''every year the UK gives over £5bn to overseas aid from tax payers money''

cm1179 · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:18

news headline just on the bbc news

err pardon? i might get shot down for this but there's plenty of good causes in this country that money could go on

tuffty747 · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:20

It's all part of the budget, it's not just some Labour con. Every party does it, and for that matter, most rich economies do it, If I recall correctly.

Grrrrr · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:22

Yeah, **** everyone else :rolleyes:

scorza · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:23

It's a good question that needs to be asked more, especially with the recent revelations that Live Aid money was used by the Ethiopian government to buy arms.

M0T · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:24

UK Gives £5bn in aid, foriegn country uses it to buy British products/expertise. British companies get a foot in the door in developing economies.

So not only do large amounts of the money come back you expand prospects for future growth, sounds like a good deal to me.

Vulcan · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:25

Grrrrr said:
Yeah, **** everyone else

Charity starts at home.

cm1179 · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:28

M0T said:
UK Gives £5bn in aid, foriegn country uses it to buy British products/expertise. British companies get a foot in the door in developing economies.

do you have some examples of this please? and are you essentially saying we are doing this for british companies (not the general public who are paying the tax) or because it's 'the right thing to do'?

semi-pro waster · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:28

The UK is comparatively fortunate in the World so I think we've got a duty of sorts to provide help and aid where possible to other nations who are not so well off.

Incidentally while £5 billion is a significant sum of money it barely qualifies as a drop in the ocean compared to what is spent on public services within this country. So sure, it's a big headline figure but it's only when you compare it to what is actually spent 'looking after our own' that you appreciate it isn't quite the way it initially sounds.

cm1179 said:
do you have some examples of this please? and are you essentially saying we are doing this for british companies (not the general public who are paying the tax) or because it's 'the right thing to do'?

Often enough it's arms companies but the idea is basically right, in a capitalist society the general assumption is that what is good for companies will be good for the population through "trickle down" effects. Whether that's right or wrong is another matter entirely.

Gaygle · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:30

Longbow said:
Charity starts at home.

...is a very nice saying, but means relatively nothing.

With that attitude, the UK would never help anyone but ourselves because we're never going to live in a utopia.

cm1179 · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:31

semi-pro waster said:
The UK is comparatively fortunate in the World so I think we've got a duty of sorts to provide help and aid where possible to other nations who are not so well off.

Incidentally while £5 billion is a significant sum of money it barely qualifies as a drop in the ocean compared to what is spent on public services within this country. So sure, it's a big headline figure but it's only when you compare it to what is actually spent 'looking after our own' that you appreciate it isn't quite the way it initially sounds.

i just cannot accept this. there's been plenty of people in old age who have put tax into this country all their life and are getting screwed over. they should come first, no question. that ''£5bn'' should go towards helping the people you hear about in this country who have been let down by the system

Grrrrr · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:31

I've just looked this up, UK government spending was £631b in 2009. So if £5b was spent in foreign aid that equates to 0.8%.

I have absolutely no problem what-so-ever with 0.8% of my tax going to foreign aid and I'm very surprised that anyone else is

Chimerical · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:32

£5bn really is nothing.

cm1179 said:
i just cannot accept this. there's been plenty of people in old age who have put tax into this country all their life and are getting screwed over. they should come first, no question. that ''£5bn'' should go towards helping the people you hear about in this country who have been let down by the system

Plenty is spent on them already. What good would £5bn extra do for the £110bn that the NHS is already receiving for example? Plus the fact that Labour's method of throwing money at stuff doesn't work anyway.

Burnsy2023 · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:34

Does that include stuff like the British Council?

cm1179 · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:36

Chimerical said:
£5bn really is nothing.

Plenty is spent on them already. What good would £5bn extra do for the £110bn that the NHS is already receiving for example? Plus the fact that Labour's method of throwing money at stuff doesn't work anyway.

ooh i reckon you'd get a hospital and a medical unit out of £5bn, i'm sure there's a town somewhere that needs one

M0T · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:36

cm1179 said:
do you have some examples of this please? and are you essentially saying we are doing this for british companies (not the general public who are paying the tax) or because it's 'the right thing to do'?

Essentially when the government looks at giving aid it will factor in the likelyhood of that money making its way back to the British taxpayer. By giving the aid they gain favour in the countries they donate it to which works in the favour of British companies who aim to operate in the region.

Previously large amounts of aid where tied to the donor country, so in effect saying that you can have £5bn if you spend £4bn on our products. This is now illegal in the UK, but I studied this at university a few years back and there were still a lot of backroom deals being done.

cm1179 · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:39

M0T said:
Essentially when the government looks at giving aid it will factor in the likelyhood of that money making its way back to the British taxpayer. By giving the aid they gain favour in the countries they donate it to which works in the favour of British companies who aim to operate in the region.

Previously large amounts of aid where tied to the donor country, so in effect saying that you can have £5bn if you spend £4bn on our products. This is now illegal in the UK, but I studied this at university a few years back and there were still a lot of backroom deals being done.

but hang on, if these countries have £4bn to spend on our products, why do they need aid in the first place?

meghatronic · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:40

Chimerical said:
£5bn really is nothing.

£5bn is a lot of boots, kevlar vests, LPPVs, Mastiffs, Husky etc. It's a lot to add the compensation payout for wounded soldiers, and to give them better rehabilitation and support. It would also improve the force's housing. It could also boost lower ranks salaries quite a bit.

I'm not saying the £5bn in aid isn't a bad idea. I'm just saying there are better ways the money could be spent right now.

meghatronic said:
Ah. Time to post my favourite picture again:

semi-pro waster · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:40

cm1179 said:
i just cannot accept this. there's been plenty of people in old age who have put tax into this country all their life and are getting screwed over. they should come first, no question. that ''£5bn'' should go towards helping the people you hear about in this country who have been let down by the system

It's unfortunate that you don't accept this but in terms of figures it's simply indisputable that the £5 billion is negligible in the overall picture and takes no account of what we may get in return for this investment/gift (whatever you choose to call it). If you spend £5 but get £6 worth of value in non-monetary form then have you done well in the deal or badly?

Chimerical · 18 Mar 2010 at 22:41

cm1179 said:
ooh i reckon you'd get a hospital and a medical unit out of £5bn, i'm sure there's a town somewhere that needs one

Or it'll go on some useless management scheme. The NHS still sucks despite the massive amount of money going into it so I don't think it deserves any more cash.