Little advice/help/thoughts needed on some BMW 540i's
- Thread starter Moeks
- Start date
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Yea, I am sure now the idle has started hunting, and it stalled once and it feels a bit flat low down at times ...that all combined with the noise it makes makes me sure there is something wrong. I am not 'sure' it's the VANOS but I am fairly confident that it is because all the different symptoms have started to come together now which all point to that being the issue. Of course there are other things which can cause all this and it could be case of several unrelated things all happening at once making it look like VANOS failure.
O2 censors, cam sensors and a dodgy pcv can all give similar idle issues. I am sure there isn't a problem with the air ducting as I checked that very carefully, had it out 3 times now anyway and the MAF looks quite new and is clean.
Of course it 'could' be a dodgy o2 censor causing the idle issues and chain rattle from having a shot guide rail which was caused by having a slack main tensioner for too long causing the rattle ...making it look like a VANOS issue ...but I don't think so. I just don't.
I know it's not as common a failure item as on the l6's as it's a totally different design, but ...the BMW Land forums, Bimmer Forums and a few others all have plenty of people on them that have had VANOS issues with the M62TU B44 and M62TU B35 engines.
I was hoping if it was the VANOS I could ignore it for a good long while, thing is, I don't really know how long someone else has been ignoring it for.
Yea that's one thing that put me off so much at the time MrLOL, 'might' fix it, however now I have changed the timing chain main tensioner I know it isn't a slack tensioner causing the noise, mind you there are other tensioners on that chain and a guide that could have issues, but those are a total engine open, top and bottom job, that would cost so much it wouldn't be worth doing. I think if the chain rattle was bad enough to cause further damage it'd have been a hell of a lot louder than it was, I only had a mild tap and now I have changed the tensioner.
/grrrrr
O2 censors, cam sensors and a dodgy pcv can all give similar idle issues. I am sure there isn't a problem with the air ducting as I checked that very carefully, had it out 3 times now anyway and the MAF looks quite new and is clean.
Of course it 'could' be a dodgy o2 censor causing the idle issues and chain rattle from having a shot guide rail which was caused by having a slack main tensioner for too long causing the rattle ...making it look like a VANOS issue ...but I don't think so. I just don't.
I know it's not as common a failure item as on the l6's as it's a totally different design, but ...the BMW Land forums, Bimmer Forums and a few others all have plenty of people on them that have had VANOS issues with the M62TU B44 and M62TU B35 engines.
I was hoping if it was the VANOS I could ignore it for a good long while, thing is, I don't really know how long someone else has been ignoring it for.
Yea that's one thing that put me off so much at the time MrLOL, 'might' fix it, however now I have changed the timing chain main tensioner I know it isn't a slack tensioner causing the noise, mind you there are other tensioners on that chain and a guide that could have issues, but those are a total engine open, top and bottom job, that would cost so much it wouldn't be worth doing. I think if the chain rattle was bad enough to cause further damage it'd have been a hell of a lot louder than it was, I only had a mild tap and now I have changed the tensioner.
/grrrrr
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Well yes that's the thing though, BMW could not guarantee me that it would sort the issue, but then the issue was just a noise when I saw them, nothing more. I asked them about this 'might and probably' business and they just said that chain problems are very rare on these, the tech didn't think it was a ticking lifer and it was 'probably' the VANOS. Well chain issues aren't that rare it would seem, at least not according to the interwebs. Maybe I should ask a different BMW garage what they think.
But yea, what if I do spend £1k on it, and it doesn't fix it, that's what I am thinking right now. I love the E39 ...especailly the 540i ...but is it worth all this. I can afford to throw a bit more at it, but do I really want to? ...I'm not so sure anymore.
But yea, what if I do spend £1k on it, and it doesn't fix it, that's what I am thinking right now. I love the E39 ...especailly the 540i ...but is it worth all this. I can afford to throw a bit more at it, but do I really want to? ...I'm not so sure anymore.
From experience it's very easy to get wrapped up in a car - especially one you love. It's also important to remember that there are other things in life other than your car - other things to spend £k's on!
All depends on your outlook I suppose - and your currnet financial situation, but I'd think long and hard before spending out that kind of money on something that 'may' fix the problem.
All depends on your outlook I suppose - and your currnet financial situation, but I'd think long and hard before spending out that kind of money on something that 'may' fix the problem.
I'm nto so sure anymore, as you say it's a different sound, and because it didn't sound like all the other recordings I had heard that is why I wasn't sold on it being a VANOS issue initially, what makes me think it is now is because I have changed the main chain tensioner, and the cars idle is jumpy now, this is a new thing it wasn't like that before. Now I think tin does sound more like marbles in a tin, but the tap, tap is still there too.
The other thing that makes me wonder is, I think most of the videos I have heard trying to show what VANOS issues sound like, have been on l6's. Owing to it's different design, does the V8 VANOS sound like that when it has issues or is it different ? ...I don't know.
Maybe Ill try and get another recording of it again.
I don't know, tis all guesses really.
Actually I forgot when I was writing my first post up tonight, the is something else that has been around about week. That slight whistle I get, the medium tone short whistle I mentioned I get ocasionally when I put my foot on the accelerator, kind of like someone sucking a little air into their mouth through their teeth.
I don't know what that is but I guess it's something like the pcv valve etc ? ...in which case I guess that could cause the idle issue.
