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ATi OWNED Nvidia Beats Em Even Without Fermi

Rroff said:
Its not how big the market share is thats the "issue" its the fact that nVidia have managed market share growth when by all indications they should have gone into decline and ATI have seen their market share (but not profits which have gone up) decline despite all indications that they should have taken a siginificant market share increase.
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Well Nvidia have flooded the market with cheap and cheerful low end parts. It's to be expected that market share would increase in that case. The comparison to the same qtr 12 months ago and year on year growth when viewed against the main competition makes for less enthusiastic reading.

While the numbers do not lie, the article is poor, hardly a surprise from an ex Inq hack.
 
seems a little far out

maybe pumped up, I can't seem to find much stock of Nvidia cards right now
 
The real beauty of this whole affair has been watching NV's weekly fail in rebranding, talking BS etc. Then seeing their fanbois like Rroff atempt to justify it.
The 5000 series was a massive step in the right direction for ati. Heres to hoping a small performance gain in Fermi (for a massive price), then a 3Q 2010 new batch of ati cards that take the cake. :)
 
Gills if you feel the forum is ati biased why bother coming on and posting i doubt you moaned so much when this forum was completely pro nvidia at the time of the 8800 release did you. This is a case of where figures don't tell the whole story and while yes technically nvidia have increased market share it isn't in a way that can be carried on medium to long term. Also clearly increasing market share whilst losing money is also not very good and i would imagine right now given the choice ati would stay as they are.
 
Naff8000 said:
The real beauty of this whole affair has been watching NV's weekly fail in rebranding, talking BS etc. Then seeing their fanbois like Rroff atempt to justify it.
The 5000 series was a massive step in the right direction for ati. Heres to hoping a small performance gain in Fermi (for a massive price), then a 3Q 2010 new batch of ati cards that take the cake. :)
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I haven't tried to justify the rebranding, the whole mess with PhysX, etc. while I don't really care if you think I'm a "fanboi" or not - the fact that you consider I am one IMO is due to the fact you've either not read or ignored half the posts I've made.
 
I have had mostly nvidia cards over the last 12 years and will have again sometime probably .. I have ATI now though, Guys ... grow up and calm down FFS! My children don't behave as bad ;) Bottom line is what does best when you are buying so grow up!

I've got 5970+5870 for less than £700 (just search very hard!) so let fermi beat that for the price :p Oh dear - I is a fanboi!!!!!
 
Any company that makes cards that self fix in a Gas oven has to be good.... ;)

Nope, I'm not an ATI fanboy, but my oven is fan assisted.

I have an 8800GTS, 6800Ultra and X1950Pro.

Biased? Naah, cooking with Gas is great.

This post is about as pointless as the whole Ati-Nvidia debate imo. :p:D
 
Rroff said:
I haven't tried to justify the rebranding, the whole mess with PhysX, etc. while I don't really care if you think I'm a "fanboi" or not - the fact that you consider I am one IMO is due to the fact you've either not read or ignored half the posts I've made.
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So what are you then? You are far from impartial, as you admit yourself you prefer Nvidia.
 
ATI fanboys are the best, despite black and white figures they still live in their own fantasy world.

The numbers are correct. The articles says nothing about the quality of recent ATI products.

the thing is, the 5000 series have little impact on overall discrete GPU sales so far since they have been out of stock and unitl redcently only the high end part.

Sales of 58**/5970 etc don't have an impact on overall sales and have little impact on financial gains. The money is made in the mainstream market share. Accoridng to the official figures, this is where Nvidia have enjoyed increased sales.
 
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layte said:
Well Nvidia have flooded the market with cheap and cheerful low end parts. It's to be expected that market share would increase in that case. The comparison to the same qtr 12 months ago and year on year growth when viewed against the main competition makes for less enthusiastic reading.

While the numbers do not lie, the article is poor, hardly a surprise from an ex Inq hack.
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If you read the article it says Nvidia's market share has declined sharply from 30% to 24% it has nothing to do with cheaper parts, the bigger news is the success of Intel and it's crappy IGP.

You have to remember the Radeon 597,0 5870 and 5850 are top end parts, they are too expensive and to exclusive to have much of an impact on in terms of market share. I'm more interested in reading the Steam hardware surveys which give a better (but not great) picture of which way PC gamers are going and what their buying.
 
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Why are you guys so obsessed with comparing the two companies? It reminds me of console fanboys "Sony posts quarterly loss", "Microsoft admits hardware issues"... Surely most people choose a card that they can afford, with postive reviews, that also gives the best bang for buck? I honestly don't care which segment of the market Nvidia or ATI's market share grew or shrank in last year. What exactly are you trying to prove? I can understand technical comparisons and discussions on benchmarking results but what is one supposed to gather from "5000 series are always out of stock" or "you can't get any 200 series cards"?

I want both companies to produce good cards that I can choose between with my budget.

You're all nuts, honestly...
 
Freddie1980 said:
If you read the article it says Nvidia's market share has declined sharply from 30% to 24% it has nothing to do with cheaper parts, the bigger news is the success of Intel and it's crappy IGP.

You have to remember the Radeon 597,0 5870 and 5850 are top end parts, they are too expensive and to exclusive to have much of an impact on in terms of market share. I'm more interested in reading the Steam hardware surveys which give a better (but not great) picture of which way PC gamers are going and what their buying.
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erm.. yea.. That is kind of the point I was making.
 
Rroff said:
Even if you take the numbers from Dec in isolation... which should by all indications shows ATI's 5 series taking off... infact you see the complete opposite... whether that trend will continue through Q1 who knows.
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They don't indicate that IN THE SLIGHTEST so again stop spouting UTTER crap.

Last year same quarter Nvidia had over 30% market share, they are down over 5% on that, AMD are up, theres no two ways to look at those numbers.

The ONLY thing that can be read by these numbers is, LOW END IS THE VOLUME, when will people learn that and get the hell over it.

Do Dell and co place orders for millions of low end cards, a month before replacement, lower power, cheaper, faster and higher spec parts are launched......... answer, no.

AMD would have had lower than normal sales of their low/mid end parts in the past month as several things happen, AMD slow down production of older parts, and companies await large stocks of new parts.

AMD went from 800k dx11 parts shipped in December, to 2mill in early Jan, those will be mostly low end parts that are just about ready to go in the hundreds of thousands to Dell and co. Those are "shipped" to AIB partners, not Dell and co, once they are launched and ready, those probably well over 1 million parts end up sold almost immediatedly to OEM's in huge numbers at great profit.

Its entirely ridiculous to believe otherwise, to pretend the numbers favour Nvidia, is completely laughable. Especially considering from that data alone there is entirely nothing to suggest Nvidia is surpassing mid or high end sales compared to AMD.

Nor of course is there anything to suggest what Nvidia's "high end" is. If its currently selling off 260gtx on the cheap, the last few, then while Nvidia term it high end, its very much a midrange card now, would it be surprising for Nvidia's midrange to outsell AMD's high end, no, much like 5770/50 sales will absolute spank Fermi high end sales, because high end sales can't compete with midrange sales, never has, never will.

Even then its hard to believe considering the 260-285gtx has been out of production for most of the last quarter. Heck the "high end" sales could simply be paper sales for Fermi, IE EVGA and co all place orders for a million Fermi cores each and count all in one quarter despite the cores themselves being delivered over several quarters and not even starting for 3 months.

Just like AMD's "paper" orders for 5870 would have spiked massively before the release, because thats what happens. AMD gauge interest by asking for orders, someone orders a million 5870's and they supply them over the next 6 months.

The basic stats show without question a HUGE market share drop from Nvidia, thats the only unquestionable FACT here, everything else is twistable from one extreme to another. Anyone on earth who thinks Nvidia have had a great quarter, or a great year, is literally insane.

Sales, and market share don't even mean anything anyway, the most important fact they came up with, is that AMD's revenue and profit went through the roof, why, because they make a profit on every card. Nvidia could have sold a trillion more cards, but if they failed to make a profit on every single one, not one of those sales helps Nvidia in the slightest.

If Nvidia sold a single card for a billion pounds, and AMD sold a billion cards, at cost, Nvidia would have had the single best year ever, and AMD would have had their worst ever year.

Unfortunately, the numbers speak for themselves, Nvidia's lost massive market share to both AMD and Intel, their profit margins are dropping, they've barely shipped a "high end" card in 3 months and they are completely uncompetitive in the high, mid and low end on both price, performance and features right now.

Fermi MIGHT address performance, but not price and not any other segment.
 
The good news is that Intel won't have the luxury of releasing a new IGP with minimal performance gains for a lot time. I am really interested to see how Intel will react in 2011 when AMD releases processors based on a new architecture. Intel will be releasing Sandy Bridge but if the IGP solutions on the new AMD processors are much better then big OEMs and some consumers will jump ship because of it.

Intel must be burning some serious money in designing the IGP that will be hosted in the Sandy Bridge CPU.
 
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