Is Santa a mini religion for kids?

BunnyKillBot said:
Symbols of Paganism and Christianity? I challenge thee to find even a single example of a religion that claims the modern day Santa Clause as its own.

Though the origins of St Nic may or may not be in Christianity i assure you the commercialised fun fest we know and love as Santa Clause's christmas has no affiliation with Christianity whatsoever. Christmas to the Christian is about the birth of Christ. Whether or not a parent buys into the 'moral message' of santa clause is each to their own.
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Oh dear. Just a quick read of the wiki page on santa shows just how wrong you are.

Santa, St Nicholas, Father Christmas or whatever you wish to called him has his origins in early pagan and christian symbolism. The commercialisation of christmas is a separate issue.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Claus?wasRedirected=true
 
bloodline76 said:
Fixed your fix
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1in_god_we_trust.jpg


Both are adequate fixes.

Santa is a bit of fun, organised religion is an effective form of control/influence. Religion on an individual level is a philosophy (way of thinking) of the world to the individual, arguably inferior to the scientific method.
 
vonhelmet said:
OK... I'll temper what I said slightly... Either your logical and philosophical skills are not up to much, or you're deliberately antagonistic, or both.

I could go on, but it would be a waste of time, and Castiel and Dolph must be busy anyway so I'd be left handling this on my own which I can't be arsed with.
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I've been a little sick with 'flu but I don't think that Rypt needs to be told yet again the fallacy of what he states. Next time he quotes Pirsig however, just point out that Pirsig was a bone fide madman and had the committal papers to prove it....;)
 
There is no fallacy in stating that belief in god is no different to belief in the tooth fairy, both have no proof of their existence
 
rypt said:
Not really, there is no scientifically accepted fact/theory or anything similar to do with God existing, as such it is safe to say that he does not exist... and since he does not exist, believing in an imaginary being is a delusion

Do I need to quote Pirsig again?
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The same can be said for the evolution delusion.
 
kedge said:
The same can be said for the evolution delusion.
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No it couldn't. There is absolutely bucketfuls of scientific evidence for evolution. It is an incredibly well evidenced scientific theory. We get that you don't believe in it and that it contradicts your particular Christian faith. However as far as science goes, it is pretty secure.
 
Err, evolution does have scientific theory behind it ... or have you missed Darwin .. or the genetic mapping we have done since then?
 
rypt said:
There is no fallacy in stating that belief in god is no different to belief in the tooth fairy, both have no proof of their existence
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The fallacy was in stating that because science has no accepted theory or proof of God, he doesn't exist.

That is a false statement. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence and as such your belief that God doesn't exist is no different to a theists belief he does. You simply base your respective faith on evidence neither group would except from the other.
 
If you are being incredibly pedantic then the only position to take is agnosticism. You can be quite safe that non of the major religions are 'correct'. There is no evidence for god in the same way that there is no evidence for plenty of ridiculous and meaningless statements. Using god to explain the existence of the universe results in an infinite regression of explanations (who created the creator ad infinitum), an omnipotent being simply isn't necessary to explain our existence.


Santa is a delusion that children eventually discover is a bit of fun, books of religion are delusions that some literal believers never grow out of.
 
bloodline76 said:
When we want young kids to behave at Christmas we tell them that if they are naughty then they will be put on the naughty list and if they are good they will be rewarded with presents by santa.

We do this knowing that there is no such person as Santa yet we are willing to use this as a way of controlling our kids. And it works.

Is this any different to religion?
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I can remember as a child the joy of Christmas and Santa. I tell that lie to my children not to control them but to share with them some of the joy I had as a child. Naughty list is part of the scam and no it not like religion. If anything it shows religion as a complex lie. We learn as children when we discover there is no Santa that some lies can be complex and long running, religion is right on the firing line as its closely tied to Santa and in turn Christ.
 
Castiel said:
The fallacy was in stating that because science has no accepted theory or proof of God, he doesn't exist.

That is a false statement. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence and as such your belief that God doesn't exist is no different to a theists belief he does. You simply base your respective faith on evidence neither group would except from the other.
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I said there is no evidence that he does exist, in fact we have plenty of evidence that events did not unfold as in the bible, and that god does not exist
 
rypt said:
I said there is no evidence that he does exist, in fact we have plenty of evidence that events did not unfold as in the bible, and that god does not exist
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Go for it, what scientific evidence do we have that God categorically doesn't exist?

Let's be clear, God is somewhat a larger concept than any biblical interpretation. Also evidence that God exists is entirely subjective, someone with faith would say that there is evidence everywhere of God, just because you may not accept that evidence doesn't mean a whole lot.

But as you are coming at this from a scientific viewpoint (always a foolish thing when discussing faith), you go ahead a show me the scientific evidence that God doesn't exist. As an agnostic I'd like something concrete with peer reviewed evidence to base an informed decision on...
 
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Castiel said:
But as you are coming at this from a scientific viewpoint (always a foolish thing when discussing faith), you go ahead a show me the scientific evidence that God doesn't exist.
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Um, it is the other way round. The church needs to show evidence that God exists
 
rypt said:
Um, it is the other way round. The church needs to show evidence that God exists
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The church gives evidence based in faith, which it and its followers accept.

You stated that God doesnt exist, you made a specific statement and then said that there is plenty of evidence to back that up scientifically....

Go on then....
 
rypt said:
Evidence based on faith is not evidence, evidence HAS to be based on science
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To be pedantic here. It is not scientific evidence, that doesn't however mean it isn't evidence. I have no scientific evidence that my wife or my daughter love me, however I certainly believe that they do and can produce evidence that they do.

The problem you always seem to ignore is that science has no test for God and so therefore has nothing to say on the question of God. Stop trying to use science for something it isn't designed to do.
 
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