The other thing that makes me wonder is, I think most of the videos I have heard trying to show what VANOS issues sound like, have been on l6's. Owing to it's different design, does the V8 VANOS sound like that when it has issues or is it different ? ...I don't know.
Maybe Ill try and get another recording of it again.
I don't know, tis all guesses really.
Actually I forgot when I was writing my first post up tonight, the is something else that has been around about week. That slight whistle I get, the medium tone short whistle I mentioned I get ocasionally when I put my foot on the accelerator, kind of like someone sucking a little air into their mouth through their teeth.
I don't know what that is but I guess it's something like the pcv valve etc ? ...in which case I guess that could cause the idle issue.
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Oh I can't remember off hand, I'll have to check, not that long though.
Edit: 8th of Feb I had.
What could I say to the trader though? ...tis broke, gimmie monies to fix it ?
I just looked at his website, it still has my Jag, down to £9995 now, he was trying for £11k initially, I told him he'ed never get that
Edit: 8th of Feb I had.
What could I say to the trader though? ...tis broke, gimmie monies to fix it ?
I just looked at his website, it still has my Jag, down to £9995 now, he was trying for £11k initially, I told him he'ed never get that
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I'd definitely pursue the dealer, even if they didnt give you a warranty the sale of goods act still applies.
They have to supply you with goods that are fit for purpose - given the fact these problems started a little while ago (your youtube recordings and posts here back that up nicely) I'd say this would fall into that category. I seem to remember a figure of 6 months for the dealers responsibility, after that it was down to you to prove...someone else may be able to clarify though.
I'd definitely be putting my efforts into getting the dealer to sort it out, or at least pay for a significant chunk of it, before spending time and money diagnosing it. I'd want to hand him the keys and tell him to sort it tbh
They have to supply you with goods that are fit for purpose - given the fact these problems started a little while ago (your youtube recordings and posts here back that up nicely) I'd say this would fall into that category. I seem to remember a figure of 6 months for the dealers responsibility, after that it was down to you to prove...someone else may be able to clarify though.
I'd definitely be putting my efforts into getting the dealer to sort it out, or at least pay for a significant chunk of it, before spending time and money diagnosing it. I'd want to hand him the keys and tell him to sort it tbh
Anyone remember the one I got yonks ago for £2500. Well it now has over 205,000 on it.
Still running like a goodun.
New bills:
Center driveshaft bearing disintegrated - £45 part - free labour
New pads on the front: Free free free
Strange coolant loss from NEW radiator - Blames bad BMW design on that one.
The most expensive thing about the car is the fuel - ouch!
18mpg avg speed 22mph!
Still running like a goodun.
New bills:
Center driveshaft bearing disintegrated - £45 part - free labour
New pads on the front: Free free free
Strange coolant loss from NEW radiator - Blames bad BMW design on that one.
The most expensive thing about the car is the fuel - ouch!
18mpg avg speed 22mph!
You got lucky Pinter, I didn't ...is yours a pre 1998 by chance ? If so, it doesn't have the M62TU with VANOS to go wrong ...nor does it have the flakey plastic main timing chain guide rail it has a metal one, has the good old and arguably more solid M62.
...is yours a pre 1998 by chance ? If so, it doesn't have the M62TU with VANOS to go wrong ...nor does it have the flakey plastic main timing chain guide rail it has a metal one, has the good old and arguably more solid M62.
The whistle noise could well be the PCV which in turn could give idle problems. Generally idle issues are usually resolved by cleaning the air gap around the throttle butterfly. Because there is no idle valve, it relies on this gap for air flow along with electrically adjusting the throttle butterfly. Hence any crud can restrict it and cause issues.
You should also be checking for air leaks around the various vacuum hoses (secondary air system) under the main cover and down to the valve situated below the MAF.
The cover gaskets are also a related job when replacing the VANOS units. The gaskets alone have an RRP of £90. The VANOS replacement cost sounds reasonable considering the units are £650!
It would be good to finally catch up with you for a listen, however I am not home until next week now. I guess it depends on how desperate you are to get it done?
You should also be checking for air leaks around the various vacuum hoses (secondary air system) under the main cover and down to the valve situated below the MAF.
The cover gaskets are also a related job when replacing the VANOS units. The gaskets alone have an RRP of £90. The VANOS replacement cost sounds reasonable considering the units are £650!
It would be good to finally catch up with you for a listen, however I am not home until next week now. I guess it depends on how desperate you are to get it done?
I checked all the intake hoses today and cleaned the throttle butterfly as it happens, no change. Yes it would probably be good if you could have a listen, I'll see how things progress and if it' still like this when you've got some time, we can arrange something and see what you think.
Where is the PCV anyway, I've not been able to find this out from my reading so far, is it something I can clean out relatively easily to see if it improves ?
Yea, know any in the Midlands area ? ...I can go and do some research to find out I guess but I'll try the easy way first
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No problems, I will email you after the weekend...
Back of the manifold, next to the bulkhead.
Here is a guide: http://home.comcast.net/~vicent/osve38.html
It is item 2 in this picture: http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=DN62&mospid=47548&btnr=11_2281&hg=11&fg=40
Highly unlikely for the VANOS job ~ they would not have the several hundred ££ worth of kit or the experience and then backup when it goes wrong...