Vodafone customer? Might want to read this...

BF-Bert · 11 May 2010 at 15:17

Why would anyone be entitled to cancel given that they seem to be going back to the original T&C's and enforcing the FUP conditions?

CliffyBiro · 11 May 2010 at 15:56

BF-Bert said:
Why would anyone be entitled to cancel given that they seem to be going back to the original T&C's and enforcing the FUP conditions?

We wouldn't if they do, but that's not what was originally being proposed. They've clearly realised the number of cancellations that would have flooded in and have backtracked and taken a new route which while amounts to the same thing, does not mean a change in Terms and Conditions.

mcwildcard · 11 May 2010 at 15:59

Considering the wealth of misinformation given out by VF, I may well send them a letter in regards to cancelling the contract anyway, just in case it's all a smokescreen.
The worst that can happen is they say no.

ps3ud0 · 11 May 2010 at 16:17

skippi90 said:
We wouldn't if they do, but that's not what was originally being proposed. They've clearly realised the number of cancellations that would have flooded in and have backtracked and taken a new route which while amounts to the same thing, does not mean a change in Terms and Conditions.

From my chat with you whatever they were proposing was always going to be within their T&Cs, just the interpretation of that which has been the issue. A lot of this has been caused by VF staff loosely throwing phrases that include 'terms' around and in reality have probably exacerbated the situation...

ps3ud0 :cool:

CliffyBiro · 11 May 2010 at 16:19

ps3ud0 said:
From my chat with you whatever they were proposing was always going to be within their T&Cs, just the interpretation of that which has been the issue. A lot of this has been caused by VF staff loosely throwing phrases that include 'terms' around and in reality have probably exacerbated the situation...

ps3ud0

Not the bit that they were going to charge immediately after exceeding 500mb though? The problem was with Forum Reps not having a clue what they were talking about.

"andy" · 11 May 2010 at 18:27

they have ALWAYS had a fair usage policy. there is no change to the contracts. even my unlimited* years ago had *subject to fair usage policy in the terms and conditions

this is why no one will get there contract canceled over this.

i guess you could argue about what is fair but good luck

CliffyBiro · 11 May 2010 at 18:42

"andy" said:
they have ALWAYS had a fair usage policy. there is no change to the contracts. even my unlimited* years ago had *subject to fair usage policy in the terms and conditions

this is why no one will get there contract canceled over this.

i guess you could argue about what is fair but good luck

Not going to bother reading the thread?

The original proposals were to scrap the FUP in favour of a hard-cap.

Azza · 11 May 2010 at 18:44

People on MSE have already emailed Watchdog.

Robbo · 11 May 2010 at 19:00

Someone on MSE managed to get it cancelled on the phone (4 month N900 contract, like me) -

I was very very angry when I spoke to them-

It wasn't easy either- I spoke to 3 people in total and the last guy was quoting sections 12 13 and 14 of the contract saying they reserve the right to blah blah blah**

I cut him short and explained that 10.2 states that any changes to the plan must be communicated to me before they take effect. Therefore anything else it says in the contract is irrelevant, as we have no contract. You can't just pick and choose which terms you want to follow. Nor can you sell someone an 'unlimited' contract, then add a limit to it 3 months later once you've got all the handsets out so you can make more money. There are laws against this kind of behaviour. This is called ripping people off.

I was asked if i regularly go over the 500MB limit, to which I replied yes.

'OK he says, when would you like us to collect it?'...... I almost fell off my chair with surprise.

Suggests to me they know full well that they are in the wrong here- I reckon the staff have just been told to make it as difficult as possible for people wanting to leave the contract. Even by quoting stats which are completely untrue, as a method of bullying their customers into giving up the fight. In a couple of weeks the changes will be in place, then they'll really have you by the nuts, so to speak. No getting out then. So they'll only have to find excuses for a short while longer then its game over.

They just quote stats at you, meaningless gibberish like 'well 500MB is plenty for 99% and enough for over 10,000 x' blah blah blah don't even let them start, just cut them off and rubbish all their suggestions and tell them you've heard it all before, accept nothing less unless they give you what is fair.

Best of luck......

Looks like provided you stick to your guns and can show the person you are talking to the problem with the contract you can get it canceled, seems they may want the handset back (which I wouldn't object to in all honesty, and they probably wouldn't even bother "collecting" it)

"andy" · 11 May 2010 at 19:06

skippi90 said:
Not going to bother reading the thread?

The original proposals were to scrap the FUP in favour of a hard-cap.

funnily enough i did . 500mb was always the FUP . even years ago it always said 'subject to fair usage policy of 500mb'

just like the unlimited text ones have always said 'subject to a fair usage policy of 2000'

CliffyBiro · 11 May 2010 at 19:11

"andy" said:
funnily enough i did . 500mb was always the FUP . even years ago it always said 'subject to fair usage policy of 500mb'

just like the unlimited text ones have always said 'subject to a fair usage policy of 2000'

Yes, and again, they were proposing immediately charging as soon as you strayed even 1mb over. That is not a FUP, that is a hard cap. A 500mb fair use policy is judged by the provider as to how much over that 500mb they deem to be excessive use.

