Used Bentley, Aston, Maserati and the like

[Spamalot]

Firstly I’m not buying one for a good few years, I’ve only just upgraded to my Boxster S, it's more out of interest. Secondly I know the price on the windscreen isn’t the thing you need to worry about with a cars like these.

Start Thread-

I’ve been looking into what I’ve now started to call “Supercheapcars” for later in life. It’s something that I’ve noticed in the past and was bought to the forefront of my mind by the V8 Vantage thread. There is some serious, and to be honest quite modern kit out there that can be picked up for less than the new cost of a decent spec'd 5 series.

Some of them that I’ve been looking at-

• 2003 Bentley Continental GT, c. £40k
• 2004 Aston V8 Vantage, c. £40k
• 2005 Maserati Quattroporte V8, c. £25k​

I know running any of them is a good example of “if you have to ask you can’t afford it” but just how expensive are these things to run? Servicing at specialists isn’t out of this world, it’s consumables that could hurt, but just how much?

I do however know that there are things that could go wrong and bankrupt a small country (not Iceland, a Micra needing a new tyre could do that). Are there water tight warranties that could help protect against this sort of thing?

The Bentley is of particular interest, would I be naive in thinking that as it’s VW made that it would be reliable and easier on the pocket. It’s just a W12 Phaeton in drag after all , they could do 300k miles without even getting hot.

And again, no I can’t afford one now, to buy or run, but it could be possible in the not too distant future (before I’m 30 with a lot of luck) so would like to know just how feasible it is. It’s the £400 tax a year that’s really holding me back

 

[[TW]Fox]

I have been doing a lot of research into V8 Vantage costs lately (and therefore find this an interesting thread!) and so far I've managed to work out that the major cost is routine servicing which seems to work out at about a grand a year. This is excluding tyres, which are circa £800 a set, and excluding brakes etc and also excluding any mechanical failure.

The problem you get is that well reknowned, competent and decent independent specialists for cars like this are not massively cheaper than main dealers - after all, quality labour does not come cheap - and if you use any old place to service them you will rub thousands and thousands off the value of the car because most people buying this sort of car simply wont entertain the idea of a car with a less than pristine service record.

I get the impression that pretty much anything associated with cars like this is on the big side of epic. I don't think there is such a thing as cheap anything.

Which is why cars like the 911 sell so well - even the 911 has big running costs but compared with stuff like this its so down to earth and reasonable...

 

[hurfdurf]

• 2005 Maserati Quattroporte V8, c. £25k[/INDENT]

The running costs and reliability of these are obscene for a car that can be purchased at this kind of price.

 

[DM]

Depending which service is required and if you use a main dealer the Bentley will cost between 1k-2.5k per service.

They eat tyres and occasionally go wrong, nothing is cheap.

 

[daz]

At that age you're almost right at the bottom of the depreciation curve for a number of reasons.

1) Reliability - older cars are more likely to go wrong
2) Cost of repairs - out of warranty repairs on mechanical failures that would normally be covered
3) Cost of consumables - even what might be considered normal consumables cost significantly more than other cars
4) If you intend to sell on in the future, you should use main dealer. Nobody wants to buy an Aston that's been serviced at Fred's Garage (no dis-respect to Fred).

The cost of owning this type of car in this age bracket can be more than leasing new or buying nearly new, which is what puts a lot of people off.

A lot of these types of cars also get owned for 6 - 18 months, so can have quite a few owners when you're thinking about buying a 2004 car.
So whilst I'd love my next car to be a £40k F360 or something crazy like that, I think I will chicken out and go for a much newer Cayman S.

 

[Dr House]

I have been doing a lot of research into V8 Vantage costs lately (and therefore find this an interesting thread!) and so far I've managed to work out that the major cost is routine servicing which seems to work out at about a grand a year. This is excluding tyres, which are circa £800 a set, and excluding brakes etc and also excluding any mechanical failure.

Could you tell me a little more, what would you look out for if you where looking for a V8 Vantage?

I did a bit of reading and from the sounds of it that running costs are only going to be a few K per year more then a 335i.

 

[MeEsH BaKkA]

My dad has a 3 yr old continental gtc and I has had quite a few problems which were: boost pipe from one of the turbos split, the roof stopped going down due to a flap by the rear seats not opening properly, the boot open button stopped working (according to bently a common problem), condensation in the headlights (around a grand for a new set), the boot stopped opening due to a mechanical problem, passenger side massage unit packed up, erm... I think that's it.

Had the car not been under warranty which £40k one would not be then you could probably buy a new small hatch for the costs involved in fixing problems like this. I think my dad has been rather unlucky with his but all it takes is something like a turbo to fail or roof to pack up and I would be crying time.

On the plus side every time the car goes into bently it gets a "bath" their words lol and from what my dad says they do a great job of cleaning my brother and sisters mess out of the back.

