Why do people feel the need to offer bad advice on upgrades?

[PhoenixUK]

There is also the experience factor which tells you what people need and will be happy with after asking few simple questions.

If someone is upgrading from pentium 3 to something that will do his twice a week video encode faster, doesn't necesarily mean he needs i7 for it if you take into account that he's been fine with the p3 for a while already.

I would never advise a cheaper build to anyone if I didn't know they won't be happy with it.

Many people don't really know what they need so they assume straight away that spending 1-2grand on PC is necessary so they splash 2 grand on i7 and 5970 for 1680x1050 gaming and then run it at stock speed because they don't need all that power.

That's the reason you see 90posts+ selling i7 on MM with at least 2-3every week.
The WOW / Benchmark hype factor went away after few months and now they sell it and get something cheaper because they realise they don't use it.

Get best you can afford isn't a really good advice, well, not for the customer at least.
If they knew what they need exactly they won't be asking. The people that know they need the best they can afford don't come to these forums, they just go to the closest retail shop and splash 4grand on *insert most expensive rig to buy availabe*.

How about we make a poll with the following options:

Are you happy with the purchase of your x2/x3/x4 AMD CPU ?:
1. Yes, it's fast enough for me and is all I need.
2. No, it's ***** slow so I've upgraded to i7 930 after a week.

Because at the end of the day, it's not the benchmarks that are important
but the customer/buy satisfaction of the product they bought.

 

[easyrider]

There is also the experience factor which tells you what people need and will be happy with after asking few simple questions.

Have you experience of i5 or i7?

If someone is upgrading from pentium 3 to something that will do his twice a week video encode faster, doesn't necesarily mean he needs i7 for it if you take into account that he's been fine with the p3 for a while already.

Who is upgrading from a P3? What does this you have typed actually mean in all honesty?

I would never advise a cheaper build to anyone if I didn't know they won't be happy with it.

How do you know they will be happy though?

Many people don't really know what they need so they assume straight away that spending 1-2grand on PC is necessary so they splash 2 grand on i7 and 5970 for 1680x1050 gaming and then run it at stock speed because they don't need all that power.

No they don't and i5/i7 does not cost 2 grand

That's the reason you see 90posts+ selling i7 on MM with at least 2-3every week.
The WOW / Benchmark hype factor went away after few months and now they sell it and get something cheaper because they realise they don't use it.

No its not...this is yet more FUD

Get best you can afford isn't a really good advice, well, not for the customer at least.
If they knew what they need exactly they won't be asking. The people that know they need the best they can afford don't come to these forums, they just go to the closest retail shop and splash 4grand on *insert most expensive rig to buy availabe*.

No they don't...you are making massive generalisations to prove a point

How about we make a poll with the following options:

Are you happy with the purchase of your x2/x3/x4 AMD CPU ?:
1. Yes, it's fast enough for me and is all I need.
2. No, it's ***** slow so I've upgraded to i7 930 after a week.

Because at the end of the day, it's not the benchmarks that are important
but the customer/buy satisfaction of the product they bought.

Its AMD blinkered post's that I see you posting all over these forums that make me wince.

This POLL does not include i3 or i5 just AMD?

Priceless

I suggest you look at the bigger picture in future rather than a blinkered AMD view.With sweeping generalisations of people's needs and wants when it comes to upgrading.

 

[jaybee]

Its beyond me reading some of the advice given to people upgrading for the first time after a time out of the technology game.

New games and windows 7 really need a quad these days...

That's ironic, because they don't. Nice advice.

 

[gurusan]

I chose AMD because the 2nd hand parts were cheap and I bought a chip that was already proven to unlock to a quad.

The fact is that a decent AMD mobo is at least around 100 quid and if you don't want to faff around with unlocking then something like a 955 or 965 is 130-140.

The price is the same as i5 really, and it's obvious which one is faster and has more of a capacity for overclocking.

However, the fact of the matter is that for gaming there isn't a whole lot between the 2 so it doesn't really matter IMO.

 

[easyrider]

That's ironic, because they don't. Nice advice.

Most new games benefit from multicores end of.So stop trying to be smart.

The benchies prove that gains can be had when using quad core in games.

Quads are cheap now so buying one if you have the budget is the smart choice.


Suggesting a 72 quid AMD dual on the "chance" it might unlock to a quad is FUD.

Solway, as a pII 550be owner I'd say stick with the good advice that you have been given and ignore easyriders scaremongering.

A 555BE is a good bet for core unlocking. Even without the extra cores it is still a very quick chip.

