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Peugeot 607
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I drove a 607 and was amazed by how comfortable it was. Handling was average, a few of the gadgets weren't working and it was slow, but very comfortable seats and a great ride.
As another alternative choice to consider - how about the Jag S-type, cheaper than an XJ but still a great drive (although the looks are not to everyone's taste).
Saab 9-5 aero is worth considering, like the peugeot it's comfortable, full of gadgets and slightly alternative. The Saab however is much faster and handling is better if not great.
Also, with the 607 - if you're planning on keeping the car it might be worth considering a 55 plate to avoid the £400 tax.
As another alternative choice to consider - how about the Jag S-type, cheaper than an XJ but still a great drive (although the looks are not to everyone's taste).
Saab 9-5 aero is worth considering, like the peugeot it's comfortable, full of gadgets and slightly alternative. The Saab however is much faster and handling is better if not great.
Also, with the 607 - if you're planning on keeping the car it might be worth considering a 55 plate to avoid the £400 tax.
Golfs do not yet weigh 1700kg, though I wouldn't be surprised to see the next generation cars nudging that. Not sure what Golfs have got to do with anything though?
The Peugeot 607 Executive Tip Auto has a kerb weight of 1710kg. The one the OP linked to may be the standard slushbox model, which is 130kg lighter. That is one heavy transmission.
The Mk6 Golf weighs less than the Mk5 Golf. If you think they'll increase the Mk7 weight by nearly 400Kg, I'd like some of what you're smoking
Google says a MK5 GTI weighs in at ~1400kg
There are bigger engines than the gti, but a google says that they are just shy of 1700 - must be my memory!
Point was that they are not that heavy.
Is the general consensus that an ex-lease mondeo at an auction may be a better buy?
I have looked at a Saab and S-type and they do seem to be quite dated inside by comparison, the Jag is rwd which does appeal but I would have to find a v8 to get a bargain.
Not found anything else that has less subjective flaws and was hoping for the help from some of the knowledge on here.
![[TW]Fox](/data/man-of-honor/2009.png){kind=avatar}
Google doesnt tell you that at all. Even a 5 door DSG Golf R32 - with a heavy gearbox and a huge 3.2 V6 engine - weighs just 1538kg.
Point was wrong - they are pretty heavy. It is infact almost 200kg heavier than a 57 plate 3 litre BMW 5 Series!
For reference the Jaguar XJ6 weighs about 1600kg, seriously, it's so light because the entire body is made of aluminium, this gives it better performance, better handling and better fuel economy than you might imagine given it's dimensions. The XJ8, which is the V8 version of course, weighs a little more, as does the diesel. The smaller S-Type is actually heavier, as is that Peugeot.
Going off point as usual, but wiki and other sites says 1,617 kg for a mk5. I owned 520d and 530d and recall that they were much heavier that circa 1500kg so unless the petrol is much lighter you must be talking about the car launched last year with its modern eco innovations. I would argue that the lighter 5 series is a lower class of and smaller car - the 607 is lighter than similar sized a8, 7, s-class, phaeton etc. It is of course much heavier than a boogo mondeo.
I stand by the point that it isnt OMG heavy, but think what you want on that and lets get back to talking about shocking depreciation and how the electrics will fry before the morning!
I stand by the point that it isnt OMG heavy, but think what you want on that and lets get back to talking about shocking depreciation and how the electrics will fry before the morning!
The A8, 7 series, XJ, S Class and LS4** are all larger cars and in a totally different league to the Peogeot 607.
The Peugeot size wise is a little larger than a 5 series (I just checked it's dimensions, I thought they were bit smaller to be honest, but they are indeed a bit bigger), it's an odd one really though as in most respects I would consider it to be in a 'lower' class, sort of like the Vauxhall Omega was, despite being slightly larger in size and heavier.
You say the S-Type looks a little dated inside, which is true, I can't disagree with that at all, the interior dates from 2002 ...the 1999-2002 cars had a totally different interior ...now that 'really' is dated
...however so is the 607's ...but the Jag doesn't look or feel 'cheap' inside like the big Pug does, I think the 607 is comfortable, well equiped and well laid out ...but the actual quality feel and design of the interior isn't even a match for an E46 3 series imo ...let alone the more expensive stuff, it's a few rungs down the ladder from a 5 series or an S-Type in my humble opinion. Mind you, the pre facelift E60 5 series, which ran to 2005 I think, or maybe it was 2006 I forget now, wasn't exactly brilliant inside either ..compared to the E39 it replaced, which although more basic was far better built and finished inside.
The Peugeot size wise is a little larger than a 5 series (I just checked it's dimensions, I thought they were bit smaller to be honest, but they are indeed a bit bigger), it's an odd one really though as in most respects I would consider it to be in a 'lower' class, sort of like the Vauxhall Omega was, despite being slightly larger in size and heavier.
You say the S-Type looks a little dated inside, which is true, I can't disagree with that at all, the interior dates from 2002 ...the 1999-2002 cars had a totally different interior ...now that 'really' is dated
...however so is the 607's ...but the Jag doesn't look or feel 'cheap' inside like the big Pug does, I think the 607 is comfortable, well equiped and well laid out ...but the actual quality feel and design of the interior isn't even a match for an E46 3 series imo ...let alone the more expensive stuff, it's a few rungs down the ladder from a 5 series or an S-Type in my humble opinion. Mind you, the pre facelift E60 5 series, which ran to 2005 I think, or maybe it was 2006 I forget now, wasn't exactly brilliant inside either ..compared to the E39 it replaced, which although more basic was far better built and finished inside.
