organised religion

Soldato
Joined
26 Nov 2008
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4,213
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Leeds
Before i start just let me say i am not trying to start a flame war i am just interested if people have the same opinion as me so please any trolls just go curl up in a corner and die.

Anyway to the topic, is it just me that finds the whole idea of organised religion stupid? Now i understand that people want to believe in a deity or deitys but why can't they just believe and then just keep it to themselves. It's the whole joining a club thats based on chinese whispers that annoys me, not the fact that they believe in a supernatural force.
 
For me if people want to adopt a set of beliefs that help them make sense of their lives and gives them a moral framework to live by(as long as it doesn't hurt anyone) then I'm glad for them.

Whats wrong in like minded people getting together to support each other? They will be stronger & enjoy companionship.
 
Before i start just let me say i am not trying to start a flame war i am just interested if people have the same opinion as me so please any trolls just go curl up in a corner and die.

Starting with "trolls just go curl up in a corner and die", then saying organised religion is "stupid" is a bit hypocritcal, no?
 
the idea of organised religion isn't really a bad one in theory, most people need some kind of direction/teaching, and giving them a basic moral code linked to punishment from the big bad man in the sky is fair enough.

It's just often implemented badly, the old testament makes a lot of sense when you're talking about disparate tribes of people, less so in modern society.

For example, two things that are frowned upon in the OT are sodomy and eating the flesh of a pig, simple enough reasons for both, if your tribe decide they'd rather do it up the pooper then you're not going to have a tribe for very long as there won't be any offspring, as for the pig meat, in very basic conditions it's harder to safely prepare and more so store pork, if they get ill they'll die.

Obviously both these restrictions aren't really applicable in the modern world and as such you can sling your sausage up anyones pooper even if it's a pork sausage.
 
any religion 99% of the time is pushed upon impressionable children, who easily without question believe in the tooth fairy/santa until they're told it's false...

give it a few years and it'll be gone ;)
 
The main religions, ironically, are the worst and most backwards religions that there are, and I think they are pointless and do more harm than good. Yes, I'm talking about Islam, Christianity and Judaism.

Some religions, however, such as Buddhism, I find less offensive as they are more a way of life and are very personal and there seems to be less preaching and indoctrination.

Religions are ridiculous for the following reasons.

1.They act as an identifier and cause segregation amongst communities. ie. Northern Island (catholic/protestant divide) or Sunni/Shia divide in Iraq.

2.The actual teachings in their holy books are violent, racist, homophobic, sexist and intolerant towards other religions/beliefs ie apostacy punishable by death in Islam.

3.They restrict advancement of the human race - I'm thinking about stem cell research, cloning and also the pope's idiotic comment that people in aids ridden Africa shouldn't wear condoms but pray instead. Also, teaching noah's ark in a science lesson??? Refusing to teach evolution.

4.Relgion gives people an excuse to do bad things - Terrorists think they will be martyred if they kill people in the name of their religion.

5.The morality of religion is awfully shallow in a lot of cases. People do good things to avoid damnation and to gain reward in the after life.

6.The religious look on life, which teaches that you some how get another life after death, seems to me to devalue this life somewhat and make this life less important because you'll get another chance.

7.Religion is like a virus spreading from generation to generation, catching children when they are young and impressionable and labelling them catholic or jewish children. This is wrong, they aren't old enough to make their minds up yet and be labelled accordingly!!!

8.Religion seems to have this impervious coat surrounding it, which shields it from any criticism. Why does it deserve this protection? Everything should be open to criticism without the fear of causing offence.

9.Religion has this stupid idea that it created the morals in the world and that if it wasn't for religion we would all be killing and stealing from each other. Wrong! Morals are a lot older than religion, they are what make our species successful on an evolutionary path. We realised long ago, as did most primates, that it is better for our survival if we work together and do good in the community and support each other. We have altruistic genes that play a part in this too.

10.My last comment, the idea of a god just doesn't make sense - If we needed a creator to create everything, then who created god?

:D
 
There's more of a chance of it dying out in the future than there has been in the past. This is because we now have other plausible explanations for why things occur ie. how the diversity of life is so rich in the world.

The annoying thing about the human race is that we can't be satified with mystery, we have to think of some explanation for why and how! The answer has generally been - God! God is the obvious choice for lack of a better explanation, however, we have better explanations for things now and consequently we should start to see the demise of god. I wouldn't bet on it though. Not for a long time!
 
Before i start just let me say i am not trying to start a flame war i am just interested if people have the same opinion as me so please any trolls just go curl up in a corner and die.

Anyway to the topic, is it just me that finds the whole idea of organised religion stupid? Now i understand that people want to believe in a deity or deitys but why can't they just believe and then just keep it to themselves. It's the whole joining a club thats based on chinese whispers that annoys me, not the fact that they believe in a supernatural force.

Disorganised religion is even worse! Nobody can decide who they're supposed to be burning! :eek: :rolleyes: :p
 
There's more of a chance of it dying out in the future than there has been in the past. This is because we now have other plausible explanations for why things occur ie. how the diversity of life is so rich in the world.

The annoying thing about the human race is that we can't be satified with mystery, we have to think of some explanation for why and how! The answer has generally been - God! God is the obvious choice for lack of a better explanation, however, we have better explanations for things now and consequently we should start to see the demise of god. I wouldn't bet on it though. Not for a long time!

