GTX460 or 470

vorticalspace · 13 Sep 2010 at 17:45

Marine-RX179 said:
Will your itch kill you before the launch of the 6850?

No, but the wife is giving me a wide berth

Razor Time · 13 Sep 2010 at 18:04

Get a 1080p display.

mikeo · 13 Sep 2010 at 18:20

I agree. Get a new screen first.

I've just upgraded from a 260 GTX, to an MSI 460 GTX HAWK. But only because I had that infamous "itch" to do so. Not because I thought it would give me a good bump in games (which in most cases it wont make a damn) and I'm already on a 24in (and size matters as they say).

My view on the 460/470 debate and I've just gone through all this. Is that the 460 (especially the MSI HAWK edition) will easily OC to 470 stock performance without the heat and noise issues.
EG. at 850MHz on the core, after 30mins OCCT it hits 69C (case closed) and that's at approx 78% fan speed. Fair enough you can hear the fan at that point but it's certainly not like my mates 470 running OCCT at stock! That sounds like a bloody jet engine! and reaches well into the 90C+. Pass that fire extinguisher please!

At the end of the day. You pays your money and takes your chances (as they say).

Ivyforce · 13 Sep 2010 at 18:30

this heat issue is strange
I got msi 470 at stock

either gaming or folding it dosnt go above 80 for me, even after 3 days of solid folding highest was 78, fan does not seem that noisy to me yet.

mikeo · 13 Sep 2010 at 18:35

Ivyforce said:
this heat issue is strange
I got msi 470 at stock

either gaming or folding it dosnt go above 80 for me, even after 3 days of solid folding highest was 78, fan does not seem that noisy to me yet.

Try running OCCT for 30 minutes and then post your temps. Better have that fire extinguisher ready that I mentioned!

Very much depends on what you are running.
EG. in game, my card is usually mid to low 50C!

Scougar · 13 Sep 2010 at 18:53

Wife giving it the OK? Then tell her you will get a new card as new one's are coming out very soon, and you'll pick up a better deal then.

evoyear · 13 Sep 2010 at 18:54

for you resolution i think 460 is well enough

vorticalspace · 13 Sep 2010 at 18:55

As stated, I have considered the monitor & may well upgrade but as a new GPU is out of sight, its out of mind

A new 24" monitor might be noticed

if you know what I mean

I suppose I could always camouflage it but I don't want to rock the boat too much, especially with this itch!!!

Scougar · 13 Sep 2010 at 19:19

Dont want to interfere and have been shot before for saying this, but honesty is best policy. moving on...

New screen is sooo much better than a new card. However, it will really show up the weaknesses in your card at high res. Btw i play with a single 260 and its just dandy for me at 1920*1200 in most games. I would love a top line card but defo is not needed at present.

If you have to, 470, or wait. or consider a 5850, but driver wise the 470 should slot right in without issue :-)

fluffmyster · 13 Sep 2010 at 19:23

I understand you probably want a new card more but the monitor would be a better treat imo. I have a GTX 260 216 @ 730/1460/1200 and a 24" monitor at 1920x1200. The monitor is lovely and tbh my card still runs Crysis, GTA4, Bad Company 2 and Metro 2033 at high at that resolution. Sure it's at it's limits now but around 1680 or 1920 is where you would want to upgrade your card. And for that I would go for the GTX 470 for that bit more muscle and good overclocking.

P.S. I used to run 750/1500/1200 but my shaders aren't quite stable that high. Since you run your shaders around the same speed have you tried unlinking your core and pushing it a bit higher like I did?

Marine-RX179 · 13 Sep 2010 at 19:33

mikeo said:
My view on the 460/470 debate and I've just gone through all this. Is that the 460 (especially the MSI HAWK edition) will easily OC to 470 stock performance without the heat and noise issues.
EG. at 850MHz on the core, after 30mins OCCT it hits 69C (case closed) and that's at approx 78% fan speed. Fair enough you can hear the fan at that point but it's certainly not like my mates 470 running OCCT at stock! That sounds like a bloody jet engine! and reaches well into the 90C+. Pass that fire extinguisher please!.

Speed wise the gap is roughly around GTX460 1GB+10%=5850, and 5850+10%=GTX470. Considering that a GTX460 1GB roughly need 800MHz (675MHz+125MHz) to match 5850, to match the GTX470 the GTX460 1GB would need roughly 925MHz (800MHz+125MHz).

