That damn london Photoshoot :-)

edgedemon · 2 Nov 2010 at 20:04

DB_SamX said:
I too will recommend saving another £50-£100 and investing in a 2nd hand D40/60 or Canon equivalent. You'll only regreat buying the Pentax and then not having the scope for expansion you desire a few months down the line. My D40 has served me well as a beginner for 2 years, and I doubt I would sell it for more than £150-200 when I finally get round to buying a D90.

Having said that, kudos to you for joining us with your p&s on Saturday. I personally find using them (for work) these days very limiting and hence frustrating.

Why are Pentax not as expandable - I presumed that being a camera manufacturer, there would be enough lenses out there and Pentax are still releasing cameras, so if I liked it, there would be an upgrade path?

As for the point and shoot, yeah it was a bit lacking, but I did get a couple of shots I like..

twe said:
I have upgraded to a new Sony NEX-5 so am selling my Sony Alpha A100, will stick it on ebay tonight hopefully including the whole kit and zoom lens.

OK, am I being a snob? Im wary of buying any camera from a company whose core business isn't camera's? Is this wrong? What are the lenses for Sony like? Should I be considering them?

As for returning the S95, I want to keep it as then I know I will always have a camera on me, I know that there is no way I would carry a dslr around all the time..

edit - there is a nikon d40 for 150 on the bay, but body/charger/memory card only - no lens...

Mark A · 2 Nov 2010 at 20:09

I'm sure I saw a D40 with kit lens go for £200 in the members market a few months back. That would be a great camera to start on if you can get it in your budget.

I'm not sure about Pentax lenses being cheaper than Nikon/canon but you can buy third party lenses which are generally cheaper.

AtticusFinch · 2 Nov 2010 at 20:19

I think it's the case that you can use any k-mount pentax lens on their dslrs which means that you have masses of options (both af and manual) that can be picked up cheap.

The Pentax cameras are very good generally, there are are fewer users of them and professional tend to use canon or nikon which have a much greater market share.

Go and hav e a look and a fiddle before you decide on anything.

Raymond Lin · 2 Nov 2010 at 20:27

edgedemon said:
Why are Pentax not as expandable - I presumed that being a camera manufacturer, there would be enough lenses out there and Pentax are still releasing cameras, so if I liked it, there would be an upgrade path?

I haven't done any reading about it of late, but my understanding is that Pentax equivalent of Canon or Nikon variant cost more, quite a lot more! Same with Sony to some degree.

It will cost you more to get into Canon or Nikon, but over the years, it will save you hundreds in the long run.

SoundsGood · 2 Nov 2010 at 20:32

I got a D60 + Kit lens, bag, memory card for 200inc, keep looking

AtticusFinch · 2 Nov 2010 at 20:48

Before you buy anything, try the bodies hold them for size, feel and weight. They layout of the camera makes differences to different people.

mrthingyx · 2 Nov 2010 at 21:04

The advice given so far (300D and a cheap lens) is pretty good.

I'd save up for a Canon 20D and 50mm f1.8 prime.

Awesome camera for the money (much like a Nikon D..? Sorry - don't do Nikon) and the 50mm will do pretty much everything you need apart from (obviously) landscape and telephoto work.

Body will cost £150-ish, lens about £50-60 depending.

A bit out your budget range, but worth it for the additional ergonomics of a **D body. ***Ds are just horrible (to me) by comparison.

In my opinion, film SLRs are useful creative tools if used by those with the patience to use them properly. Yes, they'll make the photographer think a lot more carefully about their shots, but waiting X amount of days just to find out that all 36 exposures were out, whilst being fleeced for £5 gets a bit depressing after a very short time.

edgedemon · 2 Nov 2010 at 21:23

mrthingyx said:
The advice given so far (300D and a cheap lens) is pretty good.

I'd save up for a Canon 20D and 50mm f1.8 prime.

Awesome camera for the money (much like a Nikon D..? Sorry - don't do Nikon) and the 50mm will do pretty much everything you need apart from (obviously) landscape and telephoto work.

Body will cost £150-ish, lens about £50-60 depending.

A bit out your budget range, but worth it for the additional ergonomics of a **D body. ***Ds are just horrible (to me) by comparison.