Azza · 11 May 2010 at 19:16

"andy" said:
funnily enough i did . 500mb was always the FUP . even years ago it always said 'subject to fair usage policy of 500mb'

just like the unlimited text ones have always said 'subject to a fair usage policy of 2000'

It's actually 3000.

Mekrel · 11 May 2010 at 19:18

"andy" said:
funnily enough i did . 500mb was always the FUP . even years ago it always said 'subject to fair usage policy of 500mb'

just like the unlimited text ones have always said 'subject to a fair usage policy of 2000'

Obviously you haven't I'm not even on Vodaphone and I can tell the difference.

A FUP (what was part of the T&C's) is where your service may be restricted or cut off if you're deemed to be abusing the data services. No automatic charging of going above this.

A 500mb hard cap, which is what they're replacing the FUP with - means you use 500mb and pay for anything above. There was no automatic charge as part of the FUP.

How can you not understand the difference?

A lot of ISPs have a FUP on their "unlimited" packages, they just throttle you if you're deemed to abuse the data service.

If these ISPs then suddenly started to bill you for every time you went over the FUP limit, it would be the same scenario.

Azza · 11 May 2010 at 19:36

OWNED!!

Hi Everyone,

The examples of what you can do with 500MB of data are exactly that, examples, and not an absolute. I'd love us to be able to put an exact quantity of usage on it for you, but applications and websites all use the internet differently, and even then, our customers use each application differently to eachother too.

The thing I'd really like to emphasise again is the tiny number of Mobile Internet users who actually reach 500MB of usage per month.

As I've said before of my own usage, I use Facebook and Twitter regularly on my phone throughout the whole day, and also read the news, send and receive emails and play YouTube clips. That's not even mentioning App downloads. In fact I use the internet on my phone enough to run the battery down every day with only a few minutes of calls and a couple of texts. In my first month with the iPhone I used about 300MB, which I figure was due to all of the random stuff I was downloading, but then in subsequent months I've not gone over around 120MB, until this one where admittedly I'll be more like 400-500MB, but that's from video streaming of Touring Cars and key Premiership games (I say "key" games, but as a Livepool fan I'm not sure we've had one of those since about October!)

Thanks,

Tom

eForum Team

N20Y1D said:
Odd then that both iphone and the nexus have 1gb limits, i mean if only 3% of your mobile internet users reach the 500mb limit, why bother introducing 1gb limits? i mean the percentage that do that must be less than 0.5%

clicky

BF-Bert · 11 May 2010 at 20:33

If so many feel 500mb isn't nearly enough and use more than 1gig per month why did they get a contract with a FUP of 500mb?

thedinks · 11 May 2010 at 20:45

Robboftw said:
Someone on MSE managed to get it cancelled on the phone (4 month N900 contract, like me) -

Looks like provided you stick to your guns and can show the person you are talking to the problem with the contract you can get it canceled, seems they may want the handset back (which I wouldn't object to in all honesty, and they probably wouldn't even bother "collecting" it)

Could be a problem if you've sold the phone though

Robbo · 11 May 2010 at 20:51

thedinks said:
Could be a problem if you've sold the phone though

I haven't

Robbo · 12 May 2010 at 01:11

Ok.

I have just spent an hour talking to the "Team Leader" of the Vodafone online guys. He has confirmed that my bill will be generated on the 16th of May, and if it is over the 10%, I can cancel.

They seem to be able to get out of some of the other clauses, so if you are planning on cancelling, make sure you rack up over 600MB as soon as possible.

End of the discussion with "Gordon" -

You: It clearly states I can cancel my contract due to this in your terms.

Gordon: terms and conditions say 10% more than your past bills.

Gordon: As I have explained our position on this, I'm sorry that I am unable to help any further with this today.

You: Yes, on June 1st, May will be a past bill, and that will be over 10%.

You: Correct?

You: Yes?

Gordon: your bill will be generated on 16th of May.

You: Ok

You: So, if my bill on the 16th May, shows over a 10% increase, I can cancel, correct?

Gordon: Yes

You: Ok Gordon, thankyou very much for your help. I apologise if I have kept you too long.

Gordon: Bye for now.

I was told originally I'd have to pay a £500 cancellation fee, obviously not.

Sounds like he knew I'd be coming back

dasyad · 12 May 2010 at 07:04

I'm massively confused now. I thought that you are now unable to cancel because they're no longer implementing a change but rather just enforcing the FUP that has always been there :confused:

ps3ud0 · 12 May 2010 at 07:54

Robboftw said:
Ok.

I have just spent an hour talking to the "Team Leader" of the Vodafone online guys. He has confirmed that my bill will be generated on the 16th of May, and if it is over the 10%, I can cancel.

They seem to be able to get out of some of the other clauses, so if you are planning on cancelling, make sure you rack up over 600MB as soon as possible.

End of the discussion with "Gordon" -

I was told originally I'd have to pay a £500 cancellation fee, obviously not.

Sounds like he knew I'd be coming back

I think he's sold you a load of cobblers as unless VF have a crystal ball and bill customers in advance of data overuse your May 16th bill will only show you advanced charging for your service charges (line rental and any charged monthly bundles) and any data (over)use will relate to the period up until the 16th May.

That's before even considering that it hasn't been officially announced (do we have exact details how overuse will be charged - by a new advanced bundle or by individual data overuse [£x.xx per xMB]?)

ps3ud0 :cool: