100hz v 50hz?

Soldato
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which is better value overall?

obviously 100hz on lcd is better but more expensive and is more than 50hz really needed as i have a 50hz non-1080 tv at home and haven't really noticed a lack of anything!? :confused:

or is a 600hz plasma better for the bigger(32"+) screen better?
 
its down to your eyes...no one can tell you one is better than the other bc it all depends on you and how fast your eyes react to light changes.

some people say 100mhz gives ghostings others dont, and the same with 50hz.
100hz also creates a fair bit of detail loss due to it effectively being upconverted.

its your choice, go test and see what works better, the tv that doesnt give you a headache after 30 mins is the one to go for lol.

and finally remember the first rule of tv buying - just bc the numbers are bigger doesnt always mean its better
 
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I don't think 3d tv sets use the 120Hz method of displaying it, they use passive glasses instead, so they run at 60Hz. I've got a 120Hz monitor, its great for gaming, but i can't say i notice a difference when i use it for watching movies or tv. So i can't imagine the non native 100Hz tv's will make much of a difference.
 
utter tripe ... if you watch sports you can clearly see the dif between 50 and 100 hz ,

my local biddings has loads of tv .. and the cheapo one shows judder central with footy.
 
100hz for me is a load of rubbish. i dont think its true 100hz as you can easily see weird effects around the moving object. if it was true 100hz this effect would not exist and you would have a perfect picture so basically its 50hz with an inserted mid frame. They are trying to solve the motion problem but creating a whole new problem.. fail.
 
thanks for answers. prompted me to refine my research even further and it seems for the 'most' part the human eye cannot detect more than 50fps. 60fps at a push and the 100hz ones just insert a repeat of the previous frame so its not 'true' 100hz. the LED 240hz put in 3 fake frames too so they're not true 240.
 
100hz for me is a load of rubbish. i dont think its true 100hz as you can easily see weird effects around the moving object. if it was true 100hz this effect would not exist and you would have a perfect picture so basically its 50hz with an inserted mid frame. They are trying to solve the motion problem but creating a whole new problem.. fail.

Couldn't have said it better myself. I find all these 'motion enhancers' make the picture worse and in a lot of circumstances distract from the image cinematics.
 
utter tripe ... if you watch sports you can clearly see the dif between 50 and 100 hz ,

my local biddings has loads of tv .. and the cheapo one shows judder central with footy.

Thats just chep LCDs for you.....

Inserting a black frame into an image doesnt stop it juddering, it may fool your eyes into it looking smoother but on sport 100hz usually looks shocking.

It is purely image processing and utterly rubbish, plasmas only have it to match LCD tick boxes as most people buy goods on spec sheets. Its pretty funny they go up to 600hz, just a mickey take at LCDs really.
 
thanks for answers. prompted me to refine my research even further and it seems for the 'most' part the human eye cannot detect more than 50fps. 60fps at a push and the 100hz ones just insert a repeat of the previous frame so its not 'true' 100hz. the LED 240hz put in 3 fake frames too so they're not true 240.

I've been shown a test of 60fps vs 250fps and you could easily pick out which one was which every time. The human eye can see much faster rates than 50fps happily.
 
its also worth bearing in mind that "refresh rate" has no meaningfull use in LCD / Plasma screen technology since the screen isnt refreshed.

In the old days of CRT sets, the picture was drawn in a line down the screen, by a gun, higher refresh rate meant the gun went faster.

However modern LCDs just have a pixel which will stay the same colour all day long if you put the correct current through it.

The only real relevant term is frames per second, since thats whats actually happenning. However tv and movies arent shot at higher than 50 frames per second, so the 100hz, 240hz etc.. technology is just adding artificially generated frames.

Some of the newer sets do a very good job of this. the latest sony motionflow pro is very good for example and does actually improve the quality.

But ithe issue not so much about whether the human eye can see the difference between 50 fps or 250 fps, but whether the artificially generated 250fps picture is actually better than the original 50 fps picture the processing engine started with.
 
thanks for answers. prompted me to refine my research even further and it seems for the 'most' part the human eye cannot detect more than 50fps. 60fps at a push and the 100hz ones just insert a repeat of the previous frame so its not 'true' 100hz. the LED 240hz put in 3 fake frames too so they're not true 240.

theres no "true" 240.

Its just various different ways of willy waving technology to artificially generate frames and improve the picture.

My advice ? head to the sony store with a bluray and ask for a demo on one of the sets with motionflow, then have a demo on the same set without

make your own mind up whether its worth it or not.

Same goes with the panasonic store with their plasmas. See for yourself.
 
Also the main factor with any processing isn't the 'speed' but the algorithms used..

There is a world of difference between any manufacturers 100/200/120/240Hz processing.

In the past, with CRT's, the phosphors where designed to decay at a specific rate, not too quickly or you see too much 'flicker', and not too slowly as you see 'smearing' of fast moving objects. 100Hz came about, as it allowed faster decaying phosphors to be used, to ensure good motion detail, but where refreshed twice as quickly to reduce flicker. The other effect was that generally the 100Hz was achieved in the digital domain, so 'processing' was also done at the same time, all in an attempt to clean up the image, interpolate between frames to try and improve motion artefacts in the source, and add any number of other filters.

As Mr LOL points out, LCD especially does not need refreshing, so 100Hz/120Hz is largely all about the artificial processing of the image, 100Hz is a nice speed, because it allows an nice easy single 'inter-frame' to be created to allow smoother transistions of fast moving objects in the slower incoming 50Hz source material. However, this is all highly dependant on manufacturer. Toshiba and Sony pretty much have always provided some of the cleanest processing around (in general), Panasonic and Pioneer have also been notably good.

Of course, what most of it is there for is for 'films' which are filmed at 24fps/Hz, which doesn't fit well with the standard 50/60Hz video systems of various countries. 24Hz does produce noticeable stutter from being a low frame rate, and also, if it's encoded in to a standard 50/60Hz video stream, you get this periodic judder because 24 doesn't divide into 50 or 60 cleanly.. However if you multiply 24 * 5, you get 120Hz, which is also double 60 Hz (another popular frequency), hence why 120Hz sets have become more prevalent. To reduce the periodic judder, things like 3:2 and 5:5 pulldown (essentially just repeating frames over and over again), but you are still left with the natural motion stutter from 24Hz being so low.. This is where the fancy motion interpolation comes in, and again different manufacturers use different techniques. To do it right, a lot of processing needs to occur, and making this unobtrusive, and 'clean' is where it's at, notably Toshiba and Sony always seem to be good at this, Panasonic/Pioneer are also notably good, others tend to over process and create more artefacts then it needs to.

Recently, they found with LCD sets, that inserting a black frame between others, and doing this at higher rates (240Hz) etc fools the eye into more naturally motion smoothing, ironically, this is essentially mimicking phosphor delay, and one reason judder was less apparant on CRT's..

Plasma 600Hz is simply a high rate dark frame interpolation effect, it's refreshed at a high rate, it's a more natural way to reduce motion stutter without processing, of course, you really do need processing to really smooth it out, which is certainly not done at 600hz (there is no point).

So, as Mr LOL says, you really want to demo stuff yourself, and don't assume one mans 120Hz is the same accross the board, or that 240/600 is better because it's a higher number.

Some of the most overdone processing comes from Samsung, especially on their lower end 100/120Hz stuff, lots of edge enhancing and 'pop' added, but it's highly artificial, and certainly not my cup of tea, their higher end stuff is better, but IMO not as advanced as Sony, and not as artefact free as Toshiba (I used to work for Tosh.)
 
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