Poll: Which party will get your vote in the General Election?

[.Kencs]

The parties are releasing their manifestos this week, that would be a good place to start. It's very difficult to give unbiased advice unfortunately on politics.

Where can I get their manifestos from?

 

[Dolph]

Where can I get their manifestos from?

Their websites once they are published, or you can find the key points on most of the major news sites, but consider the bias of each site when looking at how they will present the article.

 

[Hatter The Mad]

The NHS is already having its budget constrained. So what do they do with spare cash? Treat and expand the management, of course

It isn't unexpected. When you give NHS managers money, what will they do? Make more managers and ask for more money next time (i.e. the same in every public institution who do not need to achieve a profit or certain level of productivity/efficiency).

Cash breeds cash demand. Bureaucracy breeds bureaucracy.

NHS managers’ pay rises double those of nurses in 2008-09

Top managers in England’s NHS trusts received average pay rises of nearly 7% in 2008-09, compared with less than 3% granted to nurses, a report says.
The report [by the Incomes Data Services] into boardroom pay at more than 380 NHS trusts in England found chief executives received a 6.9% average pay increase in 2008/09 - more than double that given to nurses.

Details of the inflation-busting 6.9 per cent rise came as a report released at the weekend said falling productivity in the NHS was one of the biggest failings of the 13 years of Labour rule and that a “relentless drive” to improve it must be the top priority of the incoming administration.

http://futurefairforall.org/post/515296526/nhs-managers-pay-rises-double-those-of-nurses-in

 

[britboy4321]

I need help in deciding...I've never voted before and I don't know which 1 to go for, my wife is voting for Labour, but the way I see it is why should I HAVE to vote because I have no idea which party does what so therefore my vote will be a random 1...Can someone give me a run down between Labour and Conservatives please and what each of them are responsible for? Otherwise Im gonna be throwing my vote at anyone...

If you really have no idea about the parties I don't think it's unreasonable to say 'I can not make a value judgement' and skip voting.

As a VERY rough guideline, the big difference is Labour will keep/move taxes high, but attempt to give you better public and social services (should you need them) and bigger government meaning generally tighter controls across the board. Conservatives will try and reduce tax (put money into your back pocket if you're working), smaller government (weaker controls and demands from central government, less regulation), and of course public and social services could suffer.

The lib-dems are in theory somewhere in the middle ..


I've tried to make this post as neutral as I can but someone will STILL claim it is biased or something. It is very difficult to write neutral stuff to a new voter.

 

[mollymoo]

If you really have no idea about the parties I don't think it's unreasonable to say 'I can not make a value judgement' and skip voting.

As a VERY rough guideline, Labour will keep/move taxes high, but attempt to give you better public services and bigger government (tighter controls). Conservatives will try and reduce tax (put money into your back pocket if you're working), lower government (weaker controls) and of course public services could suffer.

The lib-dems are in theory somewhere in the middle ..

The lib-dems would say " Oh **** we won, what do we do now"

 

[robgmun]

http://www.stopthescaremongering.com/

 

[Hatter The Mad]

The lib-dems are in theory somewhere in the middle ..

This sums up your ignorance and poor understanding of politics. The Lib Dems are not in the middle somewhere on those issues.

• Labour: Reduce the deficit through tax rises and spending cuts. Big state, less personal responsibility, state is the first port of call, everyone pays more tax and the government has more of a say on how to spend it.
  
• Conservatives: Reduce the deficit through fewer tax rises and more spending cuts (than Labour). Smaller state, more personal responsibility, state is the first port of call where the market cannot be, government has less of a say on how to spend your money.
  
• Liberal Democrats: Attempt as far as possible to reduce the deficit without any tax rises and entirely spending cuts. Tiny state, hugely more personal responsibility, state is the first port of call where the market cannot be, everyone pays less tax.

So yes, your "very rough guideline" is indeed very rough. It is false.

I've tried to make this post as neutral as I can but someone will STILL claim it is biased or something. It is very difficult to write neutral stuff to a new voter.

I don't think it is biased, it is just wrong.

 

[britboy4321]

This sums up your ignorance and poor understanding of politics. The Lib Dems are not in the middle somewhere on those issues.

Labour: Reduce the deficit through tax rises and spending cuts. Big state, less personal responsibility, state is the first port of call.

Conservatives: Reduce the deficit through fewer tax rises and more spending cuts. Smaller state, more personal responsibility, state is the first port of call where the market cannot be.

Liberal Democrats: Attempt as far as possible to reduce the deficit without any tax rises. Tiny state, hugely more personal responsibility, state is the first port of call where the market cannot be.

Embarrassing!

I showed a bloke at work your post about the Lib Dems and he looked at me and just looked incredulous and said 'How did he get through school? How old is he? Why haven't they taught him the basics in school?'. My mate has read none of this forum to date, is neutral, and that's what he came out with immediately, a neutral reader, whose political persuasion I don't know!

Seriously, I presume you are quite young? Have you voted before? I can kind of understand if you are < 18 years old as when I was a kid I had crazy, wacky ideas too. Part of growing up, don't worry - it's cool.