In my opinion, film SLRs are useful creative tools if used by those with the patience to use them properly. Yes, they'll make the photographer think a lot more carefully about their shots, but waiting X amount of days just to find out that all 36 exposures were out, whilst being fleeced for £5 gets a bit depressing after a very short time.

agree about the film bit..
Im currently having a look at all the models suggested, though I do want to say that whatever I buy is not a keeper, just a stop gap so I can learn, and play around with various techniques in some of the books I have read.
The pentax appealed because of the price and the lenses on the bay are really cheap.

Im wary of saving up and splashing out too much as Im sure that what I want in a years time will not be the same as what Im buying now.
Im in training

and Im one of the few people who has never even opened photoshop :eek:

Gaffer · 2 Nov 2010 at 21:25

I'm having a different thought:

Buy a cheap, used DSLR.

You want these features:

- Whatever lens it comes with. Likely to be a middle-of the road kit zoom.
- Aperture priority mode. They all have this.
- Shutter priority mode. They all have this.
- Bigger resolution than the screen of your laptop. They all have this.
- Ability to shoot in raw. They all have this.

That's what you need to get started. So you can go cheap. You don't care if it is an unfashonable make. You don't really care about autofocus either. Praktika and a manual lens will do.

Make sure it is cheap.

As soon as you've got it. WRITE OFF the money you spent.

Now play with the camera. Learn the basics. More importantly, learn whether you want to do more of this. Learn what type of photography you want to do. Learn how to work with RAW.

Then, next year, when you know what you want, when you know what you want to shoot, when you have something to comare to... Then go out and get a decent camera.

With a bit of luck and a following wind you'll sell the old one for what you paid for it.

Andrew

edgedemon · 2 Nov 2010 at 21:58

Thanks gaffer

Pentax 100D it is then

mrthingyx · 2 Nov 2010 at 22:10

edgedemon said:
Im wary of saving up and splashing out too much as Im sure that what I want in a years time will not be the same as what Im buying now.
Im in training and Im one of the few people who has never even opened photoshop

Your choice, but I think - once having used a better combination (for just a bit more money) - you'll have wished for something else in retrospect.

Just my opinion, mind.

edgedemon · 2 Nov 2010 at 22:23

mrthingyx said:
Your choice, but I think - once having used a better combination (for just a bit more money) - you'll have wished for something else in retrospect.

Just my opinion, mind.

you might well be right, but for the sake of 100-150 quid and cheap manual focus lenses, I stand a good chance of getting more of what I want when I do upgrade...
DSLR's are too new for me at the moment, Im happy to write off 100 quid, and learn what suits me or even what I like taking photo's off, and the cheap lens means a lot - this is for learning what I can do and what I might want in the future

Mr Jones · 2 Nov 2010 at 23:21

Honestly, after that quick conversation we had during the meet, I think you'll be better at using the compact first. Yes it's limited, but the compact size (you'll be carrying your camera more often than a DSLR) and manual control is a good way to learn and understand before you hit the big guns when you've got a bigger budget?

Just a suggestion

mrthingyx · 3 Nov 2010 at 05:27

Mr Jones said:
Honestly, after that quick conversation we had during the meet, I think you'll be better at using the compact first. Yes it's limited, but the compact size (you'll be carrying your camera more often than a DSLR) and manual control is a good way to learn and understand before you hit the big guns when you've got a bigger budget?

Just a suggestion

Also a very good point - I wasn't at the meet so can't comment.

Although, I carry my DSLR around more often than my P&S (even my wife prefers the DSLR)...

edgedemon · 3 Nov 2010 at 05:55

Mr Jones said:
Honestly, after that quick conversation we had during the meet, I think you'll be better at using the compact first. Yes it's limited, but the compact size (you'll be carrying your camera more often than a DSLR) and manual control is a good way to learn and understand before you hit the big guns when you've got a bigger budget?

Just a suggestion

You and Gaffer are both spot on.
The point and shoot will get carried around, but to play around with DoF, the p&s isn't really going to help me, on my firt day using manual I already hit limitations. That was a good thing, it meant that I understood some of the stuff I had been reading previously, and was learning.
Im setting myself a budget of 100 and will just pick something old and cheap, but the capability to play with. I already have some shots that I want to try that I know I won't get with my p&s, and a cheap dslr will do fine for that sort of experimenting.
In the meantime, I will still use the s95, I was out last night trying some shots on the way home, so I will use both to learn...