Has Britain gone soft

I presume the government has a solution to the 10 000s of workers it will put on the unemployment roll. Great to hear about all the cuts but where are the jobs going to come from? Didn't labour just copy the banks ie the banks lent money on the basis of their predicted income from loans which failed to materialise. Doesn't the government in most advanced economic countries do the same thing?

We expect to get X amounts of taxation therefore we can spend y on spending? Did labour really overspend or (like the banks) wasn't it also a victim of the financial crash?

Anyway my main topic was to guage reaction to the recent strikes in France and to ask why in the UK the same thing isn't happening?

Or perhaps when these proposed cuts start to bite (ie mass unemployment with 0 job prospects for 10 000s of UK civil servants) perhaps we shall see more of a reaction.

What do you think?
 
Efour2 said:
Thatcher culled our unions and the average British Joe on the street roles over like a submissive dog.

Its quite a weird one to strike over but im sure that it will cause some concessions
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+1

She sold the population of Britain on the merits of their pocket rather than maintain their society.

And spending from that collective pocket has led us to mortgaging our grandchildren's future :(
 
Much as we have the right to protest in this country,its been so knocked out of the British people over the years they just roll over and take what ever the government tell them to take.People might moan into their beer in the pub but thats as far as it goes.
Miners strike?
Poll tax riots?
We will never see anything like that again in this country.If the government announced tomorrow that British workers had to work until they died,and had to pay 90% tax,there would still not be rioting in the streets,just whining on forums and in pubs.
 
There will be mass protests and rolling strikes here just like the French are experiencing this week but the time isn't quite right yet (the review isn't until tommorrow).

It's coming though, and it'll make the French protests look like a kindergartens day out.

the average British Joe on the street roles over like a submissive dog.
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Glad I'm not average Joe!

We will never see anything like that again in this country.
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Yes we will, and soon. The planning for it is already at a very advanced stage.


BRB, there's a man at the door in a dark suit and sunglasses (it's October ffs!).
 
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Not having a go at anyone here, but the following quotes touched on something I think most ordinary people have a great deal of trouble getting their head round:

Zefan said:
No, we just have the common sense to realise that it's our fault as well.
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Not my fault; had a job and no debt until the recession. Had savings too - had being the operative word here - spent it all to make ends meet.

SiriusB said:
All strikes do is make things worse for everyone. What's the point? We squandered money and now we have to make cuts. It's not much fun, no one likes it and striking about it wont make one sodding bit of difference.
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Sorry, but what's all of this 'we' business? Unless you're a labour MP or a banker, 'we' had FA do do with most of the financial trouble.

There's a deep well of ire yet to be plumbed when politicians and the like start harping on about how 'we're all in it together' - the implication is that there's some kind of shared responsibility and therefore, accountability and obligation.

I don't recall being asked about any of the issues and decisions made on fiscal policy (yes I know :rolleyes: ). But after making decisions of our behalf, then stuffing it up so badly, it's a trifle galling to only now be invited to the party when the cheque needs signing.
The reality is that most (if not all) politicians currently see voters as batteries for the economy.

Personally I find it rankles to the highest degree to have everything I have worked for in the last 10 years get sucked up into something that had nothing to do with the way I earned and spent/saved my money. The longer term ramifications put added pressure to my personal life, causing an already difficult situation to collapse into ruin.
It's not just the economy that is ******, it's peoples lives that have suffered as a result of avaricious banking practices and weak spined politicians, both of whom seem to think growth and exponential profit are the only way forward.
Whatever happened to sustainability?

Would striking help? Most likely not. But I do think the folk who run this country need a timely reminder that they have to answer to us. Making decisions about austerity is all very well and good from a position where the effects have no real meaning.
There's nothing like torches and pitchforks and an angry mob to bring into focus the duty of our elected leaders and how out of touch they are. They have proved that they are not to be trusted with the job of governance, time and again, with lies and corruption at every level of policy and law, yet they cannot see the conflict of interest in voting on your own pay and expenses - such things deemed to be a right, nay a privilege not sanctioned for you lesser mortals.
The whole business sickens me. Voting is out as a way to elicit change - one politician/party is much the same as another - so something else has to give. Trouble is they're not afraid of being crass and specious in office; perhaps a dose of civil unrest would convince westminster to take us seriously for a change.

:o :(
 
Would striking help? Most likely not. But I do think the folk who run this country need a timely reminder that they have to answer to us
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Nail on head.

The protests (those in France and those about to hit the UK) aren't about getting governments to reverse decisions they've already made and are committed to but rather make them think twice about the decisions they have yet to make.
 
amigafan2003 said:
Nail on head.

The protests (those in France and those about to hit the UK) aren't about getting governments to reverse decisions they've already made and are committed to but rather make them think twice about the decisions they have yet to make.
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the protests are about raising the retirement age from 60 to 62. There is no thinking to be done on the matter.
 
jumpy said:
Sorry, but what's all of this 'we' business? Unless you're a labour MP or a banker, 'we' had FA do do with most of the financial trouble.
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So you saved up plenty of money over the last 10 years as the going got good. You didn't splash out on luxuries, go out drinking, use credit cards or take out loans, get a big mortgage for an even bigger house, etc. ?

And by 'you' I mean the great british public.

Of course 'we' are also to blame. Unfortunately, protests etc. only come along when 'we' feel hard done by and not when we're living it up.

'we' are a credit society and have become more so year after year.

'we' believe we should have everything cheaper, yet be paid more.

'we' believe that we should be entitled to go to university, get a well-paid graduate job straight after and afford a nice house, whilst not paying too much tax to the government.

Sure, 'they' didn't manage it well at all (and not just the outgoing 'they') but it's definitely the fault of 'we' the people as well.

I realise you likely won't agree, because 'we' can't do anything wrong - we're always hard done by - after all, 'we' keep getting shafted in costs on basic necessities like petrol, to drive the 3 miles in our 4x4. Or tax on alcohol. Or cigarettes. etc.

By all means, protest the government (who 'we' just voted into power). Just ask yourself what will happen after that.

After all, if they take on board everything 'we' want - listen to 'our' advice - everything will be fine, won't it.

:rolleyes:
 
The deficit will not be cut for a long long time. All these cuts are not going to do anything to reduce it!

Thousands of people are loosing their jobs - public sector is getting shafted big time! This will cost the Gov in benefits which will only get worse with rising unemployment levels which means non of these people will be paying Tax/NI and will be costing the state.

Ontop of that, there is no job creation or any real industry in the UK.
 
Koalaboy, rolleyes aside, you have to see the problem when individuals behave in a responsible manner, yet still get shafted. Which is my main personal gripe with this whole economy/recession thing. I had a modest income and modest spending to match. I looked to the future with some savings, what good did that do me? I may as well have taken out as many loans and cards as possible and lived it up. 'Cause my conservative lifestyle (and I don't refer to any political affiliation here) reaped the same reward as those who are so firmly set on the path of the spendthrift.
Government is always banging on about personal responsibility and how you should not look to the state for support - the onus is on the individual to behave in a sensible manner (as far as is practically possible) - and yet when all is said and done, when the **** hits the fan, the same tired and empty words and phrases are trotted out: it is always 'WE' 'US' 'TOGETHER'.

Who offered credit? Credit as a source of future revenue which was then used as a means to determine value (of a company/bank) based entirely upon debt?
Who gave such a crazy idea sanction in the first place?

Banks and Governments. That there are fools easily parted with money they haven't earned yet is part of the problem - not only with 'the great british public' as you put it, but also the guys who run our financial industry.

Short term profit over long term sustainability, or 'boom & bust' as it is more colloquially known, is a financial ideology that rewards the few at the expense of the many. Why we still allow this to continue is quite beyond me.

Collectively, those who subscribed to credit they could not sustain are to blame, banks, governments and society at large. But I feel you are deliberately missing the point. I was not describing the collective; I was speaking of the individual who does not exceed their means, yet still has to watch as everything they have ascribed through prudence is reduced to nothing. At no point did I say things would be better if 'they' listened to 'our' demands, and whilst I can appreciate your allusion, sarcastic though it may be, that there really is no simple answer to all these troubles, that does not warrant blind faith in government, newly elected or otherwise.

For the record, my vote was spent on denying labour another term in office and only on denying labour another term in office. The sad irony is that I have always despised the idea of using your vote to ensure that the next strongest candidate has a chance at election solely on the merit of ousting the current incumbent. 'Voting by default' as it were seems a bastardisation of the whole voting process, within the rules, but not in the spirit of the rules, if you follow me (where have I heard that before :) ).
 
Rolleyes aside, I am very sympathetic with the individual who has done nothing to bring it upon themselves. In many respects, I've lived a very fortunate life in that I've never been near poverty. I've also never been wealthy.

Whilst I have used credit, bought luxuries, etc. I have always lived well within my means. Before our daughter was born, I constantly saw 'bonuses' given to those people with children... now, I see them being taken away from me, because I earn too much (despite paying more and more to the government to fund this).

I can't honestly say that previous labour goverment, or the conservative one before that, did anything in my interest - or if they did, without taking plenty away and setting me up for a later fall.

However, I appreciate the answer in my case is to leave the country for somewhere more agreeable, and in the future I will likely do just that.

I also see constant berating of the government as if everything was 'their' fault though, the main problem being "the government" isn't really a single entity. Most of the day-to-day actions aren't the brainchild of the muppets we see on TV.

Whilst protestation and a voice of dissent certainly needs to be put forward, it's not going to solve anything and will likely force the government to screw things even further.

I don't have any answers though. I think the country is shafted, has been heading in that direction for a long time, and isn't going to change any time soon.
 
Rise up Sheeple of Britain!

But Britains-Got-X-Factor-Strictly-Celebrity-Chef-Come-Get-Me-Out-of-Ant-And-Dec (On-ICE! and SUPER_HDDVDBLUETOOTHA-3D!!) is on soon...
 
Koalaboy -
ah, excuse the tone of my previous - I find an element of rage and a bulging of the eyes when I start thinking about this more seriously :o

That a seemingly like minded individual like yourself has an appreciation for emigration has to be indicative of some of the rot we were talking about being unavoidable and most probably unsolvable.

oh well, short of living elsewhere, my recommendation is to stock up on tinned food, water and ammunition now, before it's too late and/or expensive :p
 
doofer said:
Rise up Sheeple of Britain!

But Britains-Got-X-Factor-Strictly-Celebrity-Chef-Come-Get-Me-Out-of-Ant-And-Dec (On-ICE! and SUPER_HDDVDBLUETOOTHA-3D!!) is on soon...
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They only thing they’ll rise up to is to make another cup of tea in the ad break.
 
Uther said:
We will never see anything like that again in this country.If the government announced tomorrow that British workers had to work until they died,and had to pay 90% tax,there would still not be rioting in the streets,just whining on forums and in pubs.
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Lol!! Spot on:D. I am suprised that british people have become so docile in regard to protesting against government. But the way I see it there doesn't seem to be much spirit of nationhood among british people anymore. When going into different parts of uk such as scotland or wales, I always get the sense that people in those areas seem to strongly identify with the culture and custom of that particular region and aren't much concerned with the broader issues affecting other parts of the country.
 
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