Oooo I like these! Bargain for what they are, happy to hear about the pricing on the servicing, not too much, wonder how much if something went wrong. Has anything failed on the car or do you know of things that may fail and roughly how much you'd expect to pay?
VW Phaeton (This threads for Firestar 3X)
- Thread starter Eddmac
- Start date
Caporegime
- Joined
- 11 Mar 2005
- Posts
- 32,247
- Location
- Leafy Cheshire
Lots or arms, and a few legs too.
Interesting debate chaps keep it up...some valid arguments on both sides I feel but the OP definitely has a point abut the pretention behind many (not all) BMW and Mercedes purchases. You only have to look at a few pages on here to see the 'Should I buy a 2k 316' posts and similar. On the other hand, Fox is right that people buying a luxury 50k plus car will usually have at least an eye to the branding of said item...goes with the territory.
I like the Phaeton personally and I always had a hunch it would potentially become a used 'sleeper purchase' further down the line...interesting stuff.
I like the Phaeton personally and I always had a hunch it would potentially become a used 'sleeper purchase' further down the line...interesting stuff.
was a 'logical' upgrade to the Passat! Maybe not so much! Will have to look into it. 03 Plate W12 on Pistonheads for £12k, although I wouldnt buy a 7 year old model!
Caporegime
- Joined
- 13 May 2003
- Posts
- 34,564
- Location
- Warwickshire
The branding argument is interesting. One can say that someone spending £60k will, 95% of the time, look for a 'prestige brand', but at what point does a (taken literally) 'people's car' transcend into being prestige...at the point that they called themselves Mercedes or Audi? No, at the point that they make a car that challenges, and in some aspects beats, other cars in its class. If Mercedes meant 'people's car', they'd still be a prestige brand.
People that define the prestige of a car simply by its badge, are indeed prepared 'to buy cars based on the badge on the front', as Eddmac danes to suggest.
Martyr complex.
People that define the prestige of a car simply by its badge, are indeed prepared 'to buy cars based on the badge on the front', as Eddmac danes to suggest.
[TW]Fox;15825825 said:
Martyr complex.
[TW]Fox;15825877 said:
Its Audi that call the A8 "Sporty", I was simply quoting them Fox
"It’s the technology that has given Audi the
edge on the racetrack ever since it was first
introduced over 25 years ago – a technology
that delivers ultimate control whilst
enhancing the sporty characteristics which
make the new Audi A8 so thrilling to drive."
"In the new Audi A8, asymmetric dynamic
torque distribution continuously distributes
drive power between the front and rear axles,
depending on weather conditions, road
surface and gradient. This leads to greater
flexibility and an enhanced, sportier drive"
"If you choose Standard seats you
can also take advantage of heated
front and outer rear seats. For more
luxurious options, select either
Comfort seats or Comfort
Sports seats."
Taken from the latest Audi A8 Brochure roflmao
[TW]Fox;15825877 said:
I haven't decided to pretend the A8 6.0 W12 does not exist, another poster quoted that the 4.2V8 he test drove was faster than the 6.0W12 Phaeton he test drove, I was commenting on that?
[TW]Fox;15825877 said:
I mentioned BMW as it is one of "The usual suspects", not for any particular attack on you mate.
[TW]Fox;15825877 said:
Yeah, maybe if i had actually bought a £60,000 car i would be a little disappointed, but then again if i had spent that much on everything you have mentioned i would be "disappointed", fortunately for me i didnt spend £60,000, but in fact £21,000, maybe i didnt mention that?
Tell me, how well do you think a £21k S-class would have compared against my Phaeton in 2004 (when i bought it)? Bear in mind it would be the old model, it would have had around 60k miles on it (my Phaeton had about 10k iirc) and it would have been about 4 years old and out of warranty (my Phaeton was less than a year old and had over 2 years warranty)
[TW]Fox;15825877 said:
The available competition, hmm, you are comparing the Phaeton against £60k cars and I suppose that was the target market for VW.
But not for me.
When I bought the Phaeton, I was looking at cars around the £20k mark, and yes the Mondeo that you have mentioned more than once was on my shortlist, so against the available competition, well I think that a less than one year old Phaeton, versus a brand new Mondeo Titanium is a very simple decision (for me at the time it was anyway)
.[TW]Fox;15825877 said:
Hmm, Fox you should really really learn not to take things said on an internet forum personally, besides, I have never encountered you before, so you can hardly accuse me of victimisation? really now come on?
[TW]Fox;15825877 said:
If anything, Phaetons have dropped even more money on the second hand market, I know that all luxo-barges have dropped to some extent, but I still contend that the Phaeton was and still remains one of THE bargain buys!
But don't worry Fox, everyone IS entitled to their own opinion (yes, even you
) and no one expects you to buy one after reading and commenting on this thread, however, hopefully those that were interested in the Phaeton will have benefitted from my actual ownership experiences, which is what this thread was started for in the first place. (Read the title BTW)
Please correct me if I am wrong, but the photos in this aren't of the same car? Check out the key fob in the ignition.
The MD of my company had one of these 3 years back, W12 engine....pulled like a jet engine when I briefly had a passenger ride to a train station. Really comfy and too many gadgets and buttons, but I can't see many reasons for a W12 comfy VW if I am honest, no matter how good the car is...just seems too niche.