 

[Spamalot]

Had the car not been under warranty which £40k one would not be then you could probably buy a new small hatch for the costs involved in fixing problems like this. I think my dad has been rather unlucky with his but all it takes is something like a turbo to fail or roof to pack up and I would be crying time.

I think driving a Corsa would make me cry more. Thanks for the post, it's good to hear someones first-hand (sort of) experiance.

 

[Joshy]

I'm an apprentice tech a J.B Bentley, so I'll try my best to help you out on the GT front .

The question of running an early GT is actually a very interesting one to me. At first I wanted to scream "Don't do it unless it has an Approved Warranty!!!", but after a little bit more thought I started to wonder if it could actually be done out of warranty.

Mechanically they seem to be extremely strong and very, very rarely go wrong (the guy I work with does the majority of engine out jobs says he's only had to change a single engine for a mechanical fault since the cars came out 6/7 years ago).

I will say almost certainly that if you have a problem, it'll be electrical - Occasionally they'll develop annoying little intermittent faults that are hard (sometimes even impossible) to track down. It's not exactly common, but then again it is not completely unknown either. There is also a scary amount of electronic control units fitted to these cars, and again occasionally they'll throw up some faults and will need to be replaced, and these aren't even remotely cheap, plus they'll probably need to be coded to the car with a VAS computer, and that is something that you may struggle to find at even non Franchised Bentley "Specialists".

Oh, and the batteries (specifically the main one) drain at an alarming rate. If you're not going to use the car daily please make sure that you are able to put a battery conditioner on it. The battery going flat can cause a number of issues which will require at least an hour's labour at your local franchised service centre to sort out.

And please understand that the potential for big bills is nothing short of ridiculous. Engine light on? 02 sensor need replacing? That can't be that bad surely? Many people consider 02 sensors to be a "consumable item", so surely bentley have put it in a sensible, easy to reach place? No. The engine HAS TO be removed, for one sensor. Actually, there are few a few sensors/pipes/other stuff that SHOULD BE easy to replace but isn't, that has been put in a place that is impossible to access whilst the engine is in the car. It is not uncommon for some guys to spend a 8+ hours removing an engine, spend a few minutes removing, testing and replacing a dodgy sensor and then spending another 8 hours+ (actually, a bit more than that as 4 wheel alignment is required) putting the engine back .

From what I understand as DiamondMark said, servicing runs from around £1,000 for a basic service consisting of Oil (Mobil 1 0W-40), filter, Screen wash, Wipers, pollen filters. I believe 2.5k is the around the figure for a 'Hydraulic Service' which is the above plus brake hoses and air filters (possibly Spark plugs as well, Although I'll have to double check - I've only done one once). I'll probably get fired for saying this, but you could probably get away with servicing outside the dealer network. Hell, you could just about every single service bar the hydraulic one (which does require a ramp, a lot of patients and a love of getting covered in brake fluid ) at the road side if you were inclined, none of it is rocket science. It'd probably hurt resale values though.

Oh, and If you do buy an early one, for the love of sweet god make sure it has had the coil recall. Let's just say early cars had a little bit of an issue .

I've probably made them out to seem like the worst cars in the world, but really, they aren't. They are excellent cars, but as you expect for something that cost well in excess of £100,000 less than 7 years ago, they can cost quite a bit to run. If you do end up with one though, I'll be glad to help you in any way I can .

My dad has a 3 yr old continental gtc

Outta sheer interest, what dealer does your dad take his car to?

By the way, did you buy the new headlights in the end? Crewe have told us time and again that the condensation in the headlights was "normal" .

 

[[TW]Fox]

Mechanically they seem to be extremely strong and very, very rarely go wrong (the guy I work with does the majority of engine out jobs says he's only had to change a single engine for a mechanical fault since the cars came out 6/7 years ago).

You don't really know, do you? Your story changes constantly. Only a few months ago this is what you were saying about the engine in the Conti:

I have my doubts that a W12 powered car would make it ANYWHERE near that sort of mileage... I always hoped that Bentley would try and shove the V10 diesel into something, ideal powerplant for one.

I'm not too clued up on how much the Conti GT W12 differs from the Phaeton W12, but I've come across more than one W12 engines with "just" 40,000ish with rather bad top end taps. Certainly bad enough to make me question if it'll last another 40,000...

Every time you are in a thread telling us you work for Bentley as if it means we should trust what you say, its always accompanied by contradiction

I think you should absorb more knowledge from your colleagues before you pass it on, that way you don't end up contradicting yourself and potentially misleading people who might 100% trust what you say because of where you work

 

[Participant]

I'm an apprentice tech a J.B Bentley

How long have you been an apprenctice for Joshy?

 

[Joshy]

You don't really know, do you? Your story changes constantly. Only a few months ago this is what you were saying about the engine in the Conti:





Every time you are in a thread telling us you work for Bentley as if it means we should trust what you say, its always accompanied by contradiction

I think you should absorb more knowledge from your colleagues before you pass it on, that way you don't end up contradicting yourself and potentially misleading people who might 100% trust what you say because of where you work

Seriously fox, you are starting to wind me up with this crap. As I've said about a billion times before, an armchair used car "expert" is in absoultely no position to take such a patronising tone, especially on a Brand that you've proven in the past to know bugger all about.