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Agree Moeks, thats why its so cheap to buy it doesnt have the badge - hence the phaeton comparison. Id also say that the XJ and lexus (and even the a8) sit below the others in the pecking order. In terms of size and refinement it is much bigger and improved on my old 5 and on par with the 7 and s-class.
Hehe you reckon an XJ sits bellow a 7 series in refinement ? ...having rather a lot of experience of both, I can tell you that is not true at all. The only one that can actually match it for pure waft and quietness and absolute refinement is the S class, followed up but the Lexus, the reason I put the Lexus down a notch isn't so much because it doesn't ride as well or smoothly or isn't as quiet, it is ...it's because it has door locks straight out of a Toyota and I just can't get over that
...then again the Jag has rather Ford like switchgear to be fair ...The 7 series and the A8 both fall short in this regard as both try to be more sporty ...the Phaeton is probably a match but I don't have any personal experience with that one to call up on really so I don't know for sure. I think the best inside for quality is actually the A8, although the previous model A8 is the worst for refinement, having said that, saying it's the worst is like saying you're the dumbest person in Mensa, you still need to be pretty darn smart to get there at all.
Really, with the luxury cars, there are two slightly different approaches. Mercedes, Jaguar and Lexus take the super waft factor approach where BMW and Audi take a more sporting approach. Now this works well with the smaller executive cars, but really I think with the full sized luxury saloons, trying to make them 'sporty' really just ends up with those cars having a less comfortable ride than those that do not take the 'sporting' approach. You aren't going to make a car like that particulary sporty, and people tend to buy them with absolute comfort in mind. Hence the best selling luxury car in the world, is the S class, not the 7 series (this probably has an awful lot to do with market penetration too, BMW have only recently started making inroads into the Asian markets where as Mercedes have been there as long as anyone can remember).
Having said that, the new Jaguar XJ actually outsold the S Class by 38 percent and the BMW 7-Series by 70 percent in it's first month of production in the UK.
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That's entirely subjective though really, personally I wouldn't for a second say a big Jag sits bellow anything German in the 'pecking' order (Maybach excepted I suppose, but we have Rolls Royce and Bentley for that). You might say I'm only saying that because I have one, which is fair enough I suppose, although I must point out, I could have bought a 7 series or an S class if I had wanted too (then again I don't buy based on pecking order, I buy what I like the best). But I really do think otherwise, maybe it's because I've been around them all my life and they have always been the 'de-facto' luxury' saloon to me ...but really, the Germans don't have anything on them. And the new one has just raised the bar for the Germans again ...although I think it lost it's looks in the process, but then it's not like a 7 series or an S-Class are better looking, even though the Jag has become less good looking, it's still a fine looking machine.
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A Mk5 Golf does NOT weigh 1617kg! Even my E39 doesnt weigh that. Are you getting confused with the maximum GROSS weight?
You use kerb weight to measure a cars weight!
No, I am talking about the E60. I have the E60's brochure right here.
would argue that the lighter 5 series is a lower class of and smaller car - the 607 is lighter than similar sized a8, 7, s-class, phaeton etc. It is of course much heavier than a boogo mondeo.
A lower class of car, lol. The 607 is not a 7 Series type of car at all.
i was only going by wikipedia and my own hazy memory.
its no 7/sclass in terms of prestige but it is the same size outside and is closer than to the 7 than the 5. you criticised someone for not comparing like for like and then repeated the mistake yourself.
its no 7/sclass in terms of prestige but it is the same size outside and is closer than to the 7 than the 5. you criticised someone for not comparing like for like and then repeated the mistake yourself.
its no 7/sclass in terms of prestige but it is the same size outside and is closer than to the 7 than the 5. you criticised someone for not comparing like for like and then repeated the mistake yourself.
You are not going to get me to agree that a 607 is like a 7 Series, sorry.
Look at the engine range, available options, etc etc - it's not a 7 Series type of car. They do a 4 cylinder diesel!
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Skoda superb is a rival to the Phaeton donchaknow, they all have 4 wheels and stuff....
Wiki an expert does not make....
Wiki an expert does not make....
[TW]Fox;18527705 said:
you were wrong to compare its size to a 5, its closer to the class above in terms of size that was my point. if your going to make lazy comparisons, why bother.
in terms of refinement, its a better cruiser than a 7 sport - not that is a great measure!
Says the guy who has been posting complete rubbish about the weight of a Golf seemingly all evening?
407 Executive 4902mm
Mercedes E350 Avantgarde 4856mm
So it's actually a whole 4.6cm longer (Clue: Thats so little you'd not even notice it) than a Mercedes E Class, which is indisputably in the same class as a 5 Series. The 607 even has a 2 litre petrol 4 pot petrol in the range as well as a 110bhp diesel. Cars with 110bhp diesel engines do not, have not, and never will be in the same class as something like an S Class where not a single engine smaller than 3 litres is offered. By contrast 3 litres is the largest engine in the 607 - there is very very little overlap at all between these two very different cars.
It is not a 7 Series/S Class class car.
You don't place a car in a class purely by length anyway otherwise a 206 SW and a Lotus Elise are suddenly in the same class
You have to look at other factors as well such as intended market, equipment levels and available options, engine ranges, pricing, etc.
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