![[TW]Fox](/data/man-of-honor/2009.png){kind=avatar}
Its Audi that call the A8 "Sporty", I was simply quoting them Fox
They might well do but doubtless somewhere Hyundai have claims as to how sporty an i20 is - doesnt make it so. The A8 is about as sporty as me.
I did say that in the past the Phaeton offered fantastic value but this has now changed. Obviously when you purchased it represented excellent value.
Not reffering at all to you, infact I've enjoyed our little discussion
[TW]Fox;15828362 said:I did say that in the past the Phaeton offered fantastic value but this has now changed. Obviously when you purchased it represented excellent value.
Why has it changed ? They have depreciated even less, so surely considering the price of a 2nd hand one is now the same price as a 3 year old mondeo, they offer even better value for money ?
The problem is a lot of "sensible" people will buy an 09 astra 1.4 equivalent and suffer lethargic performance, cramped interiors and dodgy build quality over spending less on an upto 10 year old car with supercar power and all the gadgets and supreme comfort. They simply dont know what they are missing.
A girl i know had a ride in my car and said she found it "supremely comfortable and quiet" and was amazed that i could change from 3rd straight into 5th whilst accelerating on the flat. She owns an 09 Punto. Ive been for a ride in said car and its yucky build quality, rattles, buttons feel like they will fall off when you touch them, not to mention its lack of room. But its better right, because its brand new ?
Soldato
- Joined
- 23 Nov 2004
- Posts
- 10,648
I know I wouldn't want to have an older car that I bought for £10k which was £55k new. If you're buying a 10k car then you can afford to run a £10k car not a £55k car.
Knowing you're paying X amount per month on the car and when a bill popped up it would be cheap to fix would make you feel relatively safe.
If you buy a £55k car the tyres will be at least double the price, it's a heavy car so more chance of suspension wearing quickly which could throw up a big bill, not exactly great MPG and the warranty will be up soon.
Knowing you're paying X amount per month on the car and when a bill popped up it would be cheap to fix would make you feel relatively safe.
If you buy a £55k car the tyres will be at least double the price, it's a heavy car so more chance of suspension wearing quickly which could throw up a big bill, not exactly great MPG and the warranty will be up soon.
I recall the Top Gear review of the Phaeton and it promised so much, but having seen one in the flesh I too felt VW had somehow missed the boat.
Eddmac is clearly pleased with his though and thats all that matters to him, fair enough!
Eddmac is clearly pleased with his though and thats all that matters to him, fair enough!
I always liked the Phaeton, I would actually seriously consider the W12 model myself in it's own right, the only problem is, as Fox said, there are some other options I think are better (or I would rather own) at the same sort of money now, or just a tad more. Such as the Jaguar XJ and the Audi A8 ...I'm not crazy about the W220 S-Class myself (love the old W140 though), there is something about them I'm not that keen on ...however I don't know if I would buy a Phaeton over one, I'd have to have a round of test drives and a good poke around to decide that.
I look forward to you finding your pictures Edd, an unusual car for sure and a very nice one too. I'm quite a fan of full-size luxury cars, there is a lot to be said for wafting
Incidentally, the Flying Spur is no super-soft wafting machine, it's actually surprisingly hard and quite noisy too, more of a sports saloon than an A8 is anyway. It's usually a good noise though, but if you are sitting in the back and your at relatively low speed with just a touch of load on the engine, going up hill for instance, then there is quite an annoying drone from the exhaust at certain revs. The same W12 engine with the twin turbos on in the FS goes like a Supermarine Spitfire though, sounds like one too!
I look forward to you finding your pictures Edd, an unusual car for sure and a very nice one too. I'm quite a fan of full-size luxury cars, there is a lot to be said for wafting
Incidentally, the Flying Spur is no super-soft wafting machine, it's actually surprisingly hard and quite noisy too, more of a sports saloon than an A8 is anyway. It's usually a good noise though, but if you are sitting in the back and your at relatively low speed with just a touch of load on the engine, going up hill for instance, then there is quite an annoying drone from the exhaust at certain revs. The same W12 engine with the twin turbos on in the FS goes like a Supermarine Spitfire though, sounds like one too!
Last edited:
Because the competition has also depreciated heavily as well. You can now buy a facelift W220 Mercedes S Class or an Audi A8 for £10-£15k. You never could before.
Because a standard W12 clearly struggles to pick up speed.
Suspended
- Joined
- 18 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 9,480
You have a point, but the simple fact is that a 10 year old car is worn. Things go wrong and need to be replaced. The ride quality degrades over time. That's why people opt for a newer car. Personally, I wouldn't accept any car if it's more than 3 years old if I was buying now, because I'd want the peace of mind that I am going to (more likely than not) get a lot of miles out of it before it dies. You can't say the same thing about a car that's already been to the moon and back.
Whilst this is true to a point its fair to see even the ride quality of a 10 year old Mercedes is better than a brand new Astra, and a brand new Astras interior is 'worn' from the factory in terms of cheap fit and finish and rattles whereas a 5 year old Audi is far better.
Plus some people look after cars. If you are careful there is no reason why the interior would get damaged or 'worn' during your ownership.