistles on to the music as possible. Works for some people, not for others.

Have you considered headphones? Good headphones will be a lot cheaper than getting some speakers that can improve on the Z-2300.
 
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RoachycaL said:
Interesting. I would imagine an amp and separate speakers would be expensive though?
Click to expand...

Get yourself onto the hifi sub forum. Have a look at the hifi sticky, some good info in there. It doesnt cost much if you go second hand.

Its all about matching equipment, as already said, theres no point in getting a £250 DAC to go with some £10 trust speakers. Or getting some 10k speakers and playing 128kbps mps with creative crystalliser software rubbish

I had Creative megaworks 5.1, with audigy 2zs card. Sold the Megaworks and got myself a Cambridge A1 and some Mission M71 bookshelf speakers and stands. I sold the Missions and the Cambridge not long ago on ebay for £55.

I now run -
Xonar Essence ST (£130)
B&W 603 (second hand, mint condition £90)
Marantz PM68 amplifier (second hand £55)

My NAD C352 should be arriving late this week (second hand, bought august 09, 3 year warrently £220)

A good sound setup doest have to cost the earth. You will generally pay more and more for smaller improvements. Saying this my next upgrade will probably be some nautilus speakers and whatever amp, i will have a listen to a range before. Though I love the sound of my 603 S1 speakers at the moment and cant wait for the NAD to arrive
 
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