The problem in many cases though is that the 'better' explanation is used by most with as much blind faith as those who follow the bible, and those who actually understand the processes involved realise (in most cases) that they don't actually show what some want them to.
 
Before i start just let me say i am not trying to start a flame war i am just interested if people have the same opinion as me so please any trolls just go curl up in a corner and die.

Anyway to the topic, is it just me that finds the whole idea of organised religion stupid? Now i understand that people want to believe in a deity or deitys but why can't they just believe and then just keep it to themselves. It's the whole joining a club thats based on chinese whispers that annoys me, not the fact that they believe in a supernatural force.

Various religions have been persecuted throughout their history, safety in numbers.

United we stand, divided we get thrown to the lions and all that :p



Surely there is a much bigger and more obvious choice of random grouping you could call stupid?


Such as little lines drawn on maps saying you're in group A and you're in group B now remember you hate each other go at it!
 
There's more of a chance of it dying out in the future than there has been in the past.

Want to put some money on it? A "few years" would suggest under 10 and I would bet an awful lot of money that organised religion will still be here in 10 years, even 100 years, probably even longer.
 
The problem in many cases though is that the 'better' explanation is used by most with as much blind faith as those who follow the bible, and those who actually understand the processes involved realise (in most cases) that they don't actually show what some want them to.

The thing that annoys me about religion is that a lot of religious people will say 'well no, I don't believe in the easter bunny, that's stupid, but I believe in god' - When in fact there's about as much evidence for the existence of either, which is none, of course.

I'm much more inclined to listen to a theory that is based on weak evience, but that does in fact have some evidence, than I am to listen to a stupid creation story etc.. based on no evidence.
 
The thing that annoys me about religion is that a lot of religious people will say 'well no, I don't believe in the easter bunny, that's stupid, but I believe in god' - When in fact there's about as much evidence for the existence of either, which is none, of course.

I'm much more inclined to listen to a theory that is based on weak evience, but that does in fact have some evidence, than I am to listen to a stupid creation story etc.. based on no evidence.

There is plenty of evidence for the existence of God, just not evidence you (or I generally) accept. Don't confuse a lack of evidence with a lack of evidence you find credible.
 
Want to put some money on it? A "few years" would suggest under 10 and I would bet an awful lot of money that organised religion will still be here in 10 years, even 100 years, probably even longer.

I was thinking more like 1000 years, and as I made perfectly clear in my last sentence of that paragraph - I wouldn't bet on it. All I'm saying is that, I think there's more chance of it happening in the next 1000 years than there was 1000 years ago. a lot more chance. All you've got to do is look at Britain over the last 100 years to see that religion is dying out. You look at the figures in the developed countries and you'll see that religion is a lot less important now.
 
There is plenty of evidence for the existence of God, just not evidence you (or I generally) accept. Don't confuse a lack of evidence with a lack of evidence you find credible.

What evidence? And surely evidence is only evidence is if it is somewhat credible and can be measured. You can't have evidence that is evidence but isn't there.
 
My personal belief is that religion started only as a means for leaders to retain power.
Imagine back to the caveman days and you find yourself as the leader of your clan. Now, the easiest way for someone to take leadership from you is to simply kill you. Obviously that is not conducive to a long and prosperous life so what do you do? Create the idea of an all powerful God or Deity responsible for all life and then claim that you're under their protection and/or take your orders from them.
You've now just created a nice little layer of protection over yourself.

As for organised religion these days - take Christianity for example, even if Jesus and God do or did exist, generations upon generations of interpretation and 'leaders' changing things based on their own personal goals and/or beliefs of what is right or wrong would have lead to what we know as Christianity being so far removed from what was originally intended, it's just a mess.

One of my favourite examples is homosexuality. The bible says it is wrong and a sin. However, the bible also says all wives should be virgins and should be killed if they are not. Funny how they've conveniently forgotten that but still say homosexuality is a sin. Who decided one day that even though both things are clearly written in the bible, god was only joking about killing your wife is she's not a virgin? I highly doubt it was god.

I have no problems with people having religious beliefs. My own personal opinion is that religion is there for people who need to have the answers about life and cannot live with the idea that we're just here.

Sometimes religion is just stupid though. My parents are great and amazing people but did not go to my brother's wedding and do not respect him at all just because he is gay and it's against their religion. They're convinced that it's a choice he's made which to me is just stupid.
 
What evidence? And surely evidence is only evidence is if it is somewhat credible and can be measured. You can't have evidence that is evidence but isn't there.

Many who believe will cite the bible, Torah et al as evidence, because of their belief (or assumption if you prefer) in the provenience of the text.

The idea that evidence has to be measureable, repeatable and confirm to the scientific process is simply another assumption taken a priori, so criticising someone else for making evidence based on a priori beliefs would seem a little hypocritical.

Furthermore, the assumption that scientific explanations proposed actually relate to what happens is definitely an assumption that can only be taken a priori.
 
It's amazing how they just cherry pick the bible or Qu'ran now, looking for the bits that fit todays moral standing. If you sit down and think about it, it's just ridiculous and quite annoying that people can be so stupid.

People follow christianity because their parents followed it, same for Islam, Juadism or Hinduism. If you go back to ancient Egypt you would believe in the sun god, or Zeus if in ancient Greece. So why do people think that their god is the best or the right god??? Beyond me!

If there is a god - He/she/it won't be anything like we can imagine and would be something totally different - not necessarily a person or an animal but something so far out and unimagineable that we couldn't ever concieve it.
 
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