If you are > 18, well I'll just say there should be some kind of test before you get to vote Democracy sucks! (Lib dems want 'tiny state'? I don't know whether to laugh or cry! Just ask your lib dem campaigners when they call over the next few weeks if you are right or wrong. Don't take my word for it for goodness sake, ask them!) I also know from when I was a kid that kids think are 'above' apologies and it makes them somehow 'lose' even when blatently wrong, hence I await some stunningly awesome come-back from you instead

 

[robgmun]

The lib-dems would say " Oh **** we won, what do we do now"

Lib-dems are oppotunistic and populist. they will say only what people what to hear. They know they have no real chance of winning so they can come up with anything they want and sound great, if they get into power they would **** bricks and we would see the most uneless government in history.

 

[britboy4321]

Lib-dems are oppotunistic and populist. they will say only what people what to hear. They know they have no real chance of winning so they can come up with anything they want and sound great, if they get into power they would **** bricks and we would see the most uneless government in history.

It's odds-on that the lib-dems will have more power than the tories after the general election .. as part of a super-duper 'coalition'.

COME ON HUNG-PARLIAMENT .....

 

[meghatronic]

It's odds-on that the lib-dems will have more power than the tories after the general election .. as part of a super-duper 'coalition'.

COME ON HUNG-PARLIAMENT .....

YES - That's exactly what we want isn't it? Oh no. Wait a minute. That would destroy the country. /facepalm

 

[Hatter The Mad]

If you are > 18, well I'll just say there should be some kind of test before you get to vote Democracy sucks! (Lib dems want 'tiny state'? I don't know whether to laugh or cry! Just ask your lib dem campaigners when they call over the next few weeks if you are right or wrong. Don't take my word for it for goodness sake, ask them!) I also know from when I was a kid that kids think are 'above' apologies and it makes them somehow 'lose' even when blatently wrong, hence I await some stunningly awesome come-back from you instead

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Democrats#Ideology_and_internal_factions

Leading market liberals in the party include Vince Cable, David Laws and Nick Clegg.[80]

So the majority of and leaders of the party are currently the libertarian, free market proponents (in case you don't know what that means - it means lower taxes for all, vastly more personal liberties and freedoms and (thus) a smaller state).



http://www.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/5831523/clegg-heir-to-thatcher.thtml

Not only does the Lib Dem leader say he'll end the structural deficit with 100 percent spending cuts (not the 20 percent tax rises, 80 percent cuts combo that the Tories advocate), but he even heaps praise in Lady Thatcher. More, he describes her as something of an inspiration: just as she took on vested interests in the 1980s, so he will take on the banks now.

Why should I be embarrassed? All I have done is reeled off some facts.

Or are you saying Nick Clegg is wrong about what the Lib Dems stand for? Perhaps you are - I wouldn't put it past you.

 

[robgmun]

Brown looked a bit rattled on a question from Sky news on doing the manifesto launch in a NHS hospital

 

[Hatter The Mad]

“Manifesto pledges are not subject to legitimate expectation” - Gordon Brown in legal defence, 2008

Defending a court case (ITN News) brought against Gordon Brown the by the political party UKIP (Wikipedia) for breach of contract over a (or lack of) referendum on an EU constitution, Gordon Brown’s barrister presented the following defence to the court:

Manifesto pledges are not subject to legitimate expectation.

We have chosen to dig out this quotation in light of Gordon Brown’s promises to allow citizens to legally oblige the government into meeting particular standards (BBC).

http://futurefairforall.org/post/515509240/manifesto-pledges-are-not-subject-to-legitimate

 

[Hatter The Mad]

Brown looked a bit rattled on a question from Sky news on doing the manifesto launch in a NHS hospital

Lol yeah - "This hospital cost £600m to build and start. It will cost the tax payer more than £2bn under your PFI scheme..."

 

[meghatronic]

Brown looked a bit rattled on a question from Sky news on doing the manifesto launch in a NHS hospital

That seems lamentable.... shouldn't be allowed.

 

[robgmun]

Just finished watching it all, the press question from all the papers and media wern't giving him an easy time. Althrough i do expect to give a similar grilling to david tomorrow when it's his turn

 

[britboy4321]

Just finished watching it all, the press question from all the papers and media wern't giving him an easy time. Althrough i do expect to give a similar grilling to david tomorrow when it's his turn

Basically the papers are trying to make a story.

This is going to sound bizarre but if the whole of society is really harsh on MPs, we'll only get the numpties wanting to be MPs (and have an awful life), all the creme-de-la-creme that SHOULD be running the country will go into private business, earn £2.8m a year, and have no-one **** them off.

Not sure what the answer is - but already the best people are all in industry earning shedloads and we end up with the 'second-place can't handle it' people RUNNING THE COUNTRY because it's such an awful 'get slagged off whatever you do' job!! It's wrong I tells ya!

Yet of course the politicians can't complain because then they're out of power and we have an even bigger numpty in control.

Just like they can't complain about their CRAZY LOW salaries (60K for a normal MP? For running the country? wtf?) because then yet again they're out of a job. So all the people that CAN think 'screw this' and go earn millions in the private sector, and nugget bloke who can't ends up running the UK.

/rant

 

[Mr Jack]

“Manifesto pledges are not subject to legitimate expectation” - Gordon Brown in legal defence, 2008

Do you think manifesto's should be treated as promises? Wouldn't that be rather an absurd position to get into?

 

[meghatronic]

Do you think manifesto's should be treated as promises? Wouldn't that be rather an absurd position to get into?

Absolutely. But it would be nicer if we just dismissed with the **** all together. If they don't stick to them, and intelligent people know they have no intention of sticking to them, it becomes political hyperbole to trick the less switched on electorate. Similar to what we saw in the US recently.