So basically the MSI GTX460 1GB HAWK only got around 75MHz left for overclock at best (1,000MHz), whereas the GTX470 still got average of 200-250MHz of overclock headroom left (607MHz to 800~850MHz) and the speed gain per clock is greater than that of the overclock on the GTX460. As the price difference of as little as £20, people would mostly rather have a faster card than a lower temp card. According to the owners of GTX470, in real world gaming (not talking about benchmarking) the GTX470 would only reach average in the 80C ish at the highest. It's not like those temp are gonna kill the card.

atmax1 · 13 Sep 2010 at 19:51

at that res a cheap 460 will do, but I would say new monitor then a 470 or something.

vorticalspace · 13 Sep 2010 at 20:37

Thanks guys...
You've just made my decision a lot harder :rolleyes:

ok, whats the deal with a new monitor. :confused:

What will a 24" monitor give me over my 19" screen other than poorer fps, less room etc.

Is the sense of immersion in games dramatically increased with a bigger screen or is it simply a case of 19" is so yesterday!!

mikeo · 13 Sep 2010 at 21:29

A decent wide screen monitor will in games (well ones that support it) give you a bigger / wider FOV (Field Of View). So "yes" it will (in my opinion) improve your gaming experience. It's certainly been the best PC purchase I've made this year.

And depending on your game, it should run fine on your 260 GTX. Well all the stuff I've been playing recently has been fine. Bare in mind that a lot of games these days are cross platform releases and to a certain extent are dragged down by the lowest common denominator and that is the Xbox-360 (out what? the best part of 5 years now). Don't start me off on what a let down Supreme Commander 2 has been (both in complexity and graphically). Fair enough I'm sure there are some games you may have to tweak the graphical settings for, but it certainly wont make anything unplayable, or pig ugly.

Up to you in the end. But buy a decent 24in monitor and you should get a fair few years use out of it. Compared to how long for a graphics card? And as the first gen DX11 cards don't "do" DX11 that great (only my opinion... not like there's many DX11 games out there anyway). So sensible thing is buy new monitor now and bide your time and see what the next gen of graphics cards looks like.

Mind you. Who am I to talk! I've just chopped my 260 GTX for a MSI 460 GTX HAWK. But then again, it is my birthday soon and no pockets in a shroud.

vorticalspace · 13 Sep 2010 at 21:42

mikeo said:
Mind you. Who am I to talk! I've just chopped my 260 GTX for a MSI 460 GTX HAWK. But then again, it is my birthday soon and no pockets in a shroud.

LOL

like your style!!
"Regret the things you've done in life, not the things you haven't"

I think I might push the boat out here:-
What do you reckon to this monitor:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-046-DE&groupid=17&catid=1425&subcat=

I know it is a good quality IPS panel but at 1920 x 1080, is it preferable to go 24" or bigger.

I would dearly like this:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-036-DE&groupid=17&catid=510&subcat=

But I just might be able to get the 23" dispaly & the GTX470

Rroff · 13 Sep 2010 at 21:45

I run 2048x1152 on a 23" display and its no problem.

vorticalspace · 13 Sep 2010 at 21:49

Rroff said:
I run 2048x1152 on a 23" display and its no problem.

Custom res?

Are games on a 1080P monitor full screen, i.e no black bars
I was under the impression that 1920 x 1200 is a std PC resolution?

mikeo · 13 Sep 2010 at 21:53

Both nice monitors. But any particular reason you want an IPS screen? Pretty expensive considering there are plenty of nice TN panels these days. Fair enough nice colours etc. But response rates not as good as TN panels. Though not sure the difference between 2ms and 6/8ms is maybe that great in reality. Not owned an IPS type screen so maybe not the best person to ask. I bought an Iiyama ProLite B2409HDS a couple of months back and think it's a great general purpose monitor. Certainly great in games. I would suggest having a look at a few reviews and maybe poking around in the monitor section of this forum.

Good luck. Let us know what you decide.

PS. "Regret the things you've done in life, not the things you haven't" ... indeed.

mikeo · 13 Sep 2010 at 21:56

vorticalspace said:
Custom res?

Are games on a 1080P monitor full screen, i.e no black bars
I was under the impression that 1920 x 1200 is a std PC resolution?

1920x1080 is supported in most (if not all) modern games. So no black bars.

Though the debate rages over which resolution is better
IE. 1920x1200 or 1920x1080

Marine-RX179 · 13 Sep 2010 at 21:56

vorticalspace said:
LOL
like your style!!
"Regret the things you've done in life, not the things you haven't"

I think I might push the boat out here:-
What do you reckon to this monitor:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-046-DE&groupid=17&catid=1425&subcat=

I know it is a good quality IPS panel but at 1920 x 1080, is it preferable to go 24" or bigger.

I would dearly like this:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-036-DE&groupid=17&catid=510&subcat=

But I just might be able to get the 23" dispaly & the GTX470

How about something decent but reasonably priced?

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-034-BQ&groupid=17&catid=949&subcat=
Personally I'd rather have a 1080p on 21.5" than 23" monitor, and at half the price lol.