They are mechanically strong engines, no ifs, no buts. I am wary that they'll all be able to do a billion miles like the Phanton in that old thread, but right here and right now we have very, very few mechanical issues.

As for the "Won't Last 80,000 miles" comment I overacted. Shock Horror .

If you're going to fight me on MY brand, get clued up and try to argue some real points. If all you're going to quote old posts and try to use my experience against as if working for the largest and most prestigious Bentley Dealership in the entire world is some sort disadvantage then you can **** off.

How long have you been an apprenctice for Joshy?

2 years dude.

 

[Fr0dders]

If you're going to fight me on MY brand, get clued up and try to argue some real points. If all you're going to quote old posts and try to use my experience against as if working for the largest and most prestigious Bentley Dealership in the entire world is some sort disadvantage then you can **** off.

mate your an apprentice. Not some master technician with 20 years of experience. I bet they love you at work as you come across as a cocky know it all little thing over the internet.

 

[[TW]Fox]

Seriously fox, you are starting to wind me up with this crap.

Stop contradicting yourself in every post you make on the subject then. You post all sorts of utterly random things and back them up with 'I'm a Tech! I cant be wrong'. I'm not the only one to have noticed this.

That post wasn't an exaggeration at all, you were very clear with what you meant. It's only suddenly an exaggeration now you've been pulled up for saying the opposite not 2 months later!

If you're going to fight me on MY brand...

...working for the largest and most prestigious Bentley Dealership in the entire world

I think that sums up my point quite nicely.

 

[Joshy]

mate your an apprentice. Not some master technician with 20 years of experience. I bet they love you at work as you come across as a cocky know it all little thing over the internet.

I don't think I'm coming off as a "know it all". I'm simply trying to defend myself against a man that for whatever reason takes every single opportunity he can to belittle me, my job and my trade.

Of course I know I'm apprentice and of course I understand that in the grand scheme of things, I know very, very little. But the important thing here is that I know more than Fox, which is why I get particularly annoyed at his smarmy, patronising comments.

 

[[TW]Fox]

But the important thing here is that I know more than Fox

I think the other important thing is that I'm not attempting to pass myself off as an expert on Bentley. You, on the other hand, are.

If you didn't keep contradicting yourself and coming out with bizarre things, there wouldn't be anything to pick up on and these little debates wouldnt begin in the first place, would they?

 

[Joshy]

Stop contradicting yourself in every post you make on the subject then. You post all sorts of utterly random things and back them up with 'I'm a Tech! I cant be wrong'. I'm not the only one to have noticed this.

What "utterly random things" things are we talking about exactly Fox? You mean like the tyre wear issue, where you decided to fight me for god knows how many pages, and only then sat down and shut up after other people with real experience with Bentleys came out of the woodwork and backed me up? That was the only time I've really mentioned by job.

I never use "I'm a Tech" as a justification because I am not one. I am however someone who works closely with these cars, can ask questions and can make causal observations.

I think that sums up my point quite nicely.

Err, in what way exactly?

I'm very, very proud of my Company and the cars that we sell & maintain. Is that a bad thing in the land of fantastic Mr. Fox?

 

[[TW]Fox]

I'm not going to sit here and list all the times where you've said something bizarre and then followed it up with 'I work for Bentley' as if to suggest we shouldnt dare question you - from the difference between running rich and running lean to the blanket statement that 'tyre wear is not related to which wheels are driven' to 'Many W12's wont last more than another 40k' which then changed to 'They are really really reliable', etc etc because not only would I be here all day but it wouldnt serve any real purpose and would further derail the thread.

It's clearly not just me, others have noticed it - every time you back up what you are saying with 'I work for Bentley!' it's as if you are implying we shouldnt dare question you.

If you were doing none of this then we'd not be having this conversation and MrLOL wouldnt also have picked up on it.

Don't take it to heart - just dont keep implying we should beleive everything you say because you work for Bentley. It's like a massive competition with you, as clearly evident by the fact that twice in this thread you've pointed out that you 'know more than Fox' as if it unlocks some Xbox live acheivement or something.

The one thing I am keen to never, ever do on here is attempt to quantify my level of knowledge or claim to know more about a given subject than anyone else. It gets people backs up and leaves your face covered in egg when you make a mistake.

Just post your opinions, and leave it at that. Don't qualify them with statements unless they really DO qualify them and don't claim levels of knowledge.

And don't go off in the deep end about subjects you don't fully understand - realise that there is nothing wrong with not getting something. I'm often utterly lost in some threads, so I just take a step back when I don't know about something.

 

[teaboy5]

..

 

[iaind]

I'd probably consider myself an outsider in this, I know sweet FA about bentlys and I've had a fair share of "heated discussions" with you both..... But I have to admit, I've noticed the randomness that Fox is talking about