Worst case scenario it will only run dual core and you don't find it fast enough .. ebay it and you might lose £15. Then buy yourself a quad. It's hardly the end of the world that easyrider makes it out to be.

The above post is BS I have to read in these forums sometimes.Why not just a buy a ******* Quad in the first place!

Like AMD Athlon II X4 Quad Core 630 2.80GHz for a tenner more

 

[cmndr_andi]

That's ironic, because they don't. Nice advice.

You are indeed correct, most games don't need anything more than a dual core (CPU wise) to run fine. However, I think the point that easyrider is making is that you can't play all games with a dual core system. So if you want a dedicated gaming machine, then it would make sense to get a multi core CPU so you can be certain that all games will work fine.

As for needing a quad for windows 7, well not really. There isn't anything I can't do on windows 7 with a dual core. Obviously some things will be faster with a quad, but things would also be faster with an SSD and a 5970 - but you don't need them.

 

[PhoenixUK]

Who is upgrading from a P3? What does this you have typed actually mean in all honesty?

-You can't even be arsed to read properly anymore and just throw your random "IT DOES NOT INCLUDE THIS XYZ CPU" or "FUD" comments without even understanding the sentence.


How do you know they will be happy though?

- Experience.



No they don't and i5/i7 does not cost 2 grand

- This was just an example, if you again tried to read it you'll understand that what I've meant was that most people want to buy rigs that they absolutately don't need just because they have no idea of current hardware.


No they don't...you are making massive generalisations to prove a point

- If they knew what they're buying, they won't be asking us so you're wrong?


Its AMD blinkered post's that I see you posting all over these forums that make me wince.


- Not at all, I just advise the right rig for the right person.


This POLL does not include i3 or i5 just AMD?

Priceless

- sure, add i3/i5 to the upgrade part, fine.


I suggest you look at the bigger picture in future rather than a blinkered AMD view.With sweeping generalisations of people's needs and wants when it comes to upgrading.


You still don't get the point.

If a 500 quid rig suits my needs just fine, then why spend 1000 or more?

And wait, you were saying that all AMD CPUs are useles and slow and cost the same as intel counterparts. Maybe write a complain letter to ocUK as well for selling AMD parts ? Shouldn't they be selling only and only intel because it's better in every single case?

Aren't you too obsessed with intel maybe? Oh wait ...

 

[PhoenixUK]

Attention!

Everyone that has ever purchased an AMD CPU should get rid of it, sell it and buy an Intel one for the same price !!!!

Also people at ocUK should remove all AMD chips and AMD Pre-built systems from their offer and exchange with intel because this is clearly the best choice.

 

[jaybee]

Most new games benefit from multicores end of.So stop trying to be smart.

The benchies prove that gains can be had when using quad core in games.

Well your original statement was:

New games and windows 7 really need a quad these days

No they don't.

 

[easyrider]

How do you know they will be happy though?

- Experience.

On what?

You never answered my question....Have you direct experience of i3/i5/i7?

 

[easyrider]

Well your original statement was:



No they don't.

To function...no

For the best performance then yes.

So stop clutching at straws...you know exactly what I meant.

 

[easyrider]

Attention!

Everyone that has ever purchased an AMD CPU should get rid of it, sell it and buy an Intel one for the same price !!!!

Also people at ocUK should remove all AMD chips and AMD Pre-built systems from their offer and exchange with intel because this is clearly the best choice.

Pathetic...

 

[jaybee]

To function...no

For the best performance then yes.

So stop clutching at straws...you know exactly what I meant.

Not everyone needs, nor can afford the best tech. People offer opinions on here. If you think the advice is bad, perhaps post in such threads with your opinion too and we can all get along? At the moment you are coming across as a bit "must recommend Intel quad and/or i5/i7 minimum" which is in fact the best example of BAD ADVICE.

 

[easyrider]

Not everyone needs, nor can afford the best tech. People offer opinions on here. If you think the advice is bad, perhaps post in such threads with your opinion too and we can all get along? At the moment you are coming across as a bit "must recommend Intel quad and/or i5/i7 minimum" which is in fact the best example of BAD ADVICE.

When I do ones get replies like this

Solway, as a pII 550be owner I'd say stick with the good advice that you have been given and ignore easyriders scaremongering.

A 555BE is a good bet for core unlocking. Even without the extra cores it is still a very quick chip.

Worst case scenario it will only run dual core and you don't find it fast enough .. ebay it and you might lose £15. Then buy yourself a quad. It's hardly the end of the world that easyrider makes it out to be.

