Thermochill PA120.3 vs car heatercore

Since my name was mentioned I thought I would enter the fray ;)

Yes I have two San Ace 38mm fans which I was lucky enough to pick up from Ebay for £7.50 each.

They are indeed hard to source and if your look at the San Ace catalog in China you will find they make about 20 different 120mm 38mm fans with different specs/cfm/air pressure.

I have indeed got them running on a fan controller and for general browsing/word processing they can be set to 3v/4v (or even off! :eek:) and everything stays fine (all speedstep etc gubbins switch on so when browsing my cpu is running at only 3Ghz and lower volts). At 3v/4v they just rotate very slowly and are silent but at least puts a little airflow through the rad.

I can also confirm that at 12v they are indeed loud. lol. However, the performance is amazing. The airflow through my rad out of the top of my case at 12v is good enough to dry your gf's hair with.

Tbh I only use them at 12v for silly benchmarking on hwbot with my cpu at sill 4.9Ghz levels. For gaming I just turn the dials up slightly to perhaps 5 to 7v which although raises the volume levels slightly, you can't hear them over the game.

For Info my fans were the following models:

Sanyo Denki San ACe 109R1212H1011

Fan Size: 120mm x 120mm x 38mm
Speed: 2600 RPM
Airflow: 102.5 CFM
Noise: 39 dBA
Static Pressure: 64.7Pa (~6.6mm H2O)
Bearing: Ball bearing
Voltage: 12 V
Current: .52 Amp
Power: 6.24 W

At 6v they are quieter than my xilence redwings were on 12v put push way more air through my rad.

Temp difference was a 3c drop under IBT at 5v and a 10c drop at 12v compared with the xilence on 12v.

Interesting comparison here which shows how badly some good cfm fans perform through a radiator as they don;t have sufficient static pressure.

http://www.madshrimps.be/?action=get...36&articID=936

Full product list here:

http://db.sanyodenki.co.jp/product_db_e/coolingfan/dcfan/cooling_dcfan.html

The 9G replaced the 109R AFIK. 9G1212H1011 can be bought new in the uk for around £15-£16 each. Specs are very similar but cfm down slightly (99cfm) but static pressure up to 7.2mm.

There are two very similar ones for sale at £7.99 each on Ebay atm.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SANYO-DENKI-1...K_Computing_Networking_SM?hash=item35a68f8352

EDIT: San Ace have high ampage and don't work with all fan controllers so make sure your fan controller has enough juice down the line.
 
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miniyazz said:
In other words, the water moving downwards counterbalances the water moving upwards, so once set up, it only takes a pump sufficiently powerful to move the water through that length of pipe + waterblock on the level.
Click to expand...

I've had a 5 block loops with over 3m of tube on a 3w pump - but it's a pig to get started.
And a nightmare to bleed, but when going works a treat - but that was fairly level.

Adding hight to a loop is not for the faint hearted.
A central heating pump is a must have that kind of loop.

But I know that that is all just talk (apart from jonj and his waterbutt that may actually happen)
PA's RX's Feser rads all are sooooo much better that heatcores if you want normal pc dB's
If delta are your thing then it's dence fins all the way
 
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Curiously enough, the fan model number of that eBay listing is just about the only one not listed on the Sanyo site. A typo, perhaps, by the eBay seller?
I'm tempted by them but there's only two - I'd really be after three - and not being able to find the fan specs puts me off! I was considering plugging them into my PSU 12V rail, although that has the disadvantage of not being able to adjust their speed.

SS, are you saying you need more power to keep a vertical (closed) loop running than a horizontal one of the same length?
 
Yes I would say you need more power to get it started - significatly more.
Once started I guess both would be simular if they were sealed - add an air bubble and all bets are off.
My own testing is with loops that have between a .4m head and a 1.8m head.
Not going back to high head loops - way to much hassel for no actual gain.

One of the reasons I like the D5 so much is that you can set it to 4 or 5 to get things running then knock it down to 2 for a quiet life.
But the 3w pump in my Reserator was a different animal. High head pressure low flow rate.
Perfect for a passive loop that need to be twice/3x as long as an internal loop.

My own view is - the pump suits the loop.

Pick rads and fans based on WHY (as these affect performance and noise)
then pick blocks based on rads (max flow rate or max performance)
then pick pump/connects based on loop. (size/power/control to suit loop)

There are other options on how to spec a loop but to me the WHY is all improtant - as the answer is usally - Air will do it better/for less.
But when air can't do it - watercooling is fantastic.
 
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The 9G model doesn't seem to exist either. I did find what has to be pretty much the same fan (in 109R form) - based on the same size, same voltage and same amperage - decent specs at 6.6mmH20. I don't think any fan controllers I have lying around can handle it though. I think what I may do is leave the fans for the moment, so when I pick up a cheap triple rad (probably avoiding the high fin density ones) and pump I'll set it up with the fans I have lying around and see how it's doing.
If I'm honest I'm going totally over the top, all I'm cooling at the moment is the CPU and chipset (mobo came with a waterblock installed so I may as well use it). I can't imagine they're going to come to over 300W, and according to this graph, that's going to be absolutely no trouble for a triple rad. In fact the only reason I'm planning on an MCP655 and triple rad is in case I add more things at a later date, and so I can be sure I'm not about to shell out on watercooling only to still be temperature limited.
tripleradperformance.jpg
 
JonJ678 said:
Big grins at that loop set up. The sock in particular is brilliance. Hose that kinks is no fun at all. I'm now using 1.5mm wall thickness tygon with steel springs around it, which does solve the problem until such time as you run out of springs.
Click to expand...

I read somewhere that you're using 11/8mm tubing, is that the one? It seems quite small (well, it's the smallest you can buy most places) but would also seem to be the best to use because of reduced kinkage, unless the flow rate decreases too much (IIRC flow resistance increases by a power of 4 when the diameter of the tube halves :eek:).

My NB waterblock (the newer UD7 one), as you know unfortunately has non-removable barbs so I can't use compression fittings on it. The barbs are 10/7.5mm, so the tubing I will have to use is 11/8 - but I can't find any hose clips that are designed for this diameter of tubing. Have you had experience using these sizes, or similar - am I likely to need hose clips or will it be a sufficiently tight fit that I don't need to worry about them?
 
Hey. The tubing I bought was marketed as 11/8, there's an imperial size which is almost identical so it could be either really. It's quite possible that tubing resistance goes up that sharply when diameter goes down, xs found that anything over 8mm ID performed almost identically. There's so much resistance in my loop that it just doesn't matter anymore.

I've never tried it over barbs so can't really comment. Jubilee clamps are available in almost any size so I'm sure they exist for 11mm. Actually I've not used barbs for any length of time, much more comfortable with compression fittings. I'd personally get the mips block that replaces the stock one, but I'm really, really paranoid about leaks. Sorry that I can't be of any more use really
 
In that case I'll probably go with the 11/8mm all round (Imperial size is 5/16" ID, if you're interested), as I was debating whether to use that as little as possible (i.e. to and from the NB only) or whether to use it for the whole thing.
I don't particularly want to spend the money on a new block, I'll probably just stick with air cooling over that for the moment - so I think I'll give it a try with forcing it on with heat, letting it cool, and trying to pull it off and gauge how much force it needs - its not like it'll be under that much pressure once it's set up - and I've just found a suitable jubilee clamp, cheers.

Only problem now is where to find the Swiftech Apogee XT block, it seems to be out of stock from any of my preferred suppliers :(

Cheers
 
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