**** Original Starcraft 2 Thread ****

Nick08 said:
I find PvZ by far the hardest match up (~1300 diamond). If you open 2/3 gate robo you will really struggle against a decent zerg IMO. Muta/ling really hard counters this build as soon as you expand. As soon as the zerg gets a decent amount of mutas you are ****ed. You need to get some reasonably early pressure out to stop them going macro crazy. People used to go 2 gate but this isn't as effective any more.

I prefer going 1 gate + early starport or start by walling them in with 2 pylons + a cannon (and a zealot by the pylons if you like) into fast expand. With the early starport, get 4 pheonixes out (1 more if it's going well) and use them to pick off queens/overlords (don't waste energy on drones too early imo). If they are going for a spire keep pumping pheonixes, if they go hydras (or if you just don't see a spire) get a robo bay out asap and start getting collosi and prepare for a mid game push. You can't let them scout this build with an early overlord. Get 2 stalkers out asap and spread pylons so you can deny it.

The key to beating zerg is harassment. You need to stop them pumping drones or they will always beat you. Terran have it a bit easier with drops + banshe play imo.

That or just 4 gate them :p
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lulz, 4 gating :p..

I've resisted protoss air for a while, but I think you're right. 3 gate robo only takes it so far, and with pheoenixes I can put on some serious mineral line harassment. (can you lift spine crawlers that arent burrowed? :cool:)

Does seem to be a matchup based on response though, which should make it more interesting :)

I suppose my problem with a starport is that I've only started feeling safe against early roaches with an early robotics facility. Whether that leads to more immortals or teching to colossi depends on the route of the game, but before I've expanded it doesnt feel like a good investment to throw down a starport on top of that. Will just end up with immortal/phoenix, and a few zealots :p


Indie said:
Yeah the cannon wall into Pheonix/FE is extreamly difficult to counter as a Zerg. the onyl way around it is a fast nydus while you break out of your main with queen and spine.. and fast hydra. but that leaves your economy trashed on one base and P has enough to pump through loads of zeals anyway. really tough to counter.

Its the same with the Terrans Hellion into Banshee. extreamly hard to counter.
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Doesnt really fit my style, but I suppose if it comes down to it i'll try a cannon wall. Can i grab you for a couple practice matches tonight? Would be nice to focus down on some PvZ :)

I never really considered speedlots vs hydras though, makes sense now that i think about it :p
 
tom91x91 said:
bvah i dont know what to buy, this or new fallout.

Whats teh single player skirmishs like? thats what i like most about RTS games.
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I'd get SC2.

I haven't done any skirmishes or multiplayer yet, but the campaign is good, each mission is pretty unique and it has lots of things that you couldn't do compared to AI skirmish.

Once I've done the campaign, I plan to give multiplayer a bash.
 
Hmmm, not sure if this would work or not, but does anyone have an All In Brutal save near to finishing? Its the last one I need for the achievement..
 
z3r0 said:
Looks like TLO's switched to Zerg. Thoughts?
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He's slightly overrated, and IMO he's a bit FOTM. When Terran is strong, play Terran. When Zerg is strong, play Zerg, Although he has said that Z suits his play style more than T, so meh.

On another note fruitdealer looks to be in very strong shape to take GSL2, but sadly the WeRRa clan is probably finished after the manager tried to molest one of the members :mad:

edit: recently i've been having a lot of success with the build Sang Ho used in the GSL the other day, 15 Nexus into dual stargate phoenix into 6 gate robo. You then push with 1/1 stalkers and immortals. The zerg player is forced to get hydralisks, and he'll have some roaches for sure, so when your stalker immortal ball hits it'll do a ton of damage since 2 base protoss > 2 base zerg and you'll be able to macro strongly. If your attacks still fail, you can fall back on a 3rd base with collosi and tech on the way.
 
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Minato said:
He's slightly overrated, and IMO he's a bit FOTM. When Terran is strong, play Terran. When Zerg is strong, play Zerg, Although he has said that Z suits his play style more than T, so meh.
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Well, I wouldn't say his overrated but I agree with the rest of your analysis. It seems like everyone's jumping onto the Zerg bandwagon after Fruitdealer showed the world how to play Zerg.

And to be honest, I have a lot of respect for players who stick with their race (IdrA etc) through the bad as well as good periods.
 
I'm sorry I wasn't clear in my earlier post. He is a very good player in terms of creativity and such but in comparison the other players in the GSL atm I don't feel he stands out in terms of overall skill. That's just me though.
 
Minato said:
He's slightly overrated, and IMO he's a bit FOTM. When Terran is strong, play Terran. When Zerg is strong, play Zerg, Although he has said that Z suits his play style more than T, so meh.
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Kind of agree here. He's a very, very good player. But I'm not sure he's a 'great' player. At least not when you compare to the best Koreans, or even Idra.

He just doesn't have the fundamental mechanics the hardcore ex sc1 players have.

He may acquire that level of skill, but yeah, I do think he's a bit overrated. I wouldn't go so far to say he's flavour of the month. But as SC2 becomes more standardised I think he's start to come up against players with better mechanics even if not game sense. And in that scenario the player that is the better executor will win.
 
Starting today. I am going to watch more pro's.

Oh and stop being lazy with my builds ^^

EDIT: are there any Zerg players on here in Diamond, i really could use some games this week before my tournament games..

got a 1.7k Zerg player to go up against and after my performance on ladder i don't think im good enough!
 
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Thanks to Alex for the game last night.

Dude, how the **** did you have like 5 expansions up when i had just completed my first! LoL.

There was me banging away, 1s, 2ddaa, 3d; thinking I had a nice wee MMM + G ball to do some damage and hey presto, 1 billion stalkers and zealots trundle in and smash my pasty.

So much to learn.....
 
Does anybody know of any other tours that i can participate in... actually thinking about taking the game a bit more seriously.

i only really know of Craftcup and any of the stuff ocuk does, are there any other tours/leagues/clans on the go?
 
Indie said:
Does anybody know of any other tours that i can participate in... actually thinking about taking the game a bit more seriously.

i only really know of Craftcup and any of the stuff ocuk does, are there any other tours/leagues/clans on the go?
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Indie, TeamLiquid have a tournament tracker:

http://www.teamliquid.net/tournaments/

Probably worth checking there if you haven't already.
 
HummuH1 said:
Indie, TeamLiquid have a tournament tracker:

http://www.teamliquid.net/tournaments/

Probably worth checking there if you haven't already.
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Didn't know about this, i rarely use TL though to be fair, its very elitist there, especially towards newer players. Stuff like that frustrates me.

HOWEVER i shall steal their tournament tracker! :D cheers dude

Minato said:
take a look at Insomnia 41. It's a thermaltake cup I just saw in the tl tournament section
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Was thinking of i41, but don't you have to pay a daft amount of money for a ticket? don't really know anything about these big LAN events, never been to one.
 
Indie said:
Didn't know about this, i rarely use TL though to be fair, its very elitist there, especially towards newer players. Stuff like that frustrates me.

HOWEVER i shall steal their tournament tracker! :D cheers dude



Was thinking of i41, but don't you have to pay a daft amount of money for a ticket? don't really know anything about these big LAN events, never been to one.
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It is elitist, that's the nature of the site. However just because you're new they won't shun you. If you make good posts you'll be respected, which isn't so bad I guess. They only really call out the new guys who post stupid crap, especially when they make fun of Broodwar.
 
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