Quads are not the best tech.

They used to be cutting edge.Now you can get one for 10 quid more than a dual core from AMD. Plus 6 cores are very close now.

Why would you buy a AMD Phenom II X2 Dual Core 550 @ £72 when one can buy a AMD Athlon II X4 Quad Core 630 for £11 more when building a budget gaming PC?

Why would anyone suggest going this route...on the chance the 550 might unlock?

I'm not just recommending or suggesting INTEL either.

What I am pointing out is that when people ask for advice on a build at a certain price point.The same old spout off the AMD route when in all honesty it is not the best route to take.

I am not for one minute dismissing AMD or its line of chips...But at certain price points one can get a better PC going INTEL.

And the arguement of not everyone needs the performance is getting tired now.

Whether one needs it or not, the performance is there for future use meaning putting off the need to upgrade.

And guess what? Most people who offer this advice "not everyone needs the performance" are usually offering opinions based purely on AMD builds.

They dismiss i3 completely at the same price points just like you have just done. No mention of i3 in your post here but for gaming it beats the Phenom II in many benchies for less money.


See my point?

 

[Uriel]

To be fair - I think easyrider and some of the people I suspect he's criticising are being overly simplistic.

AMD and Intel both have merits. For new CPUs at anything under £90 I think AMD do currently offer the most bang for buck. From £90 to £160 it's arguable. Both manufacturers offer decent CPUs for the price. Over £160 Intel all the way.

Having said that - for gaming the £90 to £160 bracket buys you all the performance you'll need for now from both manufacturers.

Why spend more? Future proofing? I don't think you'll get any tangible benefit over buying a cheap CPU now and upgrading to another cheap CPU when it becomes a bottleneck.

Edit: In a number of games Dual Core Phenom IIs currently offer better performance than quad athlons because of the L3 cache. Let's not forget - it's an easy upgrade to quad if you don't unlock. They're all the same socket.

 

[jaybee]

I think some people maybe do have brand loyalty to AMD yes. But otherwise it's often a lot about getting the most bang for your buck which they obviously sometimes see as being the AMD lottery with unlocking. Sometimes it is bad advice but it's only an opinion at the end of the day. I generally see it quite mixed on here but have noticed a fair bit of AMD recommendations lately as an alternative "on a budget" style build.

 

[jaybee]

One thing I would say about this debate and a lot of others on there forums; it seems that people are the first to make statements and opinions around gaming and solely gaming. People do use their machines for other things that are more important to them.

 

[Uriel]

Gaming is one area where you'll feel a lack of performance. Encoding is another.

For general PC usage most people will benefit far more from throwing the money at a SSD rather than a CPU.

 

[pcoltrane]

Easyrider - at least have the decency to insult me in the original thread that I posted in and not just selectively quote me in a different thread!

-Its AMD blinkered post's that I see you posting all over these forums that make me wince.

-Suggesting a 72 quid AMD dual on the "chance" it might unlock to a quad is FUD.

-The above post is BS I have to read in these forums sometimes.Why not just a buy a ******* Quad in the first place! Like AMD Athlon II X4 Quad Core 630 2.80GHz for a tenner more

Since we are selectively quoting though I may as well do the same

Intel blinkered post make me wince too, but hey I'll try not to whine about it.

The clue for the appeal of the 555BE is in the forum name ...*OVERCLOCKERS* Uk. Sure you can buy an X4 630 for £10 more ... but should things go well with a 555BE you'll have more cache, probably a faster clock, oh and as you pointed out it'll be £10 cheaper. Not only that, but there is a certain pleasure in knowing you paid a fraction of the price for something that you would normally have to pay twice as much for. There is no guarantee with any overclock, not even an i7 - but thats why we're here right? We like taking those calculated risks.

The OP in the other thread isn't stupid - plenty of people (myself included) pointed out that if he wanted a guaranteed quad he should buy one in the first place. He seems like a bright guy making a considered purchase and last thing he posted he still was keeping all options open from the 555BE to an i7. Good for him.

So really what's your issue? Toys out the pram because other people don't hold the same views as yourself? That's ok, you are entitled to throw your toys whenever you like ... but at least have the decency to do so in the original thread! Posting in a different one is akin to mudslinging behind someones back rather than confronting them face to face.

Marc

 

[easyrider]

Easyrider - at least have the decency to insult me in the original thread that I posted in and not just selectively quote me in a different thread!

I just CBA anymore replying to such nonesense.

I was getting around to it but changed my mind after reading how incredibly stupid your post was. Sorry.