95% or so is possible on the slow charge with Lithium cells.
Ive already mentioned the Volt example in this thread. 12.4 in for 10.9 to the pack, I guess thats on 110V supply so theres extra conversion losses from the bigger voltage jump but thats 88%.
Thanks for the numbers.
A UK plug is up to 13A from the ring, not sure why you keep mentioning it as some sort of limit for a home supply?
Because people are talking in terms of plugging the car in as a standard appliance in a standard socket.
I've also said that you can get higher power charging stations fitted in your garage for a few thousand pounds. I've seen up to 12KW advertised as possible, which would charge 4 times faster than a standard plug socket.
Also I have no idea why you seems suprised at Nissan and Tesla quoting 100k miles.
Because I was thinking that having double the storage capacity would have an effect on the lifespan of the battery under the same conditions.
They both have potentially the same peak C discharge, the drive life predictions would be based on a similar number of miles a year and hence calender life issue of the pack is the same. The Tesla of course should see less high DoD cycles due to its larger range but Nissan probably has a more robust chemistry at the expense of energy density, hence not requiring liquid cooling.
That makes sense to me. Again, thanks for the explanation.
i had seen £7k cited as the Leaf pack replacement cost at the moment.
Have you seen any explanation as to how they got the cost of batteries down so much lower than other companies?
Should come down as its a pretty elegant little module they use and Renault/Nissan are aiming for 500,000 EVs a year within years.
Come down, probably, but by how much?
Some cost comparisons...
On the one hand, the Leaf. I'll even use your much lower figure for the cost of the battery.
On the other, a small, efficient petrol car.
The Leaf, including regenerative braking, does about 4 miles per KWh. Going on 11p per KWh, which is about average for domestic electricity, that's about 2.75p per mile.
A small, efficient petrol car can get 55mpg. 1 gallon is 4.55 litres, so that's 12.1 miles per litre. The actual cost of a litre of petrol in the UK is about 46p including delivery costs and the profit for the retailer, so that's an actual cost of 3.8p per mile.
Add 7p per mile for your low cost for the battery and you get 9.75p per mile for the Leaf.
EVs are only temporarily cheaper to run because the government temporarily doesn't tax running them. That will last only as long as EVs are extremely rare.
Even if you add the massive tax on petrol and pretend that the government will be content to simply lose all that tax revenue if people switch to EVs (like that would happen), the cost of petrol plus the huge tax is 10.4p per mile, which is still only very slightly higher than the cost of running the Leaf with the temporary lack of tax. 0.65p per mile.
Given that the Leaf is over £28,000 and a comparable small petrol car is under £10,000, the miniscule cost saving in a highly unrealistic best case scenario for the Leaf means you'd need to drive over 2.5 million miles to recoup the initial extra cost...and you'd make far more money putting it in any kind of savings scheme.
Of course, if you compare with a small, efficient diesel car instead you can't get a cost advantage with an EV at all, even in the highly unrealistic best case scenario of the government deciding that it will just lose the tax revenue it currently gets from petrol and diesel and not tax EV use at all, let alone to the same extent.
The idea that EVs have much lower running costs than ICE vehicles is just plain wrong. The numbers don't come anywhere near close to vaguely being within waving distance of